LX7 in camera adjustment

Started Feb 5, 2013 | Discussions
xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
LX7 in camera adjustment

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

Thanks a lot.

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX7
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James Pilcher Veteran Member • Posts: 9,474
I have no idea what you are talking about

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

You mention "the picture" that came from it. Really? One photo and you are disappointed?

The LX7 is a fine camera. Very fine. If the images are not good enough, it's the photographer that is not good enough. Like any fine instrument, it can take some time and skill to master it.

Use iAuto and get (overly) punchy shots from the beginning. I tend to shoot raw exclusively and use Huelight's camera profiles as my starting point.







Jim Pilcher

Summit County, Colorado, USA

 James Pilcher's gear list:James Pilcher's gear list
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privateman
privateman Contributing Member • Posts: 702
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

There are many things that can happen to make you shoot bad photos.

But an easy way of trying to get better results is to look at the photos in this forum and see what were the settings in the shots you like.

I am very happy with the LX7 results right out of the box, I've posted some of them here some days ago, with only a couple hundreds shots so far with that camera. Most of them were shot in P mode, either AutoISO or manual ISO and AWB. The only non-standard settings were a bit shifting of saturation and contrast and lowering noise reduction. But that's only finetuning for personal jpeg taste, without much testing.

My impression is that you can get wonderful results with standard settings. But I am sure if you post some of your pics you will get helpful tips how to improve your results.

You do not write what you think of all the LX7 shots here in the forum, don't you like them either?

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Panasonic FZ1000 Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX7
Veducci Senior Member • Posts: 1,102
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

Thanks a lot.

Post that picture you didn`t like and I bet someone here will tell you what you did wrong.

You don`t  actually believe it was the camera do you?

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Fujifilm XF1 Samsung Galaxy S6
sigala1 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,820
You didn't do anything wrong

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

Thanks a lot.

I agree about the LX7 jpegs, and I have no idea how to improve them because I shoot raw, and the photos look just fine if you use ACR and add a little contrast and vibrance over the default values. And usually, you need to add a little yellow and magenta to the camera-recommended color balance. Anyway, regardless of brand, one should always take the camera-recommended color balance as only a starting point and not the Gospel.

teddoman
teddoman Senior Member • Posts: 2,483
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment
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Cyril Catt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,772
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

Richard, are you writing about the picture you see on the camera's LCD, the picture you see on a computer screen, or the picture you have printed out? Could you post an example?

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Cyril

OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

Guys,please don't get me wrong. I've been using the camera long enough to know if the photo is bad it's not the camera's fault. What I'm asking is just like what's in this thread:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50451347

only more specific, what are the settings in the WB and picture control that works for you.

Many ask for samples, here is a comparison:



LX7



IPHONE5



D800

Sorry for the rotation, it looks fine when it's in the gallary. Don't know what happened here. First time photo posting.....

You can instantly notice the WB shift to lower temperature color (blue) and a tint of green for the LX7. The iphone acturally get the WB right if you look at the white background but I like the D800's color better because is more natural. The enviroment light is kinda warm to my eyes plus it's using the vivid camera prolifle. BTW so does the LX7.

Do you also noticed the seems to be lower comtrast on the LX7 photo that "flatten" the picture?

I love how the texture is presented in the LX7. That's the potential I'm talking about if we can ge the color settings right. Afterall it's a Leica lens.

I didn't post this comparison because I'm not trying to compare a DC to DSLR or phone. I would not buy one if I didn't expect some difference. But this color thing really gets to me.....

PS. don't mind the low sharpness on the D800 photo, guess I just compressed too much when I upload.



OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

xjf123richard wrote:

Guys,please don't get me wrong. I've been using the camera long enough to know if the photo is bad it's not the camera's fault. What I'm asking is just like what's in this thread:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50451347

only more specific, what are the settings in the WB and picture control that works for you.

Many ask for samples, here is a comparison:



LX7



IPHONE5



D800

Sorry for the rotation, it looks fine when it's in the gallary. Don't know what happened here. First time photo posting.....

You can instantly notice the WB shift to lower temperature color (blue) and a tint of green for the LX7. The iphone acturally get the WB right if you look at the white background but I like the D800's color better because is more natural. The enviroment light is kinda warm to my eyes plus it's using the vivid camera prolifle. BTW so does the LX7.

Do you also noticed the seems to be lower comtrast on the LX7 photo that "flatten" the picture?

I love how the texture is presented in the LX7. That's the potential I'm talking about if we can ge the color settings right. Afterall it's a Leica lens.

I didn't post this comparison because I'm not trying to compare a DC to DSLR or phone. I would not buy one if I didn't expect some difference. But this color thing really gets to me.....

PS. don't mind the low sharpness on the D800 photo, guess I just compressed too much when I upload.



FYI, just found that I already shift the WB to M and a warmer CT from some previous experiments in the first shot. Still it came out like this. So please help if you have any experience with this.

OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: You didn't do anything wrong

sigala1 wrote:

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

Thanks a lot.

I agree about the LX7 jpegs, and I have no idea how to improve them because I shoot raw, and the photos look just fine if you use ACR and add a little contrast and vibrance over the default values. And usually, you need to add a little yellow and magenta to the camera-recommended color balance. Anyway, regardless of brand, one should always take the camera-recommended color balance as only a starting point and not the Gospel.

Well, thank for agreeing with the observations. Otherwise I would think it is only my camera....

I shot everything with a RAW and a jepg too, but I found the RAW from the camera is hard to adjust too. One thing is that there isn't a lot camera profile settings for LX to be loaded in ACR or LR. Second is just like you mentioned, the WB is off when out of the camera and it will be hard to adjust afterwards....

OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: I have no idea what you are talking about

James Pilcher wrote:

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

You mention "the picture" that came from it. Really? One photo and you are disappointed?

The LX7 is a fine camera. Very fine. If the images are not good enough, it's the photographer that is not good enough. Like any fine instrument, it can take some time and skill to master it.

Use iAuto and get (overly) punchy shots from the beginning. I tend to shoot raw exclusively and use Huelight's camera profiles as my starting point.







Jim Pilcher

Summit County, Colorado, USA

These are great pictures, Jim. You are a good photographer.

But there are something we do need to rely on the camera, or the post processing, like the color, contrast, WB etc.

If we leave the last picture of yours, which is in a very tight color range, all other three can be greatly improve if the camera settings are adjusted.

I believe the house in the first picture would be more vivid if the color saturation is higher and the contrast is higher.

You can add some dimension, or "distance" to the people and the birds if the contrast is higher and add some "clarity" to it if you adjust the lightness curve.

I don't believe the "dull" red on the jetski is what you observed that day when you took the third picture, shouldn't the beautiful beach site looks more colorful and has more "depth" in it?

So this is what I meant. Photographer can improve their composition, their use of light. But something is realy the camera's job. That's why people chasing different lens, cameras, sensors (or films in the past)

Again, these are good photos and thanks for the input.

OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

Cyril Catt wrote:

Richard, are you writing about the picture you see on the camera's LCD, the picture you see on a computer screen, or the picture you have printed out? Could you post an example?

It's what on the computer.

I normally don't look at the picutre itself on the LCD, only the histogram. Never trusted any camera's LCD.........

tinpusher
tinpusher Senior Member • Posts: 1,379
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

xjf123richard wrote:

. I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted.

I have a Dlux4 and an LX5 compact cameras and several Lumix m4/3 cameras the last being a G3.

For years I've been hoping that Panasonic would do something about their muddy jpeg colour rendition but they seem to have stalled and fall below companies like Fuji and Olympus.

Now I'll only look at Olympus m/3 bodies and rely on Fuji for my compacts.

You can tweak the settings a bit to jazz the image but I guess , like me, you'll never be satisfied.

Best to shoot RAW.

OP xjf123richard Forum Member • Posts: 63
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

tinpusher wrote:

xjf123richard wrote:

. I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted.

I have a Dlux4 and an LX5 compact cameras and several Lumix m4/3 cameras the last being a G3.

For years I've been hoping that Panasonic would do something about their muddy jpeg colour rendition but they seem to have stalled and fall below companies like Fuji and Olympus.

Now I'll only look at Olympus m/3 bodies and rely on Fuji for my compacts.

You can tweak the settings a bit to jazz the image but I guess , like me, you'll never be satisfied.

Best to shoot RAW.

Is it the concern that if they improved the in-camera setting somehow they would be as good as a leica...?:-)

teddoman
teddoman Senior Member • Posts: 2,483
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

Indoor shots are just harder to get right due to the unpredictable types of CFL lighting on the market now. It would be impossible for a camera manufacturer to predict what CFL bulbs you are using in your house, the temperature of the bulbs, the color spectrum of the bulbs, and how close your subject is to the bulbs when you take your shot. All of these issues will affect the WB.

Have you tried the custom WB setting on the LX7 using a white card? I find that gets me close enough, and usually a quick auto WB tuning in PP does the trick if I really want to look closely.

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Patrick Leong New Member • Posts: 14
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

I found this discussion interesting, because from what I've looked through the forum, seems like the opinions about LX7's color property cover a wide spectrum. Some, like you, considers the color as dull and inaccurate. Some in this camp decide they would use the Vivid photo style for more pop and contrast color. Others consider it as inaccurate too, but instead of dull, they say too much pop, and opt for using the Natural photo style, which has even flatter color in favor of better dynamic range. Perhaps this is personal preference?

I do consider my LX7's JPEG rather dull, but I am satisfy with it for most situations, because I think most are good enough. For working with RAW, some here suggest that using Huelight ACR profile (http://www.colorfidelity.com/) will provide a subtle but definitely better color property. I have never tried it, but for those occasions that I have to use RAW, the result produced from Lightroom 4.3 is pretty good.

My 2 cents.

Cyril Catt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,772
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment
1

Following on Patrick Leong's post, I feel there seem to be a large number of threads and comments about colour representation. It makes me wonder if this is due to differences in the models of cameras, computer monitors, printers, or simply the effect of cataracts on ageing eyes. Certainly, when I had my own cataracts replaced last year it was a revelation - our garden was no longer filled with pastel blooms, but with vibrant coloured flowers, and I don't seem to be doing so much pp work to get holiday snaps to look 'natural'. Maybe there are simply a lot of motes in the eyes of the beholders?

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Cyril

sigala1 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,820
Re: You didn't do anything wrong

xjf123richard wrote:

sigala1 wrote:

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

Thanks a lot.

I agree about the LX7 jpegs, and I have no idea how to improve them because I shoot raw, and the photos look just fine if you use ACR and add a little contrast and vibrance over the default values. And usually, you need to add a little yellow and magenta to the camera-recommended color balance. Anyway, regardless of brand, one should always take the camera-recommended color balance as only a starting point and not the Gospel.

Well, thank for agreeing with the observations. Otherwise I would think it is only my camera....

I shot everything with a RAW and a jepg too, but I found the RAW from the camera is hard to adjust too. One thing is that there isn't a lot camera profile settings for LX to be loaded in ACR or LR. Second is just like you mentioned, the WB is off when out of the camera and it will be hard to adjust afterwards....

The camera has a setting to allow you to bias the color of the automatic white balance to be more yellow and magenta. You should try it.

The camera also has a "vivid" mode, and for each mode you can adjust the saturation and contrast.

So you MIGHT be able to change the default JPEGs to be more to your liking. I feel that the color balance is definitely bad on Panasonic, but the other aspects such as contrast and saturation are more of a matter of taste than of right and wrong.

All of the BEST photos you see have probably been post-processed and did not come out of the camera that way, regardless of brand or how expensive the camera. In fact, the more expensive the camera, the more the assumption is that the photos will be shot in raw and then post-processed.

teddoman
teddoman Senior Member • Posts: 2,483
Re: I have no idea what you are talking about

James Pilcher wrote:

xjf123richard wrote:

I've stepped up from compacts to DSLRs several years ago and loved the results. These days we saw so much advances in the mobile photograph technologies and even a smart phone can take great pictures. So I thought I would give compact camera another try in exchange for convenience.

I recently purchased the LX7 after an extensive comparison within the high-end compacts for technical specs(aperture, zoom ect.). I REALLY HATE the picture came out of it. It's even worse then some of the compact camera I used 5 years ago. The pictures are under-saturated, dull, low contrast, and slightly color-shifted. I searched around and see lots of pictures taken with LX7 has similar problem -- kinda like those low resolution mid 2000s digital cameras -- even in this forum.This should not happen on this kind of sophisticated camera which were meant to be a backup for the professionals.

But I'm not giving it up yet since I know the sensor and lens are all great on this camera, and all there's missing should just be some tweaking on the WB and picture profile controls. So could you guys share some experience with me on this? Which are the settings that can give you the best results?

You mention "the picture" that came from it. Really? One photo and you are disappointed?

The LX7 is a fine camera. Very fine. If the images are not good enough, it's the photographer that is not good enough. Like any fine instrument, it can take some time and skill to master it.

Use iAuto and get (overly) punchy shots from the beginning. I tend to shoot raw exclusively and use Huelight's camera profiles as my starting point.

I'd heard Huelight mentioned a few times, and it sounded like a good idea, but I didn't really do anything about it.

But I just saw some samples of Huelight color profiles compared to the Adobe / LR default profile, and I liked what I saw, so I ordered it for the LX7. Looks like a great time saver and it's only $10. Sounds like this will help address some of the color complaints on the LX7?

 teddoman's gear list:teddoman's gear list
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elemenoP Regular Member • Posts: 229
Re: LX7 in camera adjustment

tedandtricia wrote:

Indoor shots are just harder to get right due to the unpredictable types of CFL lighting on the market now. It would be impossible for a camera manufacturer to predict what CFL bulbs you are using in your house, the temperature of the bulbs, the color spectrum of the bulbs, and how close your subject is to the bulbs when you take your shot. All of these issues will affect the WB.

Have you tried the custom WB setting on the LX7 using a white card? I find that gets me close enough, and usually a quick auto WB tuning in PP does the trick if I really want to look closely.

I am also finding the white balance challenging on the LX7. Sure, there are many different bulbs, conditions, etc., but all cameras must deal with this problem and it does seem like other cameras do a better job with that aspect. I have a Nikon D90, use AWB pretty much all the time, and most of the pictures come out good, in terms of WB. But my new LX7 has been more challenging for me, causing me to fiddle with the WB in Lightroom a lot, consider using a white card/gray card, etc. I just never thought much about WB before using this camera. And I don't think there's anything inherent in a DSLR that would make AWB better (is there?). In fact, in the example the OP posted above, to my eye the iPhone did a better job with WB than the DSLR.

And as far as color pop, remember that the colors don't pop right if the WB is off. If you can get that right, you'll see a lot more color and contrast in the photo. At least that is what I have found.

eP

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