Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

Started Jan 30, 2013 | Discussions
coder01 Junior Member • Posts: 33
Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?
1

I purchased a d7000 over the summer before a lengthy trip to Europe where I took 4000 photos.

the d7000 is a successor to d80 after the d70, in terms of dslr's I have owned.

i felt the d7000 was terrific but I (like many others I am sure long for a full size sensor).

the big question is whether the timing for a step up is right. Are people with experience with these two cameras seeing a significant difference between these two cameras ?

I am a hobbyist with a discerning eye and lucky to be able to take trips to very scenic locations. i prefer landscape and cityscape photography, particularly historic cities and buildings. Recently I have taken an interest in night photography but it is a small percentage of the photos I take. I would suspect high iso images comprise perhaps 5% of the photos I take.

then of course family photos and sports photos in swimming and tennis.

i have a 13 x 19 printer at home and have been a happy with images from the d7000 printed at that size although I have seen tables  that say 10 x 16 would be max size for 16MP .

SO, would I be blown away by the upgrade to  the full sensor and 24MP d600 or is it a small incremental change ?

From Ken Rockwells review of the d600, he notes he believes the autofocus sensor is straight from the d7000 and therefore small for the d600 viewfinder. I would imagine the d600 successor will remedy this issue. If I do not move to the d600 now I am certain it's successor will be a definite.

Nikonfan99 Senior Member • Posts: 1,411
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?
2

As the current owner of a D70/D90/D7000 and D600, I can tell you that the D600 image quality is far better in detail and dynamic range compared to the d7000. I can honestly say that I love the image quality of the d600 and each shoot I get more amazed by the quality. The down side is the lubricant and debris issue. I have had the worst of it and am now over 13,000 shots with the d600. I will also say that I see a lot more AF consistency with my d600. The d7000 seems more hit and miss when it comes to AF. I also had a lot of backfocus issues with the d7000 which I did not have on the d600. I would say that if you can wait till the lubricant issue is resolved, you will be happier. This issue can be a deal breaker for some. I wish I would have waited. The ISO range of the d600 is also amazing.

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Steve Bingham
Steve Bingham Forum Pro • Posts: 25,537
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

Well, first off I am not a KR fan. He tends to shoot from the hip a lot. Example. "Don't use a lens hood ever, but use a screw filter instead." Dumb!!!!!!!

I just sold my D7000. I absolutely loved it! Please check my web sites. In its place I bought a D600.

Now to your question. I found that I could make incredibly crisp 16" x 24" prints on my Epson 3880 by using resampling in PS CS6. Do you need bigger? I did. If not, I see no compelling reason to go with the D600. The IQ is pretty much equal as is the dynamic range. Give the D600 a slight edge in both departments.

However, here are a few serious benefits to FX:

1- FX produces images with less noise - which should not be an issue with your size prints.

2- FX can reach into higher ISOs without noticable noise. This might be a plus for you.

And a few cons:

1- Slower max shutter speed (I could care less)

2- Bigger, heavier, and more expensive lenses. Whoops. Think about this one

. . . and a couple dozen minor points.

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Steve Bingham
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www.ghost-town-photography.com

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OP coder01 Junior Member • Posts: 33
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

You dont find the 39 AF sensors to be rather cramped somewhat in the middle and less useful than they were in the d7000. As noted, Ken Rockwell feels its at least the same hardware transplanted in front of a larger sensor,  although the software may be better.

i find I often focus then recompose and shoot. Thats a holdover from 30+ years gone by when the only option was center focus.  However, when some of those outer squares light up and the camera choosing the appropriate subject without my having to center first I am impressed.  It seems like a bit if a cop out or holding back sticking a smaller focus sensor into the camera. I am confident they will change this in the successor.

is there  any news on a fix with the lubricant issue and dirt ?

the amazing detail you are seeing , is this on monitors and prints, on how small a print do u see the difference ?

thanks

OP coder01 Junior Member • Posts: 33
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

Thanks,

thats was a really terrific answer.

i am curious what those couple dozen minor points are which you listed in the cons section.

lens weight is certainly an issue.

carrying 2-3 additional FX lenses in the camera bag will make the bag much heavier on long travels, spending 12+ hours  out in the field daily with the bag strapped around my shoulder or neck.

Illumina Regular Member • Posts: 110
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?
1

I switch from D90 to D7000 and then to D600..
I love my D7000, I've taken 25k SC with it..
But if u asked me is D600 better? Yes it is better, in almost every way..
Build quality is definitely better.. People saying that build quality is the same definitely never use D600..
AF is better, I didn't have backfocus problem with my D7000, but AF in D600 is more responsive and have better accuracy in low light..
IQ in high ISO is at least 1 stop better..
Detail also better..
Mine had 3 spots at f16.. But for me it's not a big deal.. I can clone stamp it very fast in photoshop..
I think you will be happy with ur upgrade

HWengatz New Member • Posts: 2
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?
1

Hi!

I did.

coder01 wrote:

I purchased a d7000 over the summer before a lengthy trip to Europe where I took 4000 photos.

the d7000 is a successor to d80 after the d70, in terms of dslr's I have owned.

i felt the d7000 was terrific but I (like many others I am sure long for a full size sensor).

the big question is whether the timing for a step up is right. Are people with experience with these two cameras seeing a significant difference between these two cameras ?

YES! definitely! - I stepped up from a D90 to D7000 and felt the step was a minor one.

But this time... Whoaaaa! It feels like this is the camera I've been longing for, for my whole life!

It really is incredible! I love it from the moment I made the first testing shots in the shop.

I am a hobbyist with a discerning eye and lucky to be able to take trips to very scenic locations. i prefer landscape and cityscape photography, particularly historic cities and buildings. Recently I have taken an interest in night photography but it is a small percentage of the photos I take. I would suspect high iso images comprise perhaps 5% of the photos I take.

Then this camera is really great for you! The sensor has much more MP than the one in the D7000 and the Full Format Sensor add some more power in terms of lower noise.

You can really *use* shots done at ISO 6400, if you don't do too much pixel peeping.

Staying below that, just makes it better. - And, to be honest, in my analog times, ISO 400 was a "gift of the gods". Pictures taken with ISO 800 or 1600 are almost noiseless- The lower you go, the better you will get, of course.

The higher amount of MP is great for your landsacpe photographs. It simply adds Detail an contrast and even allows a softer blending from one color to another.

then of course family photos and sports photos in swimming and tennis.

Yes. No problems with that! That's something every camera should be capable of, right now.

i have a 13 x 19 printer at home and have been a happy with images from the d7000 printed at that size although I have seen tables that say 10 x 16 would be max size for 16MP .

I also have such a printer. Your problem is the resolution you pick for printing your images.

I guess you pick 1200 dpi, oder 600 dpi. - Why? 300 dpi is great for printing Photographs...

SO, would I be blown away by the upgrade to the full sensor and 24MP d600 or is it a small incremental change ?

I guess, you will be blown away, as I was! - As far as I have read, even pros have a hard time in distinguishing between the large scale printouts of a D600 and a D800. - But the difference between a D7000 and a D800 should be easily depictable in a large scale print... That would be a difference (!!!) of over 20 MP, between the two. That's more pixels difference than the D7000 has! That's like comparing an image with no pixels with one of the D7000...

So if the Pros have a hard time in distinguishing betweeen the D600 and the D800, then what does this say to you?

Pick up the D600! - In my opinion, it *really* offers the best of both worlds. - It has a full format sensor, with all its benefits. It has 24 MP, which is really much, much more than the 16, the D7000 has. It has almost the same functions as the D7000, so you will feel instantly "at home", when switching to that camera (except for 2 minor issues).

It is built far closer to professional standards, compared to the D7000, which is already very well built, too.

In my eyes, the D600 is the best camera Nikon has ever made. - Because it can do *everything*.

It is easy to handle (in case you are lazy or a beginner) and it can also deliver extreme high quality, if you take enough care.

There are some issues you must be aware of:

- All your DX Lenses are almost useless on the D600. Even though the D800 crops a DX Lens down to 16 MP, the D600 crops it down to 10 MP. - That is far less than the 16 MP you have in the D7000, right now. - And this is the reason I keep the D7000 for now. I have a bunch of DX Lenses, so the D7000 won't go. Yes, I have both cameras, right now. And I keep them both. - Which makes Holidays a "drag"... if you know what I mean.

- You should buy the D600 with a matching lens. That is either the zoom lens 16-85 they offer as a kit, or at least you should have an FX 50 mm lens. The Sensor is hungry for extremely good lenses. Do yourself a favour and get them. - But that is the issue: The FX lenses are really expensive...

- You may notice that the crop Factor is "missing". - Before the D600, you could count: "A 300 mm tele makes pictures like an 450 mm tele on an FX camera." That is very nice, if you like to use your tele quite often. You have to carry less weight. But now, this advantage is gone!

A 300 mm is a 300 mm lens! If you want to make images with about 500 mm, you'll have to buy that lens (look at the prices!), and you'll have to carry that lens, too! And that is *additionally* to your 300 mm, which you'll want to keep for now.

- And of course you'll have a little (?) benefit (?) on the other end of the lenses. An FX superwideangle lens of 12 mm will no longer be only effectively like an 18 mm, but it will be true 12 mm. - But beware! - Here the crop factors hurts the most! - A DX superwideangle with 12 mm will be cropped down to 10 MP and still have only the effect of an 18 mm FX. - That is tough! - In my case, I decided to buy me a new superwide zoom (12-24 mm) FX lens, additionally to the camera. - So I ended up with the price of the body, the kit lens and a new superwideangle zoom. - Your mileage may vary.

From Ken Rockwells review of the d600, he notes he believes the autofocus sensor is straight from the d7000 and therefore small for the d600 viewfinder. I would imagine the d600 successor will remedy this issue. If I do not move to the d600 now I am certain it's successor will be a definite.

Yes, I'm quite sure, that the AF engine and especially the sensors are from the D7000.

But who does it hurt???

When I started taking photographs, I had at first NO AF at all! Then the first AF sensors came in and all they were capable of, was focusing on one point in the center, or doing an "educated guess" (average) of the center.

With the D600 you still have (!) 39 sensors with a 3D image analysis, if you like!

I must admit, that this is somewhat centered, but if you really take your time for taking landscape and cityscape images, manual focusing is a *MUST*! And the new way to do that, is not by installing a new focusing screen into your camera, but by zooming into your liveview image on the back of your camera! THERE (and only there!) you can onsite and instantly decide, what will be sharp on your image, later.

If you feel unable to focus manually, even then you can still move tha camera a little, make the autofocus focus on whatever you like, press halfway the trigger and then move back to press it fully. - That is, what worked, when I was young and I'm quite sure that it will still do the trick...

A successor to the D600 will come up in about 2 to 3 years, I believe. - And it is not sure that it will have a different AF sensor block. - If you are bound to the larger AF sensorfield, then you should go for the D800 (and loose all other benefits the D600 has over the D800).

The benefits, the D600 has over the D800:

- The D800 is much larger, heaver, bulkier - A real drag...

- The D800 produces images that are 30% larger than the ones of the D600, but with not really much gain in image quality. This is something that will hurt you in your IT compartement. - The D600 makes images that are 30% larger than the D7000 (you will get to know that, too), but the D800 produces more than double the size of the D7000.

- You have all the drawbacks of the FX camera, which I mentioned above (no more crop factor, high price lenses, more weight, etc.)

- What you will not have: All the easy to handle scene modes will be gone. - You have to be Master of your camera at ALL times. - This is a *must*, no longer an option, then. You'll have a very different camera from your D7000.

- No builtin flash. Even though I do own an SB600, I seldom feel the need to use it, because of the builtin flash. It is sufficient in many cases for me. - With the D800 you have to drag a flash with you, at all times.

Are these drawbacks worth a wait of 2 to 3 years, because of an issue that is not a real one? And in the end, the new D600+ may still have a smaller AF-Field than the other Pro models?! - Is this really worth the wait?

I suggest, you pick up an D600 in a store close to you and just check it. I'm quite sure, you'll love it! - What also impressed me very much, is the new monitor on the back of the camera. Even though it shall have the same amount of pixels like the D7000, it is slightly larger and - in my opinion - is much better than the one of the D7000! - I have the feeling, that it is far easier to find out, whether an image is really sharp or not. I love it!

Yours,

Herbert

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Vincent O'Sullivan Regular Member • Posts: 327
D80 to D600. Does that count?

I've had the D600 less than a week, so I can't comment usefully on the photographs that come from it yet, but my first impressions on handling it were:

  • It wasn't as much bigger than the D80 as I was expecting.  Hardly at all in fact.
  • Bigger lenses was a non-issue, since all my existing seven lenses (shared with the family on their Nikons) fitted and four were FX anyway (entirely by luck).
  • The autofocus points weren't all clumped in the middle to the extent that some of the reviews seemed to imply.  (I almost always use centre point focus anyway - so that I get to choose the focus, so having the focus points extend to the edge isn't a big deal.)

Other first impressions relate more to the previous camera being a D80 than a D7000:

  • There's a "no flash" auto mode.
  • When put in remote firing mode, the camera stays in that mode and doesn't forget (like the d80 did whenever the ready mode timed out).
  • Switching between RAW and JPEG is trivial, not buried in the menus.
  • Putting the mirror up before taking a shot is trivial, too.
  • Time-lapse photography.
  • Can go above ISO 100 without everything turning to grain.
  • Pressing the shutter produces enough oil to heat my house for fifteen minutes.
tundracamper Senior Member • Posts: 1,818
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

Steve Bingham wrote:

However, here are a few serious benefits to FX:

1- FX produces images with less noise - which should not be an issue with your size prints.

2- FX can reach into higher ISOs without noticable noise. This might be a plus for you.

Those generalizations are not specific to the size of the sensor (DX vs. FX).  They are specific to the size of the pixel and the generation of the technology.  Given the same technology, a larger pixel will have less noise and be better at higher ISOs.  While  your observations my be true for "benefits to getting a newer camera," they are really not benefits of FX.  There are certainly newer DX cameras that have lower noise than some of the older FX cameras.

Steve Bingham
Steve Bingham Forum Pro • Posts: 25,537
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?
1

tundracamper wrote:

Steve Bingham wrote:

However, here are a few serious benefits to FX:

1- FX produces images with less noise - which should not be an issue with your size prints.

2- FX can reach into higher ISOs without noticable noise. This might be a plus for you.

Those generalizations are not specific to the size of the sensor (DX vs. FX). They are specific to the size of the pixel and the generation of the technology. Given the same technology, a larger pixel will have less noise and be better at higher ISOs. While your observations my be true for "benefits to getting a newer camera," they are really not benefits of FX. There are certainly newer DX cameras that have lower noise than some of the older FX cameras.

His question was very specific - D7000 vs D600. So I answered it.

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Aaron01 Regular Member • Posts: 171
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

I still have my D7000 as my backup, but I don't think I have shot one frame with it since I got my D600.  Also to let you know I did a family print for someone at 16 x 20 with my D7000 and it looked fine.

My D600 did have the spot issue, but not too bad and I wet cleaned it, I haven't checked it lately since I have just been enjoying shooting with it.  Also my D7000 had worse spots than my D600, but over more time too, to be fair.

D600 far more accurate and consistent with the auto focus, my D7000 is a bit hit or miss and I had to fine tune almost every lens.  The D600 proved to me that my lens's and I were not to blame.

Despite the shortcomings I really like my D7000, but I love the D600.  I won't go on about all the D600 does better as I pretty much agree with what has already been wrote about IQ and such.

Kelly M Jones Contributing Member • Posts: 707
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

Nikonfan99 wrote:

As the current owner of a D70/D90/D7000 and D600, I can tell you that the D600 image quality is far better in detail and dynamic range compared to the d7000. I can honestly say that I love the image quality of the d600 and each shoot I get more amazed by the quality. The down side is the lubricant and debris issue. I have had the worst of it and am now over 13,000 shots with the d600. I will also say that I see a lot more AF consistency with my d600. The d7000 seems more hit and miss when it comes to AF. I also had a lot of backfocus issues with the d7000 which I did not have on the d600. I would say that if you can wait till the lubricant issue is resolved, you will be happier. This issue can be a deal breaker for some. I wish I would have waited. The ISO range of the d600 is also amazing.

You echo my experiences exactly with my D7000 and D600.

obbc New Member • Posts: 2
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

- No builtin flash. Even though I do own an SB600, I seldom feel the need to use it, because of the builtin flash. It is sufficient in many cases for me. - With the D800 you have to drag a flash with you, at all times.

I guess I got one of the rare D800's that includes the built-in flash.  

HWengatz New Member • Posts: 2
Re: Has anyone changed from d7000 to d600, thoughts ?

obbc wrote:

- No builtin flash. Even though I do own an SB600, I seldom feel the need to use it, because of the builtin flash. It is sufficient in many cases for me. - With the D800 you have to drag a flash with you, at all times.

I guess I got one of the rare D800's that includes the built-in flash.

ooops. Sorry, my fault! I was absolutely sure that there is no Nikon "Pro" camera with a builtin flash. OK,, so now I 've learned something, too. Fine.

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