Some pointless discussions lately Locked

Started Jan 27, 2013 | Discussions
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vkphoto
vkphoto Senior Member • Posts: 1,632
Some pointless discussions lately

It is just my opinion only but, for what it’s worth,  I’d like to share it with you.

Lately I see a lot of threads where same frustrations are shared again and again.

Replace *** with “will sell it” or “am not buying it”.

“Because Fuji X is not up to professional standards I ***”

“Because Fuji X raw files conversion doesn’t exist  I  ***”

“Because Fuji X is not on display in my local shop I ***”

“My other XYZ camera is so phenomenal, so I ***”

Or simple questions such as “What raw converter to use?”, “Will lens XYZ work with camera XYZ?” etc. are asked regardless that forum search is readily available.

Question to forum mods, is it possible to create “sticky notes” in the forum? At least two of them.

One, let’s call it something like “Fuji X in the world of professional photography”, will link to excellent galleries created by DaveKaiPiper,  chris24net, mike kobal and many other professional photographers here. It would be a great inspiration to new (and not so) Fuji X users.

Another one “Processing tips and techniques” will  offer member’s  wisdom how to use ACR, Silkypix, RPP and many other excellent  tools.

It may help to reduce the number of silly debates and allow productive members to focus on constructive discussions.

Thanks,

vkphoto

autoy Forum Member • Posts: 58
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

I like this idea but I don't really mind all the topics beign in the same forum. I'd take a harder mod line, closing duplicate topics, deleting troll posts and all that.

 autoy's gear list:autoy's gear list
Fujifilm X-E1 Fujifilm XF 35mm F1.4 R Fujifilm XF 18-55mm F2.8-4 R LM OIS
bestbyte Regular Member • Posts: 155
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

vkphoto wrote:

It is just my opinion only but, for what it’s worth, I’d like to share it with you.

Lately I see a lot of threads where same frustrations are shared again and again.

Replace *** with “will sell it” or “am not buying it”.

“Because Fuji X is not up to professional standards I ***”

“Because Fuji X raw files conversion doesn’t exist I ***”

“Because Fuji X is not on display in my local shop I ***”

“My other XYZ camera is so phenomenal, so I ***”

Or simple questions such as “What raw converter to use?”, “Will lens XYZ work with camera XYZ?” etc. are asked regardless that forum search is readily available.

Question to forum mods, is it possible to create “sticky notes” in the forum? At least two of them.

One, let’s call it something like “Fuji X in the world of professional photography”, will link to excellent galleries created by DaveKaiPiper, chris24net, mike kobal and many other professional photographers here. It would be a great inspiration to new (and not so) Fuji X users.

Another one “Processing tips and techniques” will offer member’s wisdom how to use ACR, Silkypix, RPP and many other excellent tools.

It may help to reduce the number of silly debates and allow productive members to focus on constructive discussions.

Thanks,

vkphoto

You couldn't say it any better.....Sometime I feel people get paid to bring rubbish talk against anything FujiFilm onto this forum. Its sad really

John Bean (UK) Forum Pro • Posts: 18,035
Moderation note

Stickies are not possible.

Discussion of moderation (in general) is not permitted in any forum except Open talk and that's where threads of this type belong, not here. I will add only that there is absolutely nothing wrong with expressing opinions - good or bad - about Fujifilm cameras in this forum provided the forum rules  are followed when making or replying to a post.

Please do not continue this OT thread. Self moderation is always the best option, I'd rather not have to lock this thread but I will if I have to.

-- hide signature --

John Bean [GMT]
"Note: If pictures and physical have access, please in kind prevail, thank you for understand." - quotation from an ebay listing.

nixda Veteran Member • Posts: 4,517
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

vkphoto wrote:

Or simple questions such as “What raw converter to use?”, “Will lens XYZ work with camera XYZ?” etc. are asked regardless that forum search is readily available.

That's a general problem in any forum. However, I don't mind it that much. I see three possible scenarios:

1. The answer could be provided right there

2. Some nice soul could link to another thread where the question has been answered satisfactorily. Stickies might not be that useful, because of 3.

3. A fresh, discussion of a topic could reveal new insights, such as things learned since the last thread, or simply prompt one to reevaluate one's stance on things

4. If one knows the answer already and isn't inclined to do (1) or (2), one can safely ignore the post

 nixda's gear list:nixda's gear list
Fujifilm X-E1 Fujifilm XF 14mm F2.8 R Fujifilm XF 18-55mm F2.8-4 R LM OIS Fujifilm XF 55-200mm F3.5-4.8 R LM OIS Fujifilm XF 27mm F2.8 +1 more
vkphoto
vkphoto OP Senior Member • Posts: 1,632
Re: Moderation note

John Bean (UK) wrote:

Stickies are not possible.

Discussion of moderation (in general) is not permitted in any forum except Open talk and that's where threads of this type belong, not here. I will add only that there is absolutely nothing wrong with expressing opinions - good or bad - about Fujifilm cameras in this forum provided the forum rules are followed when making or replying to a post.

Please do not continue this OT thread. Self moderation is always the best option, I'd rather not have to lock this thread but I will if I have to.

-- hide signature --

John Bean [GMT]
"Note: If pictures and physical have access, please in kind prevail, thank you for understand." - quotation from an ebay listing.

Stikies are not possible? OK, John, thanks for the answer and reminder to re read 1984.

MrChristopher
MrChristopher Senior Member • Posts: 1,288
Re: Moderation note

It's pretty easy to ignore the woe is me posts and the related ones. If someone is unhappy just let them be. I agree stickies could be helpful but apparently they're not allowed. Oh well, those are the rules. I lovey x100 and quite frankly I don't lose sleep if others don't feel the same way. I seek out posts here from those who have good technical insight to share and those who post inspiring images taken with their X camera. I pretty much ignore everything else. This approach serves me well.

 MrChristopher's gear list:MrChristopher's gear list
Fujifilm FinePix X100 Fujifilm X-E1 Fujifilm XF 35mm F1.4 R Fujifilm XF 18-55mm F2.8-4 R LM OIS Fujifilm XF 56mm F1.2 R +1 more
John Bean (UK) Forum Pro • Posts: 18,035
Re: Moderation note

MrChristopher wrote:

I agree stickies could be helpful but apparently they're not allowed. Oh well, those are the rules.

It's nothing to do with the rules or being "allowed" - I wrote that stickies are not possible and that's exactly what I meant. The DPR forum software has no means of making a post "sticky".

-- hide signature --

John Bean [GMT]
"Note: If pictures and physical have access, please in kind prevail, thank you for understand." - quotation from an ebay listing.

marike6 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,084
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

Completely agree with the OP as people in almost ALL of the DPR forums don't seem to EVER use the search previous threads to see if a question has been already asked.

As far as the seemingly endless "Fuji isn't this" or "X-Trans isn't this", it's not always easy to avoid such threads.  Often they are like train wrecks that you just can't look away from.  What's more is even within other threads, there are users who troll, bash, or gripe about all things Fuji.  As a satisfied Fuji user, it makes this forum and the X10 forum, at times, a bit unpleasant place to post.  It's the same on the Nikon FX forum where there are literally daily "asked and answered" threads about well covered "D800 Left AF issues", "D600 Dust", "Shame on Nikon", etc.  For satisfied users such as myself, it often feels like another parallel camera universe where the best cameras are suddenly the worst with the most problems.   With all the negative posts, yet all the superb X-Trans images, I sometimes feel that all the complaints don't match up with the reality.

By the way, on the X10 forum, I've even experienced cases of moderators bashing Fuji, and trashing the as of yet unshipped X20 as "Fuji's newest disaster".  It's kind of disheartening when you are super excited about a camera, you pre-order it, yet you have to read all this kind of negative talk.   Besides, I thought moderators were supposed to mitigate trolling. (Please note: I'm aware that moderators work for free and do a great job that I very much appreciate).

Anyway, I don't know about "sticky notes" but I don't see why a simple "Fuji X System FAQ" couldn't be created.  And every time someone posts a "asked and answered" question, people could simply post a reply with the link to the "Fuji X System FAQ".

 marike6's gear list:marike6's gear list
Nikon Coolpix P330 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH2 Nikon D800 Fujifilm X-E1 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH +7 more
Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

The thing I love about threads like these is that their creators are completely oblivious to the fact that they're doing the exact same thing they're complaining about... or often worse, since now we have a thread that isn't even about cameras!

If you don't like this forums content, make better threads and better posts and raise the bar.  The more threads we have like ​this​ one, the worse things are going to get.

marike6 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,084
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

Zardoz wrote:

The thing I love about threads like these is that their creators are completely oblivious to the fact that they're doing the exact same thing they're complaining about... or often worse, since now we have a thread that isn't even about cameras!

If you don't like this forums content, make better threads and better posts and raise the bar. The more threads we have like ​this​ one, the worse things are going to get.

The OP is trying to start a discussion about how to remove all the duplicate posts, and in turn make this forum better.  How exactly is an effort to find ways to improve this forum going to make things worse?  If something is not done about repeat questions, endless moaning, trolling, Fuji bashing, etc. then things will never improve.

Fuji, like all camera companies is not perfect, but they are constantly pushing the envelope and make absolutely great gear.  If we allow trolls, complainers, and Fuji bashers to set the forum tone as one of collection of unhappy X users, Fuji may be undeservedly negatively stigmatized for years to come.

 marike6's gear list:marike6's gear list
Nikon Coolpix P330 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH2 Nikon D800 Fujifilm X-E1 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH +7 more
Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

The OP doesn't have the power to do that, and discussion of moderation is only permitted in the Open Talk forum.  Additionally, none of the other forums on DPR have the agenda of removing negative post to protect the camera vendor.

It doesn't sound particularly even handed to want to remove all the so called "duplicate" negative posts, and yet there's no mention of all the "duplicate" positive posts. There are plenty of utterly worthless threads both negative and positive. If you're not interested, the solution is to skip over them.

BillyInya
BillyInya Senior Member • Posts: 1,453
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

Zardoz wrote:

The OP doesn't have the power to do that, and discussion of moderation is only permitted in the Open Talk forum. Additionally, none of the other forums on DPR have the agenda of removing negative post to protect the camera vendor.

It doesn't sound particularly even handed to want to remove all the so called "duplicate" negative posts, and yet there's no mention of all the "duplicate" positive posts. There are plenty of utterly worthless threads both negative and positive. If you're not interested, the solution is to skip over them.

Absolute rubbish.

There is a concerted attempt to trash Fujifilm, and in particular, the X-Trans innovation at every possible opportunity. I don't mind constructive criticism of anything if it is based on fact but rarely is it. Pure negative fantasy bumblings that I and others are becoming very tired of around here.

Funny thing is it is usually the same 'ole user identities over and over and over and over again.

Cheers

 BillyInya's gear list:BillyInya's gear list
Nikon D7000 Fujifilm X-E1 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G ED-IF Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II +8 more
marike6 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,084
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

BillyInya wrote:

Zardoz wrote:

The OP doesn't have the power to do that, and discussion of moderation is only permitted in the Open Talk forum. Additionally, none of the other forums on DPR have the agenda of removing negative post to protect the camera vendor.

It doesn't sound particularly even handed to want to remove all the so called "duplicate" negative posts, and yet there's no mention of all the "duplicate" positive posts. There are plenty of utterly worthless threads both negative and positive. If you're not interested, the solution is to skip over them.

Absolute rubbish.

There is a concerted attempt to trash Fujifilm, and in particular, the X-Trans innovation at every possible opportunity. I don't mind constructive criticism of anything if it is based on fact but rarely is it. Pure negative fantasy bumblings that I and others are becoming very tired of around here.

Funny thing is it is usually the same 'ole user identities over and over and over and over again.

Cheers

+1. And ignoring repeat or negative posts is the not an effective solution since users pushing their own "anti-X" agendas usually make their voices heard anyway, often within other threads so a that a useful or interesting post suddenly becomes negative and confrontational.

 marike6's gear list:marike6's gear list
Nikon Coolpix P330 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH2 Nikon D800 Fujifilm X-E1 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH +7 more
Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

BillyInya wrote:

There is a concerted attempt to trash Fujifilm, and in particular, the X-Trans innovation at every possible opportunity. I don't mind constructive criticism of anything if it is based on fact but rarely is it. Pure negative fantasy bumblings that I and others are becoming very tired of around here.

If the negative posts were fantasy, as wish so desperately wish to believe, it would be trivial to disprove them with facts and examples.  And yet, time and again, you fail to do so... even when explicitly asked for evidence.

The fact is, every system has weaknesses, and as new people discover them they're going to create threads about it asking for solutions or expressing their dissatisfaction in that system's forum.  Wishing that they'll go away is only going to end in disappointment for you.

BillyInya
BillyInya Senior Member • Posts: 1,453
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

Zardoz wrote:

BillyInya wrote:

There is a concerted attempt to trash Fujifilm, and in particular, the X-Trans innovation at every possible opportunity. I don't mind constructive criticism of anything if it is based on fact but rarely is it. Pure negative fantasy bumblings that I and others are becoming very tired of around here.

If the negative posts were fantasy, as wish so desperately wish to believe, it would be trivial to disprove them with facts and examples. And yet, time and again, you fail to do so... even when explicitly asked for evidence.

The fact is, every system has weaknesses, and as new people discover them they're going to create threads about it asking for solutions or expressing their dissatisfaction in that system's forum. Wishing that they'll go away is only going to end in disappointment for you.

Don't cleverly try to state the obvious now.

You know as well as I and others that if there is ANYTHING negative posted you/ratty will jump in like a mad dog on heat blaming the Fuji X-Trans sensor, or the Fuji X-Pro1 or the X-E1 and trashing Fujifilm. That is if you are not the one starting the negativity in the first place.

Yet, very strangely, when there is FACTUAL INDISPUTABLE REAL WORLD PROOF of the superiority of the X-Trans sensor technology you/ratty will jump in again just as quickly trying to claim it is ONLY the photographer responsible for the image quality seen and nothing to do with the camera used.

Buring Man with the Fujifilm X-Pro1 is a case in point.

This happens ALL THE TIME, same 'ole line from you/ratty over and over and over and over again. And heaven forbid if anyone calls you out on your bent negative agenda then they will then almost certainly have to endure a sustained personal "attack" from multiple identities all strangely echoing each other.

I don't mind it myself because I suspect it is only one sad person behind it but for others things may not be so transparent.

Cheers

 BillyInya's gear list:BillyInya's gear list
Nikon D7000 Fujifilm X-E1 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G ED-IF Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II +8 more
Zardoz
Zardoz Senior Member • Posts: 1,249
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

BillyInya wrote:

Don't cleverly try to state the obvious now.

Obvious things are the only ones you seem to understand.

You know as well as I and others that if there is ANYTHING negative posted you/ratty will jump in like a mad dog on heat blaming the Fuji X-Trans sensor, or the Fuji X-Pro1 or the X-E1 and trashing Fujifilm. That is if you are not the one starting the negativity in the first place.

False, feel free to back up you claims with proof.

Yet, very strangely, when there is FACTUAL INDISPUTABLE REAL WORLD PROOF of the superiority of the X-Trans sensor technology you/ratty will jump in again just as quickly trying to claim it is ONLY the photographer responsible for the image quality seen and nothing to do with the camera used.

Buring Man with the Fujifilm X-Pro1 is a case in point.

Have you already forgotten the thread where you admitted that it is down to the photographer and post-processing, and that you would have difficultly picking out X-Trans photos from regular Bayer photos?

This happens ALL THE TIME, same 'ole line from you/ratty over and over and over and over again. And heaven forbid if anyone calls you out on your bent negative agenda then they will then almost certainly have to endure a sustained personal "attack" from multiple identities all strangely echoing each other.

Feel free to point out any personal attacks I've made.

I don't mind it myself because I suspect it is only one sad person behind it but for others things may not be so transparent.

It's amusing that you're so quick to accuse others of using multiple accounts when it's quite clear that you're posting under multiple accounts.  It's also amusing that you're so quick to point out my so-called "personal attacks" when you so frequently post off-topic stuff like this very post.  Why are you so upset that some people have negative experiences with cameras that you don't even own?

Lawrie Silverberg Regular Member • Posts: 273
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

Excellent post, VK.  There are so many garbage  posts, it's not funny.  I realize some like the X series and some don't, but let's not keep playing the same song over and over. Autofocus has been discussed ad nauseum.   Another  complaint is that  people don't use the "search" feature. That would save a lot of annoying duplications.

My $.02

Lawrie

BillyInya
BillyInya Senior Member • Posts: 1,453
Zardoz exposed - so don't carry on

You know I've hit the nail right on the head with you, so no amount of following up with endless pointless banter about me will diminish the fact that I know exactly what you are doing.

Cheers

 BillyInya's gear list:BillyInya's gear list
Nikon D7000 Fujifilm X-E1 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G ED-IF Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II +8 more
(unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,144
Re: Some pointless discussions lately

marike6 wrote:

BillyInya wrote:

Zardoz wrote:

The OP doesn't have the power to do that, and discussion of moderation is only permitted in the Open Talk forum. Additionally, none of the other forums on DPR have the agenda of removing negative post to protect the camera vendor.

It doesn't sound particularly even handed to want to remove all the so called "duplicate" negative posts, and yet there's no mention of all the "duplicate" positive posts. There are plenty of utterly worthless threads both negative and positive. If you're not interested, the solution is to skip over them.

Absolute rubbish.

There is a concerted attempt to trash Fujifilm, and in particular, the X-Trans innovation at every possible opportunity. I don't mind constructive criticism of anything if it is based on fact but rarely is it. Pure negative fantasy bumblings that I and others are becoming very tired of around here.

Funny thing is it is usually the same 'ole user identities over and over and over and over again.

Cheers

+1. And ignoring repeat or negative posts is the not an effective solution since users pushing their own "anti-X" agendas usually make their voices heard anyway, often within other threads so a that a useful or interesting post suddenly becomes negative and confrontational.

I dont think you can say this with any degree of certainty because no one (NO ONE) ever ignores posts that they disagree with.  The same old crowd jumps up and down and goes BSC when I post.  I or someone else expresess something about a Fuji camera that we dont like and there is certain to be 30 or more follow ups.  Is that ignoring? I dont think so.

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DISCLAIMER: The text written herein is meant to provide the opinions and/or suggestions of the author. No statement herein is meant to be considered law of the land, representative of any party or group, and or a quote from any party or group. Neither is any statement in the contained text meant to be taken as scripture, doctrine, or all encompassing of an entire populous or any groups or individuals therein.

 rattymouse's gear list:rattymouse's gear list
Fujifilm FinePix F10 Zoom Fujifilm FinePix F20 Zoom Fujifilm FinePix F70EXR Fujifilm FinePix X100 Fujifilm X10 +9 more
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