Best selling mirrorless cameras in Japan for 2012

Started Dec 29, 2012 | Discussions
OP MichaelKJ Veteran Member • Posts: 3,466
Re: NEX7 flop ....

tedolf wrote:

MichaelKJ wrote:

texinwien wrote:

tedolf wrote:

Sergey Borachev wrote:

tedolf wrote:

What is really suprising is Sony doing so poorly. u 4/3 has half the market and Sony less than 20%!?

Sony's brand name is huge in Japan, bigger than Nikon.

At less than 20% market penetration, I think the Sony brass may pull the plug on NEX.

I guess the Memory Stick and Betamax wont be so lonely anymore.

Teedoolph

No wonder Sony is in so much trouble. Pulling the plug on NEX is no big loss if Sony technology continues to be put in Olympus cameras, e.g. focus peaking, or a SLT version of 43 camera, high res LCDs, sweep panorama ... .

That might be exaclty what the Sony brass is thinking.

I smelled blood when it was confirmed that Sony was selling sensors to Oly.

Sony has never been shy about abandoning technology, or their customers!

Tedolph

I read in an industry article back in April that Sony was planning to slowly shift focus to making sensors and selling them to other camera makers while expending less effort on building finished models, itself. Sony seems to be very good at making the sensors - much better than they are at taking over market share with their finished consumer cameras.

tex

I think Sony will dump their P&S cameras. The NEX-7 has done well for a high-margin camera,

No it hasn't.

It was supposed to be the u 4/3 killer.

The OM-d outsells it with an inferior sensor.

What evidence do you have that the OM-D outsells the NEX-7?

The NEX 7 is a flop.

The NEX 6 is the proof.

Teolph

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tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Re: NEX7 flop ....

MichaelKJ wrote:

tedolf wrote:

MichaelKJ wrote:

texinwien wrote:

tedolf wrote:

Sergey Borachev wrote:

tedolf wrote:

What is really suprising is Sony doing so poorly. u 4/3 has half the market and Sony less than 20%!?

Sony's brand name is huge in Japan, bigger than Nikon.

At less than 20% market penetration, I think the Sony brass may pull the plug on NEX.

I guess the Memory Stick and Betamax wont be so lonely anymore.

Teedoolph

No wonder Sony is in so much trouble. Pulling the plug on NEX is no big loss if Sony technology continues to be put in Olympus cameras, e.g. focus peaking, or a SLT version of 43 camera, high res LCDs, sweep panorama ... .

That might be exaclty what the Sony brass is thinking.

I smelled blood when it was confirmed that Sony was selling sensors to Oly.

Sony has never been shy about abandoning technology, or their customers!

Tedolph

I read in an industry article back in April that Sony was planning to slowly shift focus to making sensors and selling them to other camera makers while expending less effort on building finished models, itself. Sony seems to be very good at making the sensors - much better than they are at taking over market share with their finished consumer cameras.

tex

I think Sony will dump their P&S cameras. The NEX-7 has done well for a high-margin camera,

No it hasn't.

It was supposed to be the u 4/3 killer.

The OM-d outsells it with an inferior sensor.

What evidence do you have that the OM-D outsells the NEX-7?

The NEX 7 is a flop.

The NEX 6 is the proof.

Teolph


look at the chart.

The OM-d was only recently introduced.

NEX 7 was available during the entire measurement period.

Also, check out the Amazon.com best seller list.

NEX 7 is a dud.

tEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
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grumpyolderman Senior Member • Posts: 1,085
Re: Micro Four thirds are 17% of all interchangeable camera sales--which is impressive!

In view of the fact that the first m4/3 camera was released only four years ago, I think 17% is very impressive. The fact that Canon and Nikon decided they could no longer ignore the mirrorless format is also noteworthy.

totally agree, but I was surprised the m43 percentage is not higher, I guess I spend too much time here on this forum and think that everybody is so convinced that m43 is the best format eva! I do think that DSLRs are akin to pulling a boat with a steam train, all the mirrorless formats need is a fast autofocus, but even as is, most of current DSLR users would benefit in many ways from m43, me thinks

JL

tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Re: Well done Nikon

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
nzmacro
nzmacro Forum Pro • Posts: 15,281
Re: Well done Nikon

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

It's always good Ted to see something like this. It's good for all of us really mate. Sure they have heavy discounts, but that's on the plus side IMO

Its a little too small for me, sensor wise, but ma and pa Kettle would love it I guess.

All the best up there mate and have a great new year Ted.

Danny.

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baxters Veteran Member • Posts: 5,156
Re: Best selling mirrorless cameras in Japan for 2012

MichaelKJ wrote:

LOL That reasoning probably explains why the D800 only has 1.6% of the Japanese DSLR market

Touche, but I am kind of serious. We see this mighty bloc of almost 15 thousand users voting on the DPR poll with a combined 44% voting for the D800 and EM5 and you might expect more ales for either camera.

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Panasonic Lumix DMC-GM1 Olympus Zuiko Digital ED 70-300mm 1:4.0-5.6
Kalin Junior Member • Posts: 46
Re: NEX7 flop ....

Well, the chart shows that the NEX 7 has outsold the OM-D. Notwithstanding the availability period, this is hardly a dud performance unless you acknowledge the OM-D is even dudder!

And how are Oly and Panasonic suddenly pretty much the same company when it comes to m4/3?? Because they until now shared sensors but differed in some other features? Well, then Sony and Nicon are pretty much the same when it comes to DSLR's and Sony is the world leader then! Fantastic...

YouDidntDidYou
YouDidntDidYou Senior Member • Posts: 1,576
Re: Well done Nikon

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

Sean Nelson
Sean Nelson Forum Pro • Posts: 12,897
Re: Best selling mirrorless cameras in Japan for 2012

baxters wrote:

Touche, but I am kind of serious. We see this mighty bloc of almost 15 thousand users voting on the DPR poll with a combined 44% voting for the D800 and EM5 and you might expect more ales for either camera.

The OM-D is the most expensive M43 camera made by Oly - that makes it a niche product.   You can't expect the votes of the enthusiasts who frequent this site to parallel the preferences of the average consumer.

illy
illy Forum Pro • Posts: 12,160
Re: Well done Nikon
3

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

lol the #1 selling mirrorless camera in Japan is a flop, that's tenuous even by your standards

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Nikon D200 Nikon D5100 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GF1 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.8G Sigma 500mm F4.5 EX DG HSM +4 more
zxaar Veteran Member • Posts: 4,175
Re: What is really suprising is Sony....

tedolf wrote:

zxaar wrote:

tedolf wrote:

doing so poorly. u 4/3 has half the market and Sony less than 20%!?

Sony's brand name is huge in Japan, bigger than Nikon.

At less than 20% market penetration, I think the Sony brass may pull the plug on NEX.

I guess the Memory Stick and Betamax wont be so lonely anymore.

Teedoolph

Love the way you think.

At 21.4 % panasonic is doing great but at 18.4% sony is doomed. By your logic panasonic is also almost doomed because it is just a percent above 20.

Panasonic and Oly are essentially the same company when it comes to u 4/3.

you are deluded if you believe it.

Why do you think the never make a competing product?

Like for example when Oly made OM-D , panasonice never made gh3 to compete with it.

See a doctor, you need help.

zxaar Veteran Member • Posts: 4,175
Re: Well done Nikon

illy wrote:

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

lol the #1 selling mirrorless camera in Japan is a flop, that's tenuous even by your standards

Some people on m43 forums are great at critical thinking. There is another one who thinks that OLy and Panasonic are same companies.

mferencz Regular Member • Posts: 411
Re: What is really suprising is Sony....

Body wise Oly and Panasonic are on their own, but the one thing they have in common, which is a mount, they are damn near in collusion.  Look at the lineup... there is no doubling up in focal ranges, it's as if there is a board meeting once a year between the two companies going over who makes what.   Pany/Oly is completely interchangeable.  You can call it one company.  (M4/3)

tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Re: NEX7 flop ....

Kalin wrote:

Well, the chart shows that the NEX 7 has outsold the OM-D. Notwithstanding the availability period,

Well, you can't ignore the avaialbility issue.

the NEX 7 has been on sale almost twice as long as the OM-d

this is hardly a dud performance unless you acknowledge the OM-D is even dudder!

Actually, I think OM-d sales have been a little weak.

But that might be the effect of the avialability issue.

Also, the price is a bit high.

And how are Oly and Panasonic suddenly pretty much the same company when it comes to m4/3??

Oly makes most of the subassemblies that go into the Panny cams.

Oly is essentially Panny's subcontractor.

Also, as I said above, Oly and Panny cooperate very closely on product development road maps, have executed mutual non-disclosure agreements, etc.

They are not competitors in the classic sense at all.

They are in fact, stategic partners and more.

Because they until now shared sensors but differed in some other features? Well, then Sony and Nicon are pretty much the same when it comes to DSLR's and Sony is the world leader then! Fantastic...

See above

TEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Re: What is really suprising is Sony....

zxaar wrote:

tedolf wrote:

zxaar wrote:

tedolf wrote:

doing so poorly. u 4/3 has half the market and Sony less than 20%!?

Sony's brand name is huge in Japan, bigger than Nikon.

At less than 20% market penetration, I think the Sony brass may pull the plug on NEX.

I guess the Memory Stick and Betamax wont be so lonely anymore.

Teedoolph

Love the way you think.

At 21.4 % panasonic is doing great but at 18.4% sony is doomed. By your logic panasonic is also almost doomed because it is just a percent above 20.

Panasonic and Oly are essentially the same company when it comes to u 4/3.

you are deluded if you believe it.

Why do you think the never make a competing product?

Like for example when Oly made OM-D , panasonice never made gh3 to compete with it.

GH-3 does not compete with the OM-d.

They appeal to very different consumers.

See a doctor, you need help.

Can you recomend a good one?

TEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Re: What is really suprising is Sony....

mferencz wrote:

Body wise Oly and Panasonic are on their own, but the one thing they have in common, which is a mount, they are damn near in collusion.

They are in collusion, admittedly so.

Look at the lineup... there is no doubling up in focal ranges, it's as if there is a board meeting once a year between the two companies going over who makes what. Pany/Oly is completely interchangeable. You can call it one company. (M4/3)

Well, there are others, e.g. Cosina, Samyang, Kenko, etc. that are actual competitors.

TEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
I'll bite.......

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

How so?

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

Tedolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
tedolf
tedolf Forum Pro • Posts: 26,318
Same company?

zxaar wrote:

illy wrote:

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

lol the #1 selling mirrorless camera in Japan is a flop, that's tenuous even by your standards

Some people on m43 forums are great at critical thinking. There is another one who thinks that OLy and Panasonic are same companies.

No.

Strategic partners?

Yes.

More than that?

Yes.

TEdolph

 tedolf's gear list:tedolf's gear list
Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm 1:4-5.6 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 UMC Fisheye MFT Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R +8 more
zxaar Veteran Member • Posts: 4,175
Re: What is really suprising is Sony....

tedolf wrote:

zxaar wrote:

tedolf wrote:

zxaar wrote:

tedolf wrote:

doing so poorly. u 4/3 has half the market and Sony less than 20%!?

Sony's brand name is huge in Japan, bigger than Nikon.

At less than 20% market penetration, I think the Sony brass may pull the plug on NEX.

I guess the Memory Stick and Betamax wont be so lonely anymore.

Teedoolph

Love the way you think.

At 21.4 % panasonic is doing great but at 18.4% sony is doomed. By your logic panasonic is also almost doomed because it is just a percent above 20.

Panasonic and Oly are essentially the same company when it comes to u 4/3.

you are deluded if you believe it.

Why do you think the never make a competing product?

Like for example when Oly made OM-D , panasonice never made gh3 to compete with it.

GH-3 does not compete with the OM-d.

They appeal to very different consumers.

Every camera compete with another one. For those who bought into m43 , if there was no OMD then they might have bought GH3, same if OMD wasn't there then GH3 was the option. So yes they compete with one another.

See a doctor, you need help.

Can you recomend a good one?


For you, no doctor is good enough.

( You can play this game whole night,  )

zxaar Veteran Member • Posts: 4,175
Re: Same company?

tedolf wrote:

zxaar wrote:

illy wrote:

YouDidntDidYou wrote:

tedolf wrote:

nzmacro wrote:

Excellent to see and now they also have the V2. Competition is great.

I would never buy one, but this is good news for Nikon.

All the best folks, congrats Nikon.

Danny.

Agreed.

I thought the Nikon 1 was going to be a big flop.

But Nikon seems to understand the consumer very well.

Coolpix may be destroyed by the cell phone camera but Nikon 1 will upgrade the Coolpix customer who doesn't care about DOF control-

probably the vast majority of people who buy digital cameras.

Nikon hit a home run here and Canon wiffed big time.

TEdolph

Erm the Nikon 1 has been a big flop....

living life to the Four Thirds!
http://www.YouDidntDidYou.com/blog

lol the #1 selling mirrorless camera in Japan is a flop, that's tenuous even by your standards

Some people on m43 forums are great at critical thinking. There is another one who thinks that OLy and Panasonic are same companies.

No.


Okey then Oly 28% and Panasoni at 21.4% , you can not lump them together and call a single figure for both. As you admitted they are not the same company.

Explain to me how panasonic at 21% is doing great while Sony at 18% is going to dump camera business because they are doing very poorly?

Strategic partners?

Yes.

More than that?

Yes.

Yes, Panasony decided to put lots of money in Olympus because they are more than strategic partners.

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