People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!

Started Dec 26, 2012 | Discussions
MOD darkref Contributing Member • Posts: 716
Re: People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!

I think I might create a new craze. Taking pictures of people taking pictures with tablets.

Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!
1

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

JoeR wrote:

Photography is changing. Get used to it or get left behind. The smart phones and pads out sell DSLRs and are so much easier to use.

And are just this side of useless.

Seriously? LOL. You just said that? LOL. Get with the times, pal. Do a quick search on the huge variety of ways people are using iPads and other tablets, not only for recreational purposes, but also for work and enterprise purposes, too.

I meant the cameras are.

Unskilled photographers do well to use them.

You mean, they do better than when they use nothing at all. Barely.

Yeah, that's not an elitist, narrow-minded statement. LOL. You need to relax and have a more open mind. Just because someone chooses to do something differently than you doesn't mean that they are "barely...[doing] better than when they use nothing at all." People used to think that anyone using a phone to capture a photo was just producing pure rubbish, but today I see fantastic photos being produced by phones all the time...and by people who may have the eye for imagery but maybe not the technical knowledge to use a dedicated camera. That's fine, and that's great, because it means more people-- regardless of technical skill level-- can partake in photography.

I'm still waiting to see a decent picture taken with a tablet.  The examples of mobile photography in the articles on Connect are all garbage.

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JulesJ
JulesJ Forum Pro • Posts: 45,503
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

JulesJ wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

glossywhite wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

glossywhite wrote:

I often hear that "The best camera is the one you have with you", so it's a choice of:

1/ Take the photo

2/ Don't take the photo

Choose.

They do look silly, but I'd rather look silly and get a photo than miss it for vanity.



Carry a decent compact, rather than a not nearly compact tablet that has a much poorer camera.

iPad owners have iPads with them, and if they don't have a compact with them... well... come on, think about it.

Stupid thread anyway.

Why would anyone carry an ipad around with them, and not a much smaller and more practical phone or compact camera?

Why would someone buy a yellow car? Why would someone wear an orange hat. You might not want to, but that doesn't mean someone else can't. You don't seem very understanding Ljfinger, I guess you don't have kids!

I have two - 4 and 8.

Well, I hope you learn to be a little more accepting whilst bringing them up. Believe me they will loosen all your long standing beliefs, at least I hope they do, mine are 27 and 30!

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Lee Jay
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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

My long standing belief is that if you are willing to carry around somethe the size of a tablet, you should find it even easier to carry around something the size of a small wallet.

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:


I'm 42 and a progressive liberal and technologist. I have three technology patents. My grandfather is 96. I could easily live 50 more years. Viewfinders and screens will still be distinct then as they are now. OVF's are by far the best, EVF's are a distant second, and screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions.

You are the makings of a grouchy old man! Hahaha.

Time to join the 21st century. Look all around you. Electronic screens are being used to "find the view" everywhere you look, whether it be with the latest mobile devices, or dedicated video cameras, or point-n-shoot cameras, or DSLR videography, or MILC's, etc, etc, etc.

So what? Lots of people are also listening to mp3s on the useless ear buds that come with their phones. I promise you that my home audio system sound's far, far better.

Oh, great, now you're implying that you can't get good audio from mp3's and ear buds?  LOL.  Your elitist attitude keeps digging a deeper and deeper hole for yourself.  I guess you must strap your home audio system on your back if you want to listen to music when you're out and about, huh?  LOL.

What you fail to understand is that there's a big difference between some ultimate, empirical standard of what is "best" versus what is good enough to bring a level of happiness, enjoyment, and satisfaction.  Frankly, I think people who think only of what is empirically "best" are a lot unhappier because they are constantly obsessed about chasing an impractical ideal.

Just because lots of people do it doesn't mean it's any good. In fact the opposite is usually the case - consumer masses usually gravitate to the lowest cost - and lowest quality - solution. Remember the number one restaurant in the word is McDonalds!

Oh, great, now you're implying that all devices that use an electronic screen is equivalent to McDonald's food?  LOL.  Like I said, you keep digging a deeper and deeper hole for yourself.

Sure, keep arguing that all electronic screens are the equivalent of eating at McDonalds.  I think too many of us are out enjoying using our electronic screens for the enjoyment of taking photos to be bothered with such inane elitist attitudes.

The reality is that EVF/screen "viewfinder" cameras far outnumber optical viewfinder cameras these days, and the margin will only increase as time and technology moves forward. Cling to your conservative ideas and notions all you want, but the world is moving on. To say silly, foolish, and completely erroneous things like "screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions" is to completely ignore the fact that millions and millions of people are taking great photos in all kinds of conditions with all kinds of "screen" cameras, from compact cameras to smart phone cameras. If you don't see this, it means you're clearly out of touch with modern times, or just have your head buried in the sand.

Just got a galaxy S3 (see open talk for my test).

Oh, geez, I don't even want to imagine what kind of negative rants you write about it.  Probably complain that it doesn't have a rotary dial!  LOL.

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:


I'm 42 and a progressive liberal and technologist. I have three technology patents. My grandfather is 96. I could easily live 50 more years. Viewfinders and screens will still be distinct then as they are now. OVF's are by far the best, EVF's are a distant second, and screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions.

You are the makings of a grouchy old man! Hahaha.

Time to join the 21st century. Look all around you. Electronic screens are being used to "find the view" everywhere you look, whether it be with the latest mobile devices, or dedicated video cameras, or point-n-shoot cameras, or DSLR videography, or MILC's, etc, etc, etc.

So what? Lots of people are also listening to mp3s on the useless ear buds that come with their phones. I promise you that my home audio system sound's far, far better.

Oh, great, now you're implying that you can't get good audio from mp3's and ear buds?

No, I'm saying it. You can't.

What you fail to understand is that there's a big difference between some ultimate, empirical standard of what is "best" versus what is good enough to bring a level of happiness, enjoyment, and satisfaction.

Right - people are gravitating to the weakest acceptable solution, rather than the best solution.

Frankly, I think people who think only of what is empirically "best" are a lot unhappier because they are constantly obsessed about chasing an impractical ideal.

Given thinking like that, we'd all still be living in caves.

Just because lots of people do it doesn't mean it's any good. In fact the opposite is usually the case - consumer masses usually gravitate to the lowest cost - and lowest quality - solution. Remember the number one restaurant in the word is McDonalds!

Oh, great, now you're implying that all devices that use an electronic screen is equivalent to McDonald's food?

Yes.

Sure, keep arguing that all electronic screens are the equivalent of eating at McDonalds. I think too many of us are out enjoying using our electronic screens for the enjoyment of taking photos to be bothered with such inane elitist attitudes.

They are the lowest quality of the framing options, with EVFs beating them by a good margin, and OVFs beating those by a good margin. Same as McDonalds being the lowest quality of the restaurant options.

The reality is that EVF/screen "viewfinder" cameras far outnumber optical viewfinder cameras these days, and the margin will only increase as time and technology moves forward. Cling to your conservative ideas and notions all you want, but the world is moving on. To say silly, foolish, and completely erroneous things like "screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions" is to completely ignore the fact that millions and millions of people are taking great photos in all kinds of conditions with all kinds of "screen" cameras, from compact cameras to smart phone cameras. If you don't see this, it means you're clearly out of touch with modern times, or just have your head buried in the sand.

Just got a galaxy S3 (see open talk for my test).

Oh, geez, I don't even want to imagine what kind of negative rants you write about it. Probably complain that it doesn't have a rotary dial! LOL.

It's a nice device, with a lousy camera. Same as nearly every phone.  See for yourself:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50555895

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Lee Jay
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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!

ljfinger wrote:

I'm still waiting to see a decent picture taken with a tablet. The examples of mobile photography in the articles on Connect are all garbage.

Wow, what a surprise.  Lee Jay thinks something is garbage!  LOL.  I think you've established that almost everything is garbage to you if it doesn't fit into your very narrow, conservative world perspective and ideology.  Fortunately, not all of us view the world around us so negatively, so narrowly, and with such elitism.

There's really no reason why someone with a good eye for photography can't produce good photos with a tablet, just as many people already produce good photos with smart phones.  See: http://www.iphoneography.com/

But of course, if you truly think that *all* photos being produced with smart phones are garbage, then you clearly have a *very* biased view and agenda.

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:


I'm 42 and a progressive liberal and technologist. I have three technology patents. My grandfather is 96. I could easily live 50 more years. Viewfinders and screens will still be distinct then as they are now. OVF's are by far the best, EVF's are a distant second, and screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions.

You are the makings of a grouchy old man! Hahaha.

Time to join the 21st century. Look all around you. Electronic screens are being used to "find the view" everywhere you look, whether it be with the latest mobile devices, or dedicated video cameras, or point-n-shoot cameras, or DSLR videography, or MILC's, etc, etc, etc.

So what? Lots of people are also listening to mp3s on the useless ear buds that come with their phones. I promise you that my home audio system sound's far, far better.

Oh, great, now you're implying that you can't get good audio from mp3's and ear buds?

No, I'm saying it. You can't.

What you fail to understand is that there's a big difference between some ultimate, empirical standard of what is "best" versus what is good enough to bring a level of happiness, enjoyment, and satisfaction.

Right - people are gravitating to the weakest acceptable solution, rather than the best solution.

Frankly, I think people who think only of what is empirically "best" are a lot unhappier because they are constantly obsessed about chasing an impractical ideal.

Given thinking like that, we'd all still be living in caves.

Just because lots of people do it doesn't mean it's any good. In fact the opposite is usually the case - consumer masses usually gravitate to the lowest cost - and lowest quality - solution. Remember the number one restaurant in the word is McDonalds!

Oh, great, now you're implying that all devices that use an electronic screen is equivalent to McDonald's food?

Yes.

Sure, keep arguing that all electronic screens are the equivalent of eating at McDonalds. I think too many of us are out enjoying using our electronic screens for the enjoyment of taking photos to be bothered with such inane elitist attitudes.

They are the lowest quality of the framing options, with EVFs beating them by a good margin, and OVFs beating those by a good margin. Same as McDonalds being the lowest quality of the restaurant options.

The reality is that EVF/screen "viewfinder" cameras far outnumber optical viewfinder cameras these days, and the margin will only increase as time and technology moves forward. Cling to your conservative ideas and notions all you want, but the world is moving on. To say silly, foolish, and completely erroneous things like "screens are barely usable under the easiest of conditions" is to completely ignore the fact that millions and millions of people are taking great photos in all kinds of conditions with all kinds of "screen" cameras, from compact cameras to smart phone cameras. If you don't see this, it means you're clearly out of touch with modern times, or just have your head buried in the sand.

Just got a galaxy S3 (see open talk for my test).

Oh, geez, I don't even want to imagine what kind of negative rants you write about it. Probably complain that it doesn't have a rotary dial! LOL.

It's a nice device, with a lousy camera. Same as nearly every phone. See for yourself:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/50555895

OK, we get it:  Anything that doesn't fit into your narrow world perspective is garbage.  LOL.

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

T3 wrote:

OK, we get it: Anything that doesn't fit into your narrow world perspective is garbage. LOL.

You don't appear to get it.  I'll quote myself to help you:

"...people are gravitating to the weakest acceptable solution, rather than the best solution."

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

OK, we get it: Anything that doesn't fit into your narrow world perspective is garbage. LOL.

You don't appear to get it. I'll quote myself to help you:

"...people are gravitating to the weakest acceptable solution, rather than the best solution."

No, I don't think YOU get it: not everyone needs the "best" to get enjoyment. Some people absolutely need the "best", otherwise they just hate life. Those people aren't any happier. In fact, they are probably a lot less happy than the rest of us. The rest of us understand when good is good enough, and can derive enjoyment out of something even if it's not the empirical "best."

Furthermore, even today's so-called "weakest acceptable solution" (according to you) are still often a lot better than yesteryear's supposedly superior solutions. For example, as this article discusses, "today's smartphone cameras are already better than point-n-shoot cameras from 5 years ago."

http://us.gizmodo.com/5950400/todays-smartphone-cameras-are-already-better-than-point+and+shoot-cameras-from-5-years-ago

Of course, the very technical-minded people can't stand this notion.  But artists care more about the end result, rather than the type of paint brush or chisel that was used to produce the result.  When you look at the iphoneography site (http://www.iphoneography.com/), you can clearly see that art and vision trumps technical hardware measurebating.

And I've definitely seen plenty of examples that support this. I had a friend who recently came back from a trip with a bunch of gorgeous photos all taken with his iPhone. I was simply amazed at how great they looked. Frankly, you would never know that they were taken with a smart phone if you weren't told. Ultimately, when you look at the photos, you don't even *care* that they happened to be taken with a smart phone. You're just left to enjoy the photo. And that's the way it should be. But for someone like yourself, if you were to be told they were shot with a smart phone or a tablet, you would immediately jump to the pre-determined conclusion that "they are garbage" rather than simply being able to enjoy the photo for what it was. The notion that a good photo can be taken with a mobile device like a smart phone or tablet would not fit into your narrow world perspective, and your prejudices and biases would kick in: "it's garbage!"

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

OK, we get it: Anything that doesn't fit into your narrow world perspective is garbage. LOL.

You don't appear to get it. I'll quote myself to help you:

"...people are gravitating to the weakest acceptable solution, rather than the best solution."

No, I don't think YOU get it: not everyone needs the "best" to get enjoyment.

Isn't that what I just said?

Some people absolutely need the "best", otherwise they just hate life. Those people aren't any happier. In fact, they are probably a lot less happy than the rest of us. The rest of us understand when good is good enough, and can derive enjoyment out of something even if it's not the empirical "best."

Or even the best you can do.  Mediocre performance is good enough for you.

Furthermore, even today's so-called "weakest acceptable solution" (according to you) are still often a lot better than yesteryear's supposedly superior solutions. For example, as this article discusses, "today's smartphone cameras are already better than point-n-shoot cameras from 5 years ago."

http://us.gizmodo.com/5950400/todays-smartphone-cameras-are-already-better-than-point+and+shoot-cameras-from-5-years-ago

Which is patently false, unless you don't mind being permanently stuck at a single focal length.

I just looked at the pictures from my Canon S3IS.  About 7500 of the 16,344 shots we took with that camera were taken at an equivalent focal length of 50mm or above, including over 1,000 shots at over 400mm.  You can scratch the phones off the list for those shots, and that is from a camera from 6 1/2 years ago.

And I've definitely seen plenty of examples that support this. I had a friend who recently came back from a trip with a bunch of gorgeous photos all taken with his iPhone.

All boring shots of stationary subjects in good light, no doubt.

I was simply amazed at how great they looked. Frankly, you would never know that they were taken with a smart phone if you weren't told. Ultimately, when you look at the photos, you don't even *care* that they happened to be taken with a smart phone. You're just left to enjoy the photo. And that's the way it should be. But for someone like yourself, if you were to be told they were shot with a smart phone or a tablet, you would immediately jump to the pre-determined conclusion that "they are garbage" rather than simply being able to enjoy the photo for what it was. The notion that a good photo can be taken with a mobile device like a smart phone or tablet would not fit into your narrow world perspective, and your prejudices and biases would kick in: "it's garbage!"

Why not try to do better, especially if it's by using a small, cheap device that fits in the same pocket as the phone?  If you're a photo-enthusiast, anyway.

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DonA2
DonA2 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,187
Re: People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!

darkref wrote:

I think I might create a new craze. Taking pictures of people taking pictures with tablets.

Been there- done that.  I do think that with ever improving screens that these things will get down to a more reasonable 7" or less and wont look quite so odd as a camera.  I have heard of the "smartwatch" or "iwatch' so these big ipads may soon be history.

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Mark B. Forum Pro • Posts: 24,567
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

My long standing belief is that if you are willing to carry around somethe the size of a tablet, you should find it even easier to carry around something the size of a small wallet.

My belief is that everybody is different and I accept that not everybody agrees with how I might do something.  So even though I have a tablet as well as a DSLR and compact, it's unreasonable to expect everyone else to do the same.  The fact is that someone who carries a tablet may not own or want to own another piece of equipment.  So what if it looks silly?  That's their choice.

Mark

T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!
2

Mark B. wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

My long standing belief is that if you are willing to carry around somethe the size of a tablet, you should find it even easier to carry around something the size of a small wallet.

My belief is that everybody is different and I accept that not everybody agrees with how I might do something. So even though I have a tablet as well as a DSLR and compact, it's unreasonable to expect everyone else to do the same. The fact is that someone who carries a tablet may not own or want to own another piece of equipment. So what if it looks silly? That's their choice.

Mark

Forget it.  There's no reasoning with Lee.  He's one of the most dogmatic, conservative, narrow-minded ideologues on these forums.  It's really hard for him to understand how anyone could possibly disagree with his established opinions on what is right or wrong, good or bad.  It's his way or the highway.

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: People using their tablets as cameras, explain this to me!
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darkref wrote:

I think I might create a new craze. Taking pictures of people taking pictures with tablets.

It's amazing that some of us have become so judgemental about what people are *using* to take photos, rather than just appreciating that people are taking photos.  But then again, this is an *equipment* site for *equipment* geeks, rather than a *photography* site.  "Oh, look!  That person is using XZY equipment to take a photo!  What a buffoon!"

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

T3 wrote:

Forget it. There's no reasoning with Lee. He's one of the most dogmatic, conservative, narrow-minded ideologues on these forums. It's really hard for him to understand how anyone could possibly disagree with his established opinions on what is right or wrong, good or bad. It's his way or the highway.

As I've already told you I'm not even remotely conservative, especially when it comes to technology.  I work as a researcher in renewable energy, I push the hydrogen economy, I drive a Prius, I have three patents in technology, and I embraced digital photography before 1997 after having shot film since I was 9 years old.

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!
1

ljfinger wrote:

And I've definitely seen plenty of examples that support this. I had a friend who recently came back from a trip with a bunch of gorgeous photos all taken with his iPhone.

All boring shots of stationary subjects in good light, no doubt.

Uh-huh, yeah, you'd probably say the same thing if you came across Ansel Adams using a field camera on a wooden tripod, too!  "Boring shots of stationary subjects in good light!"  Apparently, to you, anything that isn't shot at high frame frame and high shutter speed to stop fast action in crummy light is just "boring shots".  Yes, how open-minded of you.  LOL.  I guess by your criteria (ie. shots of stationary subjects in good light), that classifies quite a LOT of very good photography in the world as being "boring" photography.

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 53,182
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

T3 wrote:

ljfinger wrote:

And I've definitely seen plenty of examples that support this. I had a friend who recently came back from a trip with a bunch of gorgeous photos all taken with his iPhone.

All boring shots of stationary subjects in good light, no doubt.

Uh-huh, yeah, you'd probably say the same thing if you came across Ansel Adams using a field camera on a wooden tripod, too!

Pretty much, yes.  Landscapes are mostly all boring.

"Boring shots of stationary subjects in good light!" Apparently, to you, anything that isn't shot at high frame frame and high shutter speed to stop fast action in crummy light is just "boring shots".

No, I prefer shots of subjects that are doing something - like people, animals, airplanes, etc.  The surroundings are just background.  Astrophotography is an exception since it's so much less mundane than our common surroundings here on Earth.

If I'm going to bother with a "beautiful sky" or something, I like to include an actual subject.  I also like a challenge.

This was a horribly difficult shot.  The light is low, the shutter speed is intentionally slow to preserve blade motion blur to give the appearance of motion, I was outside freezing and I was being heavily buffeted by the wind.

Yes, how open-minded of you. LOL. I guess by your criteria (ie. shots of stationary subjects in good light), that classifies quite a LOT of very good photography in the world as being "boring" photography.

True.

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T3 Forum Pro • Posts: 20,857
Re: can't beat the size of that viewfinder!

ljfinger wrote:

T3 wrote:

Forget it. There's no reasoning with Lee. He's one of the most dogmatic, conservative, narrow-minded ideologues on these forums. It's really hard for him to understand how anyone could possibly disagree with his established opinions on what is right or wrong, good or bad. It's his way or the highway.

As I've already told you I'm not even remotely conservative, especially when it comes to technology. I work as a researcher in renewable energy, I push the hydrogen economy, I drive a Prius, I have three patents in technology, and I embraced digital photography before 1997 after having shot film since I was 9 years old.

Lee, almost everything you ever write screams of a conservative, narrow-minded ideology and world perspective, at least as it pertains to photography and photo equipment.  Just sayin'.  I have no idea how you live the rest of your life, but the opinions you express on these forums are  definitely of an unbending, inflexible old-school ideologue.  It's certainly possible that you're "not even remotely conservative" in other aspects of your life, but even you have to agree that your attitudes and opinions expressed here on these forums are very conservative, very status quo, very narrow, very rigid.  You might as well just embrace it, because it is what it is.

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