1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Started Jul 21, 2012 | Discussions
inasir1971
inasir1971 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,872
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Thank you for the comparison.

I think a number of issues have already been pointed out. I previously shot with Canon and I think that the test is more a test of the lens AF motor speed than anything else. The Nikon primes are somewhat slow in this respect - not as fast as lenses such as the 70-200 VRII and as many of the Canon USM's.

In practice though as they rarely need to rack from one extreme to the other real world differences are less.

Nevertheless thank you for the comparison.

 inasir1971's gear list:inasir1971's gear list
Nikon Z6 Sony a6400 Sony a7C Nikon AF-S Nikkor 24mm f/1.4G ED Nikon AF-S Nikkor 200mm f/2G ED VR II +13 more
DMT Regular Member • Posts: 234
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

So your complains about contrast and colors are not about the cameras. They are about how Adobe has chosen to render these at default settings. Again this should be mentioned in the review so that everybody understands the methodology and its limitations. Your comments are useful only to those who usually avoid any adjustement to Adobe ACR default settings.

This is EXACTLY correct...the Adobe profile is CRAP compared to camera standard...not changing this default in Lightroom makes NEFs look like GARBAGE.

Also, 3D AF is mind-blowing in low light/darkness, far better than single point AF. In fact, D4 AF is simple incredible in every situation I've shot with over a dozen lenses.

Just sayin'.

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rhlpetrus Forum Pro • Posts: 26,535
AF finetuning Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

I really think the accuracy test is flwaed. Any modern or not so modern camera can produce better results than what they have posted, espceially the portrait test. And 100% (12/12), once finetuned, is much better than 75% (9/12), on a legit test.

Even the lowly D7k and the cheap Sigma 17-50 can produce amazingly sharp eyes and detail:

-- hide signature --

Renato.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rhlpedrosa/
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Good shooting and good luck
(after Ed Murrow)

 rhlpetrus's gear list:rhlpetrus's gear list
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Louis Peeples Regular Member • Posts: 178
Re: AF finetuning Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

I shot a wedding last night with a D4 and my friend had a Canon M3. I have to say, while not an indicator or the image itself, the LCD looked amazing compared to the Nikon. It was rich in color, perfect color balance and bright. Maybe its my settings and maybe Nikon can tweak with firmware.

OP XeroJay Senior Member • Posts: 2,341
Re: AF finetuning Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

I agree, which is why we scrapped the 85mm's and re-shot with the 70-200's This way much much closer.

It the end, I think it's more revealing about the lenses than the AF. That's why we made sure not to conclude anything from this particular test, except that if these are in fact the exact cameras and lenses that Matt's choosing between, we would both take what we saw from the Canon combo.

I really do hope that people can see that we really tried to make it clear that this wasn't a scientific, black & white test (the AF consistency segment), but rather just us documenting and discussing what we found.

 XeroJay's gear list:XeroJay's gear list
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MOD TOF guy Forum Pro • Posts: 16,240
Re: AF finetuning Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Louis Peeples wrote:

I shot a wedding last night with a D4 and my friend had a Canon M3. I have to say, while not an indicator or the image itself, the LCD looked amazing compared to the Nikon. It was rich in color, perfect color balance and bright. Maybe its my settings and maybe Nikon can tweak with firmware.

I haven't compared myself but there has definitely been complains about the D4 LCD screen, and one can find pictures on the web comparing the D4 to the D3 (or D700 - can't remember), and it looks like the D4 is off (or at least more so than the D3). On the other end other users report that their back LCD screen is find. Taste at play? Sample variations?

If that was important to me I'd ask Nikon to evaluate the LCD and possibly adjust it, before of going through all the hassle of a switch, not to mention that the grass is not always less green on the other side of the fence
--
Thierry

 TOF guy's gear list:TOF guy's gear list
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MOD TOF guy Forum Pro • Posts: 16,240
Re: AF finetuning Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

XeroJay wrote:

It the end, I think it's more revealing about the lenses than the AF.

A flawed procedure may lead to a flawed conclusion.

That's why we made sure not to conclude anything from this particular test, except that if these are in fact the exact cameras and lenses that Matt's choosing between, we would both take what we saw from the Canon combo.

There is a lot to like about the Canon system (the 1Dx would not even be at the top of my list of what the Canon has to offer that Nikon does not quite match, but to each her or his own), and very good reasons to switch from one system to another. If the colors on the D4 back LCD gets in the way of your shooting, and the 1Dx does what you want right off the bat, then you have a rationale to switch. Likewise you may not want to spend time looking into fine tuning your lens or troubleshooting whatever is preventing the D4 to focus properly, and you have in your hands a 1Dx which does what you want. So why not stick with the latter. Same reasoning for adjusting the default rendition in Adobe Lightroom. It's your decision, of course. To me it looks like a lot of money and time spent to fix what I see as non-issues, or easily fixed ones.

I really do hope that people can see that we really tried to make it clear that this wasn't a scientific, black & white test (the AF consistency segment), but rather just us documenting and discussing what we found.

Thank you for trying

-- hide signature --

Thierry

 TOF guy's gear list:TOF guy's gear list
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SubPrime Senior Member • Posts: 1,238
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

So has Matt sold off his Nikon gear or planning to?

XeroJay wrote:

Hey everyone,
just wanted to share the 1DX vs D4 comparison that we've just posted.

Have a look:

http://xerodigital.ca/canon-1dx-nikon-d4/

premsaggar New Member • Posts: 23
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

I have both the D4 and the 1DX and my findings are similar to yours. I primarily shoot action/sports photography. When shooting fast action sports, I get about twice as many keeper shots in focus with the D4 than I do with the 1DX.

However, when the 1DX hits it’s really astonishing and the detail in the shot is much better than the D4. I think this is due to the lens characteristics of each brand. Nikon’s 70-200g lens tends to be sharper across the frame at all apertures while Canon’s 70-200L lens has enormous bokeh and better center sharpness when open or near wide open. (This is a lens difference not a camera difference)

However, even at F/8, with me perfectly focusing on the subject the 1DX will occasionally miss focus and be blurry. The Nikon is never blurry with perfect subject focus and an aperture of F/8. (This is a camera difference)

I’ve also noticed the 1DX underexposes by 1 stop, especially in low light situations. This destroys the shot. I’ve tried AE compensation but that tends to really overexpose or over saturate the colors. However, when the exposure on the 1DX is correct (with lots of natural light in the shot) the picture is amazing and much better than the D4. This is a clear camera difference and it’s tough to for me to pick a winner. The D4 is reliable whereas the 1DX is like playing the lottery.

ONLY, If you can afford to lose a shot AND if you intend to shoot in good lighting then the 1DX is a better choice. However, the D4 produces the second best images on the planet second only to the 1DX, that too only when the 1DX hits the lottery in great lighting.

I ran the same autofocus speed tests and noticed the 1DX and D4 were very close in autofocus speed. However, my autofocus settings definitely have affected the tests. My autofocus speed test:
1) was shot indoors in low light
2) focused on a near subject and then a far subject
3) used the 70-200 2.8 image stabilized top end lenses from both brands
4) did not use tracking on either camera

5) Canon settings were Case 2: all set to 2 for super speed and no subject track holding so autofocus should be instantaneous

6) Nikon settings were Focus Tracking with lock-on: Off, so that the camera would focus on new subjects instantly just like the canon. If focus tracking is not turned off autofocus speed dropped largely on the Nikon (by design since it’s looking for the old subject before acquiring focus on a new subject). What were your autofocus settings on each camera? Canon’s settings make a big difference too in speed. Changing any of case 2's settings from 2 to even 1 slows down autofocus enormously.
7) I used 9 point area focus with no subject tracking.

With these settings it was a tie in speed for me.

If you use the D4 in Auto White Balance mode 2 the pictures are nearly as lush as the Canons. In fact in this mode the raw files are INCREDIBLE and are MUCH better than Canon’s raws and jpegs. In either white balance mode Nikon is much better at raw files. That is really important if you are submitting your work to some Raw only shops. However, Canon kills, I mean destroys, Nikon when it comes to jpeg processing. I really don’t think Nikon cares about this because it expects it’s raw files to be awesome and be edited accordingly. Nikon should improve their jpeg processing and Canon should improve their raw processing.

It’s a tough call. I also think Nikon’s flash systems and lenses are superior to Canons so when you look at the systems overall it’s tough.

If you must choose one and:
1) your a pro

2) assuming the green screen issue has been solved and people are reporting it’s been solved with firmware 1.02 above
3) you are going to shoot in poor lighting without a flash

then I’d say… get the Nikon D4. The 1DX shows ultimate promise but it’s just too inconsistent for me and is only much better when the lighting is great.

I'm continuing to test both cameras but these are my findings as of right now.
Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Thanks,
Prem

SubPrime Senior Member • Posts: 1,238
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Superb post Prem.

I have to agree with you on the autofocus speed issue.

I don't have a D4, but with my D700, I was able to get much faster acquisition speeds than the video suggested, using the same settings as you described.

premsaggar wrote:

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

I have both the D4 and the 1DX and my findings are similar to yours. I primarily shoot action/sports photography. When shooting fast action sports, I get about twice as many keeper shots in focus with the D4 than I do with the 1DX.

However, when the 1DX hits it’s really astonishing and the detail in the shot is much better than the D4. I think this is due to the lens characteristics of each brand. Nikon’s 70-200g lens tends to be sharper across the frame at all apertures while Canon’s 70-200L lens has enormous bokeh and better center sharpness when open or near wide open. (This is a lens difference not a camera difference)

However, even at F/8, with me perfectly focusing on the subject the 1DX will occasionally miss focus and be blurry. The Nikon is never blurry with perfect subject focus and an aperture of F/8. (This is a camera difference)

I’ve also noticed the 1DX underexposes by 1 stop, especially in low light situations. This destroys the shot. I’ve tried AE compensation but that tends to really overexpose or over saturate the colors. However, when the exposure on the 1DX is correct (with lots of natural light in the shot) the picture is amazing and much better than the D4. This is a clear camera difference and it’s tough to for me to pick a winner. The D4 is reliable whereas the 1DX is like playing the lottery.

ONLY, If you can afford to lose a shot AND if you intend to shoot in good lighting then the 1DX is a better choice. However, the D4 produces the second best images on the planet second only to the 1DX, that too only when the 1DX hits the lottery in great lighting.

I ran the same autofocus speed tests and noticed the 1DX and D4 were very close in autofocus speed. However, my autofocus settings definitely have affected the tests. My autofocus speed test:
1) was shot indoors in low light
2) focused on a near subject and then a far subject
3) used the 70-200 2.8 image stabilized top end lenses from both brands
4) did not use tracking on either camera

5) Canon settings were Case 2: all set to 2 for super speed and no subject track holding so autofocus should be instantaneous

6) Nikon settings were Focus Tracking with lock-on: Off, so that the camera would focus on new subjects instantly just like the canon. If focus tracking is not turned off autofocus speed dropped largely on the Nikon (by design since it’s looking for the old subject before acquiring focus on a new subject). What were your autofocus settings on each camera? Canon’s settings make a big difference too in speed. Changing any of case 2's settings from 2 to even 1 slows down autofocus enormously.
7) I used 9 point area focus with no subject tracking.

With these settings it was a tie in speed for me.

If you use the D4 in Auto White Balance mode 2 the pictures are nearly as lush as the Canons. In fact in this mode the raw files are INCREDIBLE and are MUCH better than Canon’s raws and jpegs. In either white balance mode Nikon is much better at raw files. That is really important if you are submitting your work to some Raw only shops. However, Canon kills, I mean destroys, Nikon when it comes to jpeg processing. I really don’t think Nikon cares about this because it expects it’s raw files to be awesome and be edited accordingly. Nikon should improve their jpeg processing and Canon should improve their raw processing.

It’s a tough call. I also think Nikon’s flash systems and lenses are superior to Canons so when you look at the systems overall it’s tough.

If you must choose one and:
1) your a pro

2) assuming the green screen issue has been solved and people are reporting it’s been solved with firmware 1.02 above
3) you are going to shoot in poor lighting without a flash

then I’d say… get the Nikon D4. The 1DX shows ultimate promise but it’s just too inconsistent for me and is only much better when the lighting is great.

I'm continuing to test both cameras but these are my findings as of right now.
Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Thanks,
Prem

Maji Contributing Member • Posts: 734
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Great comparison Prem. I am glad that someone who knows the strengths and limitations of both the systems are speaking out.

premsaggar wrote:

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

I have both the D4 and the 1DX and my findings are similar to yours. I primarily shoot action/sports photography. When shooting fast action sports, I get about twice as many keeper shots in focus with the D4 than I do with the 1DX.

However, when the 1DX hits it’s really astonishing and the detail in the shot is much better than the D4. I think this is due to the lens characteristics of each brand. Nikon’s 70-200g lens tends to be sharper across the frame at all apertures while Canon’s 70-200L lens has enormous bokeh and better center sharpness when open or near wide open. (This is a lens difference not a camera difference)

However, even at F/8, with me perfectly focusing on the subject the 1DX will occasionally miss focus and be blurry. The Nikon is never blurry with perfect subject focus and an aperture of F/8. (This is a camera difference)

I’ve also noticed the 1DX underexposes by 1 stop, especially in low light situations. This destroys the shot. I’ve tried AE compensation but that tends to really overexpose or over saturate the colors. However, when the exposure on the 1DX is correct (with lots of natural light in the shot) the picture is amazing and much better than the D4. This is a clear camera difference and it’s tough to for me to pick a winner. The D4 is reliable whereas the 1DX is like playing the lottery.

ONLY, If you can afford to lose a shot AND if you intend to shoot in good lighting then the 1DX is a better choice. However, the D4 produces the second best images on the planet second only to the 1DX, that too only when the 1DX hits the lottery in great lighting.

I ran the same autofocus speed tests and noticed the 1DX and D4 were very close in autofocus speed. However, my autofocus settings definitely have affected the tests. My autofocus speed test:
1) was shot indoors in low light
2) focused on a near subject and then a far subject
3) used the 70-200 2.8 image stabilized top end lenses from both brands
4) did not use tracking on either camera

5) Canon settings were Case 2: all set to 2 for super speed and no subject track holding so autofocus should be instantaneous

6) Nikon settings were Focus Tracking with lock-on: Off, so that the camera would focus on new subjects instantly just like the canon. If focus tracking is not turned off autofocus speed dropped largely on the Nikon (by design since it’s looking for the old subject before acquiring focus on a new subject). What were your autofocus settings on each camera? Canon’s settings make a big difference too in speed. Changing any of case 2's settings from 2 to even 1 slows down autofocus enormously.
7) I used 9 point area focus with no subject tracking.

With these settings it was a tie in speed for me.

If you use the D4 in Auto White Balance mode 2 the pictures are nearly as lush as the Canons. In fact in this mode the raw files are INCREDIBLE and are MUCH better than Canon’s raws and jpegs. In either white balance mode Nikon is much better at raw files. That is really important if you are submitting your work to some Raw only shops. However, Canon kills, I mean destroys, Nikon when it comes to jpeg processing. I really don’t think Nikon cares about this because it expects it’s raw files to be awesome and be edited accordingly. Nikon should improve their jpeg processing and Canon should improve their raw processing.

It’s a tough call. I also think Nikon’s flash systems and lenses are superior to Canons so when you look at the systems overall it’s tough.

If you must choose one and:
1) your a pro

2) assuming the green screen issue has been solved and people are reporting it’s been solved with firmware 1.02 above
3) you are going to shoot in poor lighting without a flash

then I’d say… get the Nikon D4. The 1DX shows ultimate promise but it’s just too inconsistent for me and is only much better when the lighting is great.

I'm continuing to test both cameras but these are my findings as of right now.
Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Thanks,
Prem

 Maji's gear list:Maji's gear list
Nikon Coolpix P500 Nikon D800 Nikon 1 V2 Nikon D7100 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR +6 more
OP XeroJay Senior Member • Posts: 2,341
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Okay, I'm only going to touch on the firmware issue that you've posted;

There is NO fix for the green screen issue. Show me where in that firmware release Nikon even addresses the green cast? What you're referring to is a gamut issue with aRGB only. Not the colour.

I've been flooded with people claiming that Nikon fixed the green screen colour accuracy/calibration issue with a firmware release. They have not.

premsaggar wrote:

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

I have both the D4 and the 1DX and my findings are similar to yours. I primarily shoot action/sports photography. When shooting fast action sports, I get about twice as many keeper shots in focus with the D4 than I do with the 1DX.

However, when the 1DX hits it’s really astonishing and the detail in the shot is much better than the D4. I think this is due to the lens characteristics of each brand. Nikon’s 70-200g lens tends to be sharper across the frame at all apertures while Canon’s 70-200L lens has enormous bokeh and better center sharpness when open or near wide open. (This is a lens difference not a camera difference)

However, even at F/8, with me perfectly focusing on the subject the 1DX will occasionally miss focus and be blurry. The Nikon is never blurry with perfect subject focus and an aperture of F/8. (This is a camera difference)

I’ve also noticed the 1DX underexposes by 1 stop, especially in low light situations. This destroys the shot. I’ve tried AE compensation but that tends to really overexpose or over saturate the colors. However, when the exposure on the 1DX is correct (with lots of natural light in the shot) the picture is amazing and much better than the D4. This is a clear camera difference and it’s tough to for me to pick a winner. The D4 is reliable whereas the 1DX is like playing the lottery.

ONLY, If you can afford to lose a shot AND if you intend to shoot in good lighting then the 1DX is a better choice. However, the D4 produces the second best images on the planet second only to the 1DX, that too only when the 1DX hits the lottery in great lighting.

I ran the same autofocus speed tests and noticed the 1DX and D4 were very close in autofocus speed. However, my autofocus settings definitely have affected the tests. My autofocus speed test:
1) was shot indoors in low light
2) focused on a near subject and then a far subject
3) used the 70-200 2.8 image stabilized top end lenses from both brands
4) did not use tracking on either camera

5) Canon settings were Case 2: all set to 2 for super speed and no subject track holding so autofocus should be instantaneous

6) Nikon settings were Focus Tracking with lock-on: Off, so that the camera would focus on new subjects instantly just like the canon. If focus tracking is not turned off autofocus speed dropped largely on the Nikon (by design since it’s looking for the old subject before acquiring focus on a new subject). What were your autofocus settings on each camera? Canon’s settings make a big difference too in speed. Changing any of case 2's settings from 2 to even 1 slows down autofocus enormously.
7) I used 9 point area focus with no subject tracking.

With these settings it was a tie in speed for me.

If you use the D4 in Auto White Balance mode 2 the pictures are nearly as lush as the Canons. In fact in this mode the raw files are INCREDIBLE and are MUCH better than Canon’s raws and jpegs. In either white balance mode Nikon is much better at raw files. That is really important if you are submitting your work to some Raw only shops. However, Canon kills, I mean destroys, Nikon when it comes to jpeg processing. I really don’t think Nikon cares about this because it expects it’s raw files to be awesome and be edited accordingly. Nikon should improve their jpeg processing and Canon should improve their raw processing.

It’s a tough call. I also think Nikon’s flash systems and lenses are superior to Canons so when you look at the systems overall it’s tough.

If you must choose one and:
1) your a pro

2) assuming the green screen issue has been solved and people are reporting it’s been solved with firmware 1.02 above
3) you are going to shoot in poor lighting without a flash

then I’d say… get the Nikon D4. The 1DX shows ultimate promise but it’s just too inconsistent for me and is only much better when the lighting is great.

I'm continuing to test both cameras but these are my findings as of right now.
Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Thanks,
Prem

 XeroJay's gear list:XeroJay's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Sony a9 Sony a7 III Canon EF 100mm F2.8L Macro IS USM Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM +7 more
jjnik Senior Member • Posts: 1,319
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

premsaggar wrote:

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

Firmware has been on Nikon USA site for a while:

http://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/17830

jroyer Forum Member • Posts: 99
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

I too have both the 1DX and the D4 and I would have to agree with most of your comments. You make some very good observation. My biggest problem right now is originally I thought it would be easy for me to test both camera and simply sell the one I will not use, but man I am having a hard time deciding because I love them both!

One thing I notice for the RAW files is if you use lightroom for example, settings that work well for the D4 will look terrible for the 1DX and vise versa. I always have my own preset I apply when importing RAW files into LR4 and it took me wuite a bit of time to figure out which setup I needed for the 1DX. Now that I feel I have, I have to agree with you when lighting is good the 1DX can produce some very spectacular image.

Even in poor lighting, it is pretty good and while I thought I prefered the D4 for shooting low light (say ISO 1600 to ISO 6400), now that I figured out the right settings in Lightroom, I have a hard time deciding which is best.

My focus next will be on shooting sports and moving objects because this is where the 1DX really amazed me when I first got it. I actually get the opposite result as some of you in that my keeper rate was higher with the 1DX compared to the D4. I plan to run both camera through similar shooting I have done recently and compare result.

I know it makes no sense, but I am really tempted to keep both!

 jroyer's gear list:jroyer's gear list
Sony a7R IV Sony a9 II Sony FE 55mm F1.8 Sony FE 24-70mm F2.8 GM Sony FE 85mm F1.4 GM +5 more
jjnik Senior Member • Posts: 1,319
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

XeroJay wrote:

Okay, I'm only going to touch on the firmware issue that you've posted;

There is NO fix for the green screen issue. Show me where in that firmware release Nikon even addresses the green cast? What you're referring to is a gamut issue with aRGB only. Not the colour.

I've been flooded with people claiming that Nikon fixed the green screen colour accuracy/calibration issue with a firmware release. They have not.

At least for some of us, there is no green screen colour accuracy/calibration issue. I have both a D4 and a D800E and there is NO green tint on either the LCD screen or the files themselves - exact same look in that regard as my old D3 and D700.

Please note that I'm not saying your particular camera did not have an issue - just clarifying that all of these cameras don't. Mine are both new within the last 3 weeks, so perhaps earlier issues were already fixed?

OP XeroJay Senior Member • Posts: 2,341
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Again, there is no fix via firmware for the green screen. I've been contacted by dozens of people, all pointing to the same firmware. It does not fix the green cast.

I'm now calling on the same people who claim that Nikon has fixed the green screen issue via firmware: PLEASE back this up. Show me where Nikon addresses this via firmware. This is a HUGE factor for our test.

So far no one who has made the claim that it's been fixed via firmware has gotten back to me with anything that backs this up. Again, the aRGB gamut issue addressed in the latest firmware does not correct the green tint.

 XeroJay's gear list:XeroJay's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Sony a9 Sony a7 III Canon EF 100mm F2.8L Macro IS USM Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM +7 more
premsaggar New Member • Posts: 23
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Hi,

So I was on a shoot last Saturday and noticed the green lcd issue. It was very obvious and it was a major problem. I updated to firmware 1.02 2 days ago and the green screen issue is gone. I now see the colors correctly. Nikon does tend to boost greens and Canon tends to boost reds. Those boosts show up but nothing as bad as the green screen lcd issue from before.

Xerojay have you upgraded the firmware to 1.02? Is your screen still green? If you could post some pictures of it that would be great. Here are some shots I just took with the 1DX and D4 illustrating the lack of green screen. http://www.flickr.com/photos/55908697@N02/sets/72157630761646682/detail/

If possible, please post your autofocus settings for both cameras. While the green screen issue may become debatable or doable for Nikon users, the autofocus claim is gigantic and a valid reason for some to purchase/sell one vs the other. I do think more people are concerned with the autofocus speeds vs the green screen right now.

I want to add that your review is great and I'm very thankful for you posting it. I'm not a Nikon or Canon fanboy and I'm not trying to demean your review at all. It is excellent, I'm just curious about a few settings. I believe working together we can truly figure out which camera is in fact better.

Thanks,
Prem

inasir1971
inasir1971 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,872
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

jjnik wrote:

At least for some of us, there is no green screen colour accuracy/calibration issue. I have both a D4 and a D800E and there is NO green tint on either the LCD screen or the files themselves - exact same look in that regard as my old D3 and D700.

Please note that I'm not saying your particular camera did not have an issue - just clarifying that all of these cameras don't. Mine are both new within the last 3 weeks, so perhaps earlier issues were already fixed?

I had a greenish tint on my D800 which I got first and seemed to go away after a several weeks (or I got used to it?). When my D800E and D4 arrived they were quite normal. Maybe it's something like an adhesive or some leftover from the manufacturing process which goes away? (My D800 was one of the first batch - D800E's were aged by Nikon before release)

Is your D4 new?

 inasir1971's gear list:inasir1971's gear list
Nikon Z6 Sony a6400 Sony a7C Nikon AF-S Nikkor 24mm f/1.4G ED Nikon AF-S Nikkor 200mm f/2G ED VR II +13 more
nikhgan Senior Member • Posts: 1,552
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

I have D4 and I don't notice any green cast. The LCD color is perfect.

XeroJay wrote:

Again, there is no fix via firmware for the green screen. I've been contacted by dozens of people, all pointing to the same firmware. It does not fix the green cast.

I'm now calling on the same people who claim that Nikon has fixed the green screen issue via firmware: PLEASE back this up. Show me where Nikon addresses this via firmware. This is a HUGE factor for our test.

So far no one who has made the claim that it's been fixed via firmware has gotten back to me with anything that backs this up. Again, the aRGB gamut issue addressed in the latest firmware does not correct the green tint.

nikhgan Senior Member • Posts: 1,552
Re: 1DX vs D4 Head to Head

Very good reviews.
thanks.

premsaggar wrote:

Hi. The comparison is good but a few important details were left out.

Nikon recently released a firmware update 1.02 for the D4 that has fixed the green lcd screen. For some reason the update is on the Nikon Europe site and not on the Nikon USA site . Here’s a link to the firmware: https://nikoneurope-en.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53057

I have both the D4 and the 1DX and my findings are similar to yours. I primarily shoot action/sports photography. When shooting fast action sports, I get about twice as many keeper shots in focus with the D4 than I do with the 1DX.

However, when the 1DX hits it’s really astonishing and the detail in the shot is much better than the D4. I think this is due to the lens characteristics of each brand. Nikon’s 70-200g lens tends to be sharper across the frame at all apertures while Canon’s 70-200L lens has enormous bokeh and better center sharpness when open or near wide open. (This is a lens difference not a camera difference)

However, even at F/8, with me perfectly focusing on the subject the 1DX will occasionally miss focus and be blurry. The Nikon is never blurry with perfect subject focus and an aperture of F/8. (This is a camera difference)

I’ve also noticed the 1DX underexposes by 1 stop, especially in low light situations. This destroys the shot. I’ve tried AE compensation but that tends to really overexpose or over saturate the colors. However, when the exposure on the 1DX is correct (with lots of natural light in the shot) the picture is amazing and much better than the D4. This is a clear camera difference and it’s tough to for me to pick a winner. The D4 is reliable whereas the 1DX is like playing the lottery.

ONLY, If you can afford to lose a shot AND if you intend to shoot in good lighting then the 1DX is a better choice. However, the D4 produces the second best images on the planet second only to the 1DX, that too only when the 1DX hits the lottery in great lighting.

I ran the same autofocus speed tests and noticed the 1DX and D4 were very close in autofocus speed. However, my autofocus settings definitely have affected the tests. My autofocus speed test:
1) was shot indoors in low light
2) focused on a near subject and then a far subject
3) used the 70-200 2.8 image stabilized top end lenses from both brands
4) did not use tracking on either camera

5) Canon settings were Case 2: all set to 2 for super speed and no subject track holding so autofocus should be instantaneous

6) Nikon settings were Focus Tracking with lock-on: Off, so that the camera would focus on new subjects instantly just like the canon. If focus tracking is not turned off autofocus speed dropped largely on the Nikon (by design since it’s looking for the old subject before acquiring focus on a new subject). What were your autofocus settings on each camera? Canon’s settings make a big difference too in speed. Changing any of case 2's settings from 2 to even 1 slows down autofocus enormously.
7) I used 9 point area focus with no subject tracking.

With these settings it was a tie in speed for me.

If you use the D4 in Auto White Balance mode 2 the pictures are nearly as lush as the Canons. In fact in this mode the raw files are INCREDIBLE and are MUCH better than Canon’s raws and jpegs. In either white balance mode Nikon is much better at raw files. That is really important if you are submitting your work to some Raw only shops. However, Canon kills, I mean destroys, Nikon when it comes to jpeg processing. I really don’t think Nikon cares about this because it expects it’s raw files to be awesome and be edited accordingly. Nikon should improve their jpeg processing and Canon should improve their raw processing.

It’s a tough call. I also think Nikon’s flash systems and lenses are superior to Canons so when you look at the systems overall it’s tough.

If you must choose one and:
1) your a pro

2) assuming the green screen issue has been solved and people are reporting it’s been solved with firmware 1.02 above
3) you are going to shoot in poor lighting without a flash

then I’d say… get the Nikon D4. The 1DX shows ultimate promise but it’s just too inconsistent for me and is only much better when the lighting is great.

I'm continuing to test both cameras but these are my findings as of right now.
Maybe I’m wrong what do you think?

Thanks,
Prem

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