7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Started Dec 28, 2011 | Discussions
TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Hi All,

1st post, but I joined just to discuss the "issues" we seem to be having with dissatisfaction on the 7D in not producing sharp pictures. We made a huge leap from the EOS Rebel (KISS) to the 7D and it seems that the pictures are softer in many situations - not the crystal clear sharpness we were used to on the Rebel even using the same lenses.

I'm aware that a lot of issues exist in making a comparison like this but I could put the camera's side by side and then post pictures when we get back to the UK.

Comments? has anyone else seen this or felt this way?

We are especially disappointed with people shots (group) indoors with the EFS 17-55 f2.8 for dof and sharpness at f4.0 flash settings.

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TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
Canon EOS 7D
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Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Talking about image sharpness and not posting any, is like talking about music and not hearing anything.

Once you post images with "cuestionable" sharpness, we can continue this debate.

BTW, I wasn't aware of any particular sharpness "issue" regarding the 7D or any of the other brothers in sensor (60D/600D/550D).

TimPATL wrote:

Hi All,

1st post, but I joined just to discuss the "issues" we seem to be having with dissatisfaction on the 7D in not producing sharp pictures. We made a huge leap from the EOS Rebel (KISS) to the 7D and it seems that the pictures are softer in many situations - not the crystal clear sharpness we were used to on the Rebel even using the same lenses.

I'm aware that a lot of issues exist in making a comparison like this but I could put the camera's side by side and then post pictures when we get back to the UK.

Comments? has anyone else seen this or felt this way?

We are especially disappointed with people shots (group) indoors with the EFS 17-55 f2.8 for dof and sharpness at f4.0 flash settings.

-- hide signature --

TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

-- hide signature --

Martin Ocando
-------------------------

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bhollis
bhollis Veteran Member • Posts: 3,429
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

A properly functioning 7D is perfectly capable of taking very sharp pics. So if you're having problems, then either there's something wrong with your 7D, your lens, or your technique.

In order to get any help, you'll need to post some sample pics.

OP TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Also, just read similar posts. It is likely our usage, but trying to figure out where to start to get things right. I tried using the MFA tests shooting at a computer screen with the Moire interference pattern.

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/article_pages/cameras/1ds3_af_micoadjustment.html

I could not see an adjustment required for our efs 17-55 f2.8 or the Macro 100mm

Maybe I'm missing something but AF goes to the same place as the manual.
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
MirkoB Regular Member • Posts: 331
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

My 7D producing nice sharp images with every lens i have (17-40L, 70-200L, 10-20EX, 100 macro L, 50 1,8, 170-500) even wide open.

Even now here in Afghanistan very often i am taking photos thru 2 inch !!! thick balistic window and most of the photos are acceptable. Also dnt have any above normal problem with noise. Am i just too lucky or what?
--
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OP TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Okay, Here is one the boss is unhappy with.

430ex Ceiling Bounce in Auto (to remove operator error)
Second row of boys out of focus, boy to the left only sharp character
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Last 4 posts indicate:

Check the user's stats in DPreview's latest 4 7D sharpness "issue" threads:

Rossdowg 6 threads
Dosquattros 1 thread
Lochman88 2 threads
Yourself, only 1 thread

So, are there way too many trolls or newbies around here. Once you start seeing threads from seasoned photographers regarding lack of quality of 7D images, then and just then, if properly supported with images and tests, we can start worrying.

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Martin Ocando
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bhollis
bhollis Veteran Member • Posts: 3,429
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

You really need to post some samples we can look at. But chances are that you've either got a focusing problem, or you're using too low a shutter speed, or both.

What mode are you shooting in? If you're in auto, the camera will just focus on whatever is nearest the camera--which is frequently not what you want it to focus on.

If you're not already doing so, set your AF mode to single point/one shot. Using the center point, focus on a high contrast, stationary subject. Make sure your shutter speed is at least 1/100 second or higher. See what that does for you.

Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

This image is Out Of Focus. Obviously you are using automatic AF selection, and the AF selected the flowers as primary AF point, so is focused there. The faces are soft because of focus, and not lack of sharpness.

So in short, learn to use your equipment before complaining about quality.

TimPATL wrote:

Okay, Here is one the boss is unhappy with.

430ex Ceiling Bounce in Auto (to remove operator error)
Second row of boys out of focus, boy to the left only sharp character
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Martin Ocando
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bhollis
bhollis Veteran Member • Posts: 3,429
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

TimPATL wrote:

Okay, Here is one the boss is unhappy with.

430ex Ceiling Bounce in Auto (to remove operator error)
Second row of boys out of focus, boy to the left only sharp character
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

You've got a focusing issue. The flowers are reasonably sharp, while the people are slightly OOF. What mode was this shot in? If in auto, that's your problem. In auto, the camera will just focus on whatever is nearest the camera--in this case, the flowers.

Lemming51
Lemming51 Forum Pro • Posts: 14,712
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

That pic is plenty sharp.

There is only one plane of focus, you cannot have people at different distances all with the same level of sharp focus. If you used Auto AF Selection, then the camera is going to focus on the nearest subject covered by the AF sensors (the boy on the left). The other people are all farther from the camera and so will be less in focus. The most you can do is focus to the middle distance of the near and far subject that you want "in focus" and use a smaller aperture (f/5.6 or 8 instead of 4).

There is some softness related to the 'grainier' look of ISO 1600. With bounce flash, Auto ISO typically chooses ISO this high. Try manually setting ISO to 400.

TimPATL wrote:

Okay, Here is one the boss is unhappy with.

430ex Ceiling Bounce in Auto (to remove operator error)
Second row of boys out of focus, boy to the left only sharp character
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Unapologetic Canon Apologist

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MirkoB Regular Member • Posts: 331
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Check your AF point and you will be suprised
--
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Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Activate AF point display on preview

Look for the Custom Function that activates the display of the AF point used during the shot, so, upon auto review, you'll see where the AF selected and make the corrections necessary.

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Martin Ocando
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OP TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied
1

I wish your mother would have told you "If you don't have something nice to say then don't say anything at all"

Look at later posts to see what helpful looks like. I'm not complaining about the 7D, I'm trying to understand the perceived loss of quality we experienced and I'm damn sure it's operator error - so thanks for pointing that out.
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
OP TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
Re: Activate AF point display on preview

These last few posts have been extremely helpful - thank you so much! It's back to the drawing board on focus.

The Rebel was so easy - point and shoot and I guess it's simplicity ensured a good output. I didn't expect to have to work so hard for casual pictures to be good and vs. Nikon, I'd always heard that the Autofocus on Canon ruled the business.
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Look down, and I can do helpful as well. Is just not right to "blame" the equipment before considering user error. Specially with a camera that have been out in the market for so long. It gives a wrong idea to potential customers, and many just read a couple of posts and start spreading the word. Remember, a lie told a million times becomes true.

I'm more than willing to share my experiences and continue helping you as best as I can.

Sorry for my initial approach, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

TimPATL wrote:

I wish your mother would have told you "If you don't have something nice to say then don't say anything at all"

Look at later posts to see what helpful looks like. I'm not complaining about the 7D, I'm trying to understand the perceived loss of quality we experienced and I'm damn sure it's operator error - so thanks for pointing that out.
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Martin Ocando
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Martin Ocando
Martin Ocando Veteran Member • Posts: 5,874
Re: Activate AF point display on preview

It does, but you can get really frustrated if you try to use a Pro level DSLR as a point and shoot. Is not designed to be used that way. There are just too many settings already set as the way the Pros use them, that you'll find yourself struggling to find a completely auto mode that takes good pictures fast and easy.

Rebels have all kind of scene modes to help converts in the process, but you won't find those on the 7D.

Keep asking, and we'll keep helping.

Cheers

TimPATL wrote:

These last few posts have been extremely helpful - thank you so much! It's back to the drawing board on focus.

The Rebel was so easy - point and shoot and I guess it's simplicity ensured a good output. I didn't expect to have to work so hard for casual pictures to be good and vs. Nikon, I'd always heard that the Autofocus on Canon ruled the business.
--
TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Martin Ocando
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OP TimPATL New Member • Posts: 9
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

Thanks, I was being a smart ass and should have held my tongue.

I love Canon equipment and I take a lot of abuse in the Camera Club in the UK from the Nikon crowd.

We may have jumped to semi-pro equipment too quickly but we plan to grow into it and you all have been amazingly helpful.

We have done quite well in some competitive events in Surrey, UK were we live most of the time during my job. Those pictures, given the attention to detail and equipment have been most satisfactory (excellent).

It is in the casual moment without concentration that we experience the most frustration.

We love our Canon 7D, we need to become better operators

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TimP in ATL (& sometimes the UK)

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Canon EOS 7D Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM
Faintandfuzzy Veteran Member • Posts: 3,328
Re: Last 4 posts indicate:

I shoot professionaly with a 7D, D700, K20D, F5, RB67, and 4x5 rig. Since day one, I've found my 7D to be razor sharp with no issues....as long as post processing and sharpening is understood by the user. A number of other local pros I hang out with who have the 7D have found no issues with it either.

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Mark B. Forum Pro • Posts: 23,737
Re: 7D Sharpness - disatissfied

TimPATL wrote:

Okay, Here is one the boss is unhappy with.

I don't blame him. The flowers are protruding into the young lady's face on the right

430ex Ceiling Bounce in Auto (to remove operator error)
Second row of boys out of focus, boy to the left only sharp character
--

Stop down a bit more - f/4 isn't giving enough depth of field. Try at least f/5 or f/5.6.

Mark

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