Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

Started Oct 4, 2011 | Discussions
Robert_Hicks Forum Member • Posts: 77
4s samples

http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/#camera

go down to the

The you-can’t-believe-it’s-on-a-phone camera.

section then over on the right where the balloon picture is click on View Gallery. This gives an idea of what to expect.

kelpdiver Veteran Member • Posts: 3,624
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

PaulRivers wrote:

I barely get through 200 pics before I give up through them in a folder and forget about it.

Ah, well then yes, there's no point in an SLR for you. Sometimes I forget I'm in the Talk group. If I took 200 pics, I'd end up with 5-10 keepers at best. I understand that recent cameras have taken face recognition one step further and can detect blinking, which is brilliant, but still lots of ways subjects can ruin the shot if you only take one.

kelpdiver Veteran Member • Posts: 3,624
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

B1ackhat wrote:

I have never seen a hiker/backpacker with a dSLR in the tens of thousands of miles I have spent on the trails. I am speaking of real hikers/backpackers of course, not those ridiculous wannabe weekend warriors who head out for a couple miles in jeans and their sporting goods store backpacks. Who wants to hike 10-20 miles with a camera swinging on their neck and if it's in your pack, who wants to take their pack off every time a photo op arises? I have spoken to a small handful of guys/gals who do occasionally bring them on special trips (e.g. someone making a first-time trip to Yellowstone), but a dSLR as an everyday hiking cam? Very, very rare.

Where are you hiking - blandville, USA? Or are you just lying a bit (lot) when you say you NEVER see any? Funny how I see than more often - perhaps it's a California thing. I haven't been to Virginia, so other than knowing it's much flatter, don't know if it matters. I could play the provincial card and say that hiking the AT isn't real mountaineering.

Your own words speak well to the choice:

"I can't recall the last time I have even seen a Canon P&S that has a remotely decent AF system. I am very pleased with my S95, but just like the SX30, SX230 and the numerous other Canon cams I have recently owned, the AF leaves a lot to be desired. "

And I agree, my S90 does not seem to deliver clear focus on long range landscapes. If I wanted to take pictures of my dog, I certainly would want better equipment.

JeffNew Regular Member • Posts: 198
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

iPhone 4s' IQ is very impressive! I may buy it instead of s100.

Thanks.

JeffNew Regular Member • Posts: 198
Re: 4s samples

Thanks!

I think P&S got trouble now.

archiebald Senior Member • Posts: 1,499
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

John.Laninga wrote:

I really like my S95 and have taken some great travel pictures with it. So much, that I have a new S100 on order, ordered on 9/15. However, since my CC needed an update, I have been moved back to December delivery.

Now the iPhone 4S has been introduced. I've read articles from experienced photographers who are starting to use the iPhone as a carry-always camera. Results have been excellent, especially those who had previewed the 4S.

This has caused me to reconsider my S100. Maybe I should just keep the S95 and the new iPhone 4S when I travel. The while idea of cloud storage appeals to me as well.

So I'm curious what others think about this. Sure, change is always difficult, more for some than others. Seriously, what do you think of the iPhone 4S as a carry camera?

It really depends on one simple question.

Are you a photographer or a snapshooter?

If you are only interested in snapshots then by all means, any camera phone will do but if you are at all interested in the technical aspects of photography and trying to achieve something worth looking at then you need a proper camera.

As for me, I have a Smartphone with a 5mp camera that takes okay pictures but I have only ever done so once or twice just to try it out. Whenever I leave the house, I always have a camera with me, either my S95 or for special shooting events, my 60D.

PaulRivers Veteran Member • Posts: 7,420
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

kelpdiver wrote:

PaulRivers wrote:

I barely get through 200 pics before I give up through them in a folder and forget about it.

Ah, well then yes, there's no point in an SLR for you. Sometimes I forget I'm in the Talk group. If I took 200 pics, I'd end up with 5-10 keepers at best. I understand that recent cameras have taken face recognition one step further and can detect blinking, which is brilliant, but still lots of ways subjects can ruin the shot if you only take one.

Yeah, no you're right that I often take 2 or 3 pics of a scene with people in it because of stuff like that. No matter how great you think your photography skills are, not matter how much you plan the shot (not that I personally spend a lot of time at that), no matter what you do, there's no way to always avoid the "blinked during the picture" problem.

I feel like you're slightly missing my point, though. You wrote that "the speed and PQ gives you shots you can't get with the S"

But my counterpoint is that - that is true. But it's also true that the bulk and inconvenience of a dslr in other situations have the same effect - the bulk and extra carrying hassle of a dslr mean you can get shots with the S that you can't get with the dslr.

There are many situations where I simply cannot bring a dslr - if I go dancing (I actually do social dancing, like swing dancing and a little bit of salsa dancing). One cannot go and dance with a dslr. Another situation is road biking - if you're touring you might be able to fit a dslr in, but if you're doing a "fast as I can go" road ride a dslr is out of the question. And then there are other situations where one simply unexpectedly finds them wishing they had their dslr but they simply wouldn't have it with them - for example I went to a museum and suddenly found myself wishing I could take a group shot. I didn't even know I was going to the museum until the middle of the day - I simply would not have had a dslr with me. Let's say you go to the beach - are you now not going to go in the water because your expensive and obviously expensive dslr is going to be left sitting there? I'm not fond of leaving my s95 on the beach either, but it wouldn't cost $1,000 to replace. And if one did this regularly they could find a way to get a waterproof case or bag for the s95 and bring it with them - it would be a lot easier to carry that than a dslr in a waterproof case. Let's say you go to a concert and want to take a pic or video at the concert - a lot of concerts won't let you in with a dslr, whereas they would let in an s95. Or mountain biking - I can fit my s95 into a hardsided case and into my underseat bag, or into my camelback, etc. A dslr is simply out of the question - it wouldn't fit in any of those locations, if I crashed which is inevitable in mountain biking there's a good chance of breaking the camera, where to attach it to the bike, etc.

Then there are other situations where it's "convenience vs convenience". For example - it's more convenient to fire off a burst from the dslr for a group shot, sure. But is it more convenient to lug around a dslr for 2 hours or is it more convenient to take a slower second and third shot with an s95?

"But if all you have is an S95/100/smartphone, you're severely limiting yourself."

But the thing is - and this applies to my photo needs but not necessarily yours - I do agree with you that you're severely limiting yourself in some situations but certainly not all. But the dslr has the same kind of limitation - because of it's much bulkier size, as I mentioned earlier in my post there are places and things you simply would not be able to do with a dslr, thus it also severely limits your photography.

Now yes, one could have both, and use either when convenient. But the thing is, as I've explained - for me personally, I have found that for whatever reason there's very, very few times when all these things are true -

1. I would have the ability to have a dslr with me without it being impossible or a really, really, really big inconvenience. And also would actually have thought "I should bring the dslr" before heading out.

2. The dslr would provide a noticeable advantage.

Just #2 happens a lot, anything that's indoors with people at night. But #1 and #2 - rarely happen for me at the same time. I'm either in a situation where a dslr would be handy but I can get by with my s95 with less hassle than carting the dslr around, or I would like to have the dslr but it's impossible or very, very, very inconvenient to have it with me.

PaulRivers Veteran Member • Posts: 7,420
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

archiebald wrote:

If you are only interested in snapshots then by all means, any camera phone will do but if you are at all interested in the technical aspects of photography and trying to achieve something worth looking at then you need a proper camera.

Ok, I'm sorry, but the implication that you need a proper camera for to "achieve something worth looking at" is a bunch of total B.S. There's plenty of times when you're having a good time, maybe at your anniversary, on a date, doing something fun unexpectedly, or just plain want to take a pic to rub in the face of your friends who didn't come with you that you can get a pic who's "worth looking at" value is not dependent at all on whether you could squeeze some more pixels of resolution into the picture.

archiebald Senior Member • Posts: 1,499
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

PaulRivers wrote:

archiebald wrote:

If you are only interested in snapshots then by all means, any camera phone will do but if you are at all interested in the technical aspects of photography and trying to achieve something worth looking at then you need a proper camera.

Ok, I'm sorry, but the implication that you need a proper camera for to "achieve something worth looking at" is a bunch of total B.S. There's plenty of times when you're having a good time, maybe at your anniversary, on a date, doing something fun unexpectedly, or just plain want to take a pic to rub in the face of your friends who didn't come with you that you can get a pic who's "worth looking at" value is not dependent at all on whether you could squeeze some more pixels of resolution into the picture.

What you have described in that paragraph is the essence of a snapshot, not photography. (and is in no way related to pixel count)

Archiver Veteran Member • Posts: 3,632
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

As great as the 4s' photos look, I'd like to see some taken in less than ideal lighting conditions. If you are aiming to use it in the same situations as a S100, bear in mind that the S100 is geared towards low light shooting, taking the small sensor into account. I'd wait to see night shots and dimly lit indoor shots before getting the 4s instead of the S100.
--
Archiver - Loving Every Image Captured Always
http://www.flickr.com/photos/archiver/

olyflyer
olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 25,962
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

John.Laninga wrote:

Seriously, what do you think of the iPhone 4S as a carry camera?

Seriously what I think is that a camera is a camera. A phone with a camera is a phone with a camera, very limited. I would never buy a phone for the sake of the camera, it is just a feature of the phone, nothing as well made as a real camera can be, between any decent P&S or the Iphone my choose is clear, I'd go for the S100 or any other decent camera.

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olyflyer
olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 25,962
Re: 4s samples

JeffNew wrote:

Thanks!

I think P&S got trouble now.

No, not if you want a camera. A phone is not going to be able to replace the P&S any time soon, and definitely not the Iphone. Not very impressive if you ask me. Also, reading the Iphone page, sentences like these...

"The custom lens uses five precision elements to shape incoming light, which makes the entire image sharper. The larger f/2.4 aperture lets in more light, so photos look brighter."

...clearly demonstrate that they don't really know much about cameras in that department.

"The custom lens uses five precision elements to shape incoming light, which makes the entire image sharper." How do you shape a lens so that everything in the entire image is sharp? That can only be done with aperture control if you stop down, or artificial sharpening, which can be seen in the final image if you show the image large.

"The larger f/2.4 aperture lets in more light, so photos look brighter." The aperture size does not make your image "brighter", exposure and light does. Also, an image does not need to be "brighter" at all, it needs to be correctly exposed, so there is no connection between image brightness and aperture size, an image can be just as bright at f/32 as at f/1.4.

That's enough for me to decide on the camera. It is probably over hyped because it's an Apple and today everyone seems to like Apple products without questioning what they are actually paying for. I must yet to see the 4s for any proof of their claim about the camera but I doubt it is much better than my Nokia N95, which is not much to have in competition with any P&S. At least it has a real lens with real AF motor. I am not sure about the Iphone lens at all, probably only jelly type of lens.

I think you are making a mistake if you go for the Iphone and expect a good camera.

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tiberiousgracchus
tiberiousgracchus Regular Member • Posts: 250
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

There is not point in comparing phone cameras..to point and shoot nevermind DSLRs

Its about the convenience as mentioned in the original post. You have your phone with you all the time. There is no 'darn i wish i had my camera' moment. You will use it as a matter of capturing the moment and being spontaneous. I believe this is the point. You see something and you have something ready at hand to capture that. Reduced quality it maybe but you have it recorded..the moment.

PDine Contributing Member • Posts: 579
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

You didn't mention what your current phone is.

My feeling is: while a new iPhone 4s will probably have a decent camera by smartphone standards, it's unlikely to be as good as your existing s95. The s100, while marginally better than the s95, in unlikely to be a significant improvement over it.

Therefore, given the s95's compact dimensions you should probably make a resolution to carry your existing camera more often, irrespective of whatever phone you have with you at the time.

As an aside - If you don't already own an iPhone4, then the new iPhone 4s will probably offer many worthwhile improvements over your existing phone from a non-photography standpoint. If you DO already have an iPhone4, consider saving your money until the iPhone5 comes along in a few months time. Surely your hard earned money is not burning a hole in your pocket. Might as well try and get the maximum value from it.

olyflyer
olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 25,962
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

tiberiousgracchus wrote:

There is not point in comparing phone cameras..to point and shoot nevermind DSLRs

Its about the convenience as mentioned in the original post. You have your phone with you all the time. There is no 'darn i wish i had my camera' moment. You will use it as a matter of capturing the moment and being spontaneous. I believe this is the point. You see something and you have something ready at hand to capture that. Reduced quality it maybe but you have it recorded..the moment.

I have had cameras in my phones for a few years now but have not seen any image worth saving yet out of any of them, regardless who is using them. For me, if I leave my cameras at home I might as well enjoy the occasion without cameras and leave the phone in my pocket. That's how I look at phone cameras so far. The phoney 4s won't change that view.

The OP asked a question about camera or phone and I said what I said. Of course I am well aware of the fact that they are not really comparable, that's why I don't use phone cams.

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tiberiousgracchus
tiberiousgracchus Regular Member • Posts: 250
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

The recent images from the 4S looks pretty good though:

http://www.funkyspacemonkey.com/photos-iphone-4s#more-23013

John.Laninga
OP John.Laninga Senior Member • Posts: 2,368
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

I think that many are missing the point of the whole question. It in't how "good" the picture of the 4S vs the S100, it is the image you take.

In my opinion, and also stated by others, there is a fundamental shift in photography. Just like from B&W to color, then film to digital, now we're seeing the camera in a totally different light -- as an always-with-you communications tool. And the iPhone does this better than the S95.

Note that I'm not saying that the iPhone will take better images than the DSLR, or even the S95, there will remain a place for high end cameras. But for daily use the photography field is shifting-- again.

Further, I would guess there are more Facebook users than there are DSLR owners. And the new smartphones address this user better than compacts or DSLRs.

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JackM
JackM Veteran Member • Posts: 8,463
Or Nokia N8...

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1046&message=39022945&changemode=1

I mean... what the heck?? It's a damn phone!! Hope the iPhone 4S can compete with that. Wow.

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olyflyer
olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 25,962
It seems like your mind was already set up...

...when you started the thread and just wanted to get confirmation.

Well, I happen to disagree with you since I like to have the right tool for the right purpuse and I am no fan of Swiss army knife solutions. I don't think I missed any point, phone cams are not new and Apple did not invent them, in fact they are quite late. Never the less, your question was about what do we think, but it does not seem to interest you since you are saying that we, who don't agree with you are missing the point. There is no point missed, as far as I am concerned, this is just another phone cam. Really, I think you should have started this thread in the other forum, dedicated to phone cams.

Why ask questions and then insulting the ones answering is behind my understanding. I am sorry I wasted time in this thread. Good luck with your phone, hopefully you’ll get the shots you are dreaming about. I won’t be on the list of envious people.

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olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 25,962
Re: Hmmmm.... S100 or iPhone 4S?

tiberiousgracchus wrote:

The recent images from the 4S looks pretty good though:

http://www.funkyspacemonkey.com/photos-iphone-4s#more-23013

Yes, for being a phone cam they are nice. But all you can compare with is other phone cams, not real cameras. The 4s images are noisy even at ISO64. If it does not bother the users (it probably won't bother them because the users are Apple product fans) than everything is fine. Also if the images are for FB use only, they are OK, but the sky noise is visible even in small sizes, so I am not impressed with it as a camera.

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