1ds iii battery drain problem?

Started Mar 31, 2011 | Discussions
MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
1ds iii battery drain problem?

Hi I have just become the lucky (or so I thought) owner of a 1DS Mark III that I bought at a "bargain" price together with a 24-70 F2.8L, an 85mm F1.2 II and a 100mm Macro USM.

(bought from the auction site in the UK...)

When I leave a fully charged battery in the camera it drains in about 2 days - this is with the camera off and even if I take no photos at all.

I received two LP-E4 batteries with the camera. I have refreshed one (it was showing that it was ude for a refresh in the camera's battery info menu).

I have charged each battery twice in the week I have owned the camera. It also seems that each battery holds its charge when left outside the camera but discharges completely when left in the camera.

In the owner's manual Canon advise taking the battery out when not using the camera but my 1ds mK ii used to hold its charge for weeks and that was with the "inferior" NP-E3 NiMh batteries. Even a third party battery I bought used to hold its charge for weeks, if not months, even left in the camera.

The 85mm F1.2 II I bought with the camera also has excessive play in the focusing ring despite only being 2 years old (date code: UW* )

I feel I may be sending this back...

Has anyone else experienced the battery drain problem? I have done a web search and can't really find anyone else experiencing this.

I also can't believe both batteries are at fault. The camera menu shows they are at full health when charged up.

I said this appeared to be a "bargain" but I still spent a lot of money...

Thanks, Malc

Rational Regular Member • Posts: 369
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

There is an easy way to tell if the problem is with the battery itself discharging too fast (or not holding enough charge in the first place), or with the camera draining the battery even when the switch is "off":

1. Charge the battery but do not place it in the camera. Record how long it takes to discharge just sitting there. It should be many months. If it isn't, you need a new battery.

2. If the battery does not self-discharge when unconnected to the camera but does discharge when placed inside the 1DsIII, then the camera has a major problem. Even with the battery in the camera, it should last for many weeks because the camera places itself in a dormant mode after a user-selectable number of minutes of not being used.

I suspect that you will be in the market for a battery.

By the way, lithium ion batteries should be stored discharged, for longest shelf life.

 Rational's gear list:Rational's gear list
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III Nikon D850 Nikon 24-70mm F2.8E ED VR
OP MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

That's what I have done. I have tried each battery twice - if I leave either out of the camera it holds its charge. If left in the camera each battery drains. I have thought about getting a quote from Canon though nothing they have done for me before has been cheap (e.g. £300 to repair IS / AF on 70-200 F4L IS).

Malc

Rational wrote:

There is an easy way to tell if the problem is with the battery itself discharging too fast (or not holding enough charge in the first place), or with the camera draining the battery even when the switch is "off":

1. Charge the battery but do not place it in the camera. Record how long it takes to discharge just sitting there. It should be many months. If it isn't, you need a new battery.

2. If the battery does not self-discharge when unconnected to the camera but does discharge when placed inside the 1DsIII, then the camera has a major problem. Even with the battery in the camera, it should last for many weeks because the camera places itself in a dormant mode after a user-selectable number of minutes of not being used.

I suspect that you will be in the market for a battery.

By the way, lithium ion batteries should be stored discharged, for longest shelf life.

OP MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
More info...

I just shot over 100 shots using 5% of the battery capacity.

I have monitored the discharge rate by checking the % remaining every so often. After 2 days the battery lost about 1% but a day later this has dropped to nothing.

Seems similar with both batteries. I just can't believe both batteries would be dying but I am wondering if it is just the batteries as I can't find a single incidence of what I am experiencing when I search on the web.

I have owned more than one 1ds, 1ds Mark II, 1D Mark II and 1d Mark IIn and never had a problem so I actually would find it hard to believe there is a problem with my Mark III.

Malc

CameraCarl Veteran Member • Posts: 7,676
Re: More info...

Batteries do age and start to lose the ability to hold a charge. If you had bought a Mark II, I would suspect the battery, but as you bought a Mark III... well, maybe, you discovered the hard way why the camera was such a "bargain."

OP MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
Camera problem?

I am suspecting the camera now as I can't see 2 batteries behaving the same way.

I could work around it by removing the battery all the time but I don't see why I should.

Looks like I may be using paypal's buyer protection or even my credit card protection (it was a paypal transaction funded by my credit card) as a backup.

I have never lost a case yet, including sending a 7D back simply because I changed my mind...

Blimey this was my only chance of getting my hands on a mark III. I'll never afford one otherwise...

Malc

AlephNull Senior Member • Posts: 2,783
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

I have three 1 series cameras using these batteries, and I have four of these batteries. The three oldest batteries date from 2007, and they still hold charge for months, even when installed in a camera. I have left one battery in a body for over 6 months, and it was still mostly charged.

I think you are right - you need to get the camera fixed.

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tigertails99 Contributing Member • Posts: 572
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

I would try a new or known good battery before you sent it back.
Non canon batteries can be bought cheaply.

fitzy Forum Member • Posts: 55
85L Focus Ring

As others have said i also have no problem with battery drain..

As for the loose focus ring on your 85L,they are all like that,something to do with the focus system on this lens..panic over! (for lens anyway)
Hope all turns out well for you

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Rational Regular Member • Posts: 369
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

I still think it is your battery or batteries.

Your comment that "I have monitored the discharge rate by checking the % remaining every so often. After 2 days the battery lost about 1% but a day later this has dropped to nothing" is very odd. If the problem was with the camera, it would be there all the time, not just suddenly on the third day.

Also, I don't know how you measured that "after 2 days the battery lost about 1%". The on-camera gauges and software are next to useless.

The only way how much energy is left in a battery to tell for sure is to put the battery on test gig and subject it to a constant current drain until it empties; you can then multiply that current times the hours it was active to get the mAH that had really been left in the battery after whatever time you select.

I would buy a new Canon battery.

If you are technologically inclined, you can measure the DC resistance of the terminals that the battery connects to when the switch is "off".

You can then compute the current drain (in mA) on the battery with the simple relationship:

current in mA=[(voltage of the battery) (measured resistance on ohms)] times 1,000 (to get the current in milliamps and not in amps),

and divide the mAH rating of the battery by that number , to obtain the number of hours that a proper battery should last. (i.e. mAH/mA = H).

If the number of hours that your battery lasts is significantly less than that, then you need a new battery.

Be advised that lithium ion (and other) batteries are sensitive to mechanical shock. It is not uncommon to bump a fully charged battery hard, and to end up discharging it right away as a result.

 Rational's gear list:Rational's gear list
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III Nikon D850 Nikon 24-70mm F2.8E ED VR
Rational Regular Member • Posts: 369
Re: TYPO: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

Change:

current in mA=[(voltage of the battery)(measured resistance on ohms)] times 1,000

To:

Current in mA = [(voltage of the battery) DIVIDED BY (measured resistance in ohms)] TIMES 1000

 Rational's gear list:Rational's gear list
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III Nikon D850 Nikon 24-70mm F2.8E ED VR
Peter Galbavy Senior Member • Posts: 1,050
Re: 1ds iii battery drain problem?

I had my 1DsIII for over 3 years and not had this problem. I only have the original battery as I have never in a days shooting got anywhere near even 25% left. Left the battery in camera for a month or so before and no noticeable drain either. Only problem is the battery/charger between them insist on wanting a calibration every time, even after I have just done one - I have read this is a battery charge chip reporting problem and just ignored it.

I suggest it's something in the camera.

Just a simple question, but you do turn the camera "OFF" or do you let it go to sleep by itself ?

Even turning the thing OFF still allows the system to function as it will continue to write out data to the card(s) etc.

Further tests to try:

1. Turn camera OFF and leave the card compartment open overnight. See if that somehow breaks a contact that isolated the battery.

2. Reset to factory defaults and try either no SD/CF cards or different brands. Just a thought.

-- hide signature --

Peter Galbavy

OP MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
Cheers everyone, especially Rational!

I did want to hook up a multimeter to the contacts though I didn't know what contact does what and they are awfully small on the LP-E4.

The fact the I shot over 100 images (albeit just firing off in rapid succession in manual mode, some RAW some RAW + JPEG so actually more like 150 images) with the camera only using 5% (according to its built-in meter) makes me think the camera discharges the battery at a decent rate.

Something seems to happen to make each battery discharge quickly, whatever it is.

To answer your questions I set the camera to power off after 2 mins and it is left off overnight. However I did used to leave my 1ds mk iii on sometimes and the NP-E3 lasted days or weeks if not used so I expect an LP-E4 to do better.

Anyway I have dropped the camera and 85mm F1.2 II into Canon's Elstree repair centre with a £300 limit to repair and asked them to test the batteries.

The seller has been quite decent saying he will split repair and / or new battery costs so one way or another I should end up having a happy relationship with my dream camera!

Thanks again.

Malc

Rational Regular Member • Posts: 369
Re: Cheers everyone, especially Rational!

One last thought: sales-talk to the contrary notwithstanding, modern batteries (like the ones used in most modern cameras, GPS navigators, cellphones, etc) often get permanently damaged if left in very cold temperatures (e.g. less than 10-20 degrees below zero, Celsius). No amount of charging fixes that damage. I have lost the use of a few GPS navigators (which are normally left in a car overnight) when their internal batteries simply quit after a cold night outside.

Yet one more thought: could it be that some partially conductive goop (or salt) found its way into your camera's battery compartment and has been draining your battery when you place it there?

The fact that the seller has been forthcoming suggests that he may not have been aware of the problem when he sold you the camera; this, in turn, suggests that there may not have been a problem when he last used it before selling it, which makes it even more likely that the problem is in the battery.

Regardless, Canon should be able to tell you what the problem is. Had you not taken it to Canon already, I would have offered to measure the DC resistance of my own 1Ds3's battery terminals and compare it with that of your 1Ds3.

 Rational's gear list:Rational's gear list
Canon EOS-1Ds Mark III Nikon D850 Nikon 24-70mm F2.8E ED VR
OP MalcMay New Member • Posts: 16
Fixed by Canon, it was the camera!

They replaced the main circuit board, cost £140

Plus £36 for reducing the slack in my 85mm F1.2 II focusing ring

I think that's pretty good value from Canon (repair centre in Elstree, UK).

If that's done the trick now I'm happy! Thanks for all your suggestions, folks.

Malc

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