K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Started Jan 24, 2011 | Discussions
Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Although upon first inspection I didn't notice any stains on my early K5, there seems to have developed a problem over time.

On the left an image I made during the first week at iso 80 and f32. On the right the same area of the image, also at f32.

Althought there are some branches in the image, the spots should have shown up I believe.

Any others around that thought they were safe, but got them also after a couple of thousand exposures?

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OP Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
Found an example in the middle

All images are taken over the past months at F32, clearly the situation worsens over time on at least my sensor.....

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wjwncpro_Ds Veteran Member • Posts: 3,984
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

I still haven't pulled the triger on the buy button as I'm still a little skeptical about QC. You normally don't shoot at f32, at least I don't, but is it affecting your normal shooting habits?
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Michael de Ruijter Contributing Member • Posts: 840
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

And suddenly upgrading my K20D to a K-5 doesn't seem like such a good idea after all.

I will have to wait and see what happens.

It's a shame because I so badly wanted to use a DSLR with 14 bits... There may be another way I can do that.
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liquidsquid Senior Member • Posts: 1,958
Re: Found an example in the middle

Looks more like sensor dust to me, just a suspect grouping, like smoke particles. F20 or smaller makes any debris show up!

I would try cleaning the sensor first before calling foul on stains.

-Mark

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OP Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

I shoot quite a bit of F32 lately, need te slow shutter speeds for waterfalls and maximum depth of field with the tele lenses. I never view the images at 100% though, that's why it has taken me some time to notice them.

Bummer, but no doubt fixable
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narddogg81 Senior Member • Posts: 1,029
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Mine is still clean, and Ive been doing alot of liveview shooting. ive put 1100 shots on it
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OP Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
Re: Found an example in the middle

Hi Mark,

dust are the bigger botches in the image. The sensor stains are noticable by their liquid like halo around them.
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OP Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

But I see that you've got at K5 that is produced at least 50.000 copies after mine. Mine is from the early production months.
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ozdean
ozdean Forum Pro • Posts: 26,311
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Must be lubricant Mike or emulsion coming out of the sensor itself over time all very strange. I would like to pull the trigger on a k5 but just not game I'm afraid. Let us know how you go.
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brandrx Forum Pro • Posts: 28,337
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

ozdean wrote:

Must be lubricant Mike or emulsion coming out of the sensor itself over time all very strange. I would like to pull the trigger on a k5 but just not game I'm afraid. Let us know how you go.

Hi Dean,

It seems to me that if it were a lubricant or emulsion then the individual spots would spread or move. In Mikes second image post above you can clearly see that a great many of the spots in the 2nd and 3rd image have the spots in the identical places, although those identical spots in the 3rd image seem to be more prominent.

I wonder if it is a fungus that we are seeing?

Cheers.

Ron

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pxpaulx Regular Member • Posts: 403
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

My first body had the stains, noticed of course once the issue arose in December. Had only taken about 500 photos to that point. Got it replaced through my retailer with a clean one a week before our 2 week trip to Italy. Just over 3000 Photos now, just checked it yesterday and no new problem, use included a fair amount of liveview and video as well as the photos above. There are good k5s out there!

noel2 Senior Member • Posts: 1,097
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

I wonder if it is a fungus that we are seeing?

Cheers.

Ron

The fungus - or biological contamination - idea is not bad, and could be investigated further. The stains are surrounded by extended aureoles - maybe evolving with time - and remind one of what one sees in a Petri dish used for bacteriological cultures.

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ASR45
ASR45 Forum Pro • Posts: 37,240
I think.

Its lubricant, it certainly looks like it, not dust going back to my K10 days i had something similar, it was lubricant splattering onto the sensor from the shutter mechanism.

I think doing the manufacturing process, that some how to much Lubricant is put onto the Shutter mechanism, this would makes sense, only wet cleaning would get rid of it.

The K10 had the old dust reduction method that just moved the sensor a few times, the best implementation is the new Peitzo electric high frequency shake, similar to Olympus which i believe shakes at over 30,000 times a second.

The K-5 stain issue, has caused hysteria and over played, dont get me wrong it is there for sure, but needs addressing from a QC issue that pentax must admit to, find the cause which im pretty sure is lubricant, then adjust, use a different lubricant or not so much.

How ever it is implemented, needs adjusting and only then will the issue be rectified but having different DSLrs since inception from different makes over the years, have seen this before. It annoyed me with the K10 and at the time i mentioned it, to much lubricant was used. Remember Oil will not go with any DR mechanism it will need a wet clean, different shooters will have different stains to some or less different pattern but will be the same in there overall appearance.

With me, i use to do a check for dust weekly, when i first spotted my dust {Stains } i new i would have to wet clean, the condition is somewhat made worse when you shoot continuously, as the shutter is working overtime, makes sense the oil splatter will be more pronounced. I hope at least some logical insight has been achieved in what i have said. I hope the issue is resolved for all soon, by pentax regards Alan.

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janneman02 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,733
I have tested with a heating sensor....

no new or bigger stains so at least not all stains grow bigger.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=37509504
(mild, very mild case ofcourse)
but the we have this post as well
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=37503804

If you look carefully the original stain , like mine, did not change or get bigger or worse. However, a new and different set of stains appeared!!!!

Could it be that there is a possibillity that there are two diffente stain causing "liquids"were spilled on the sensor? one creating instant stains which remain the same and the other slowly developing stains?
Could it be that:
-some have no stains
-some have stains type a
-some have stains type b
-some have both???

There are still no definate stain free batches..

At least in Holland. My store called me and told me they have not yet received ny, nor did they receive any news about it. They have offered me to send a K-5 to keep until the good bodies come.

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ASR45
ASR45 Forum Pro • Posts: 37,240
Re: I have tested with a heating sensor....

janneman02 wrote:

no new or bigger stains so at least not all stains grow bigger.
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=37509504
(mild, very mild case ofcourse)
but the we have this post as well
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=37503804

If you look carefully the original stain , like mine, did not change or get bigger or worse. However, a new and different set of stains appeared!!!!

Could it be that there is a possibillity that there are two diffente stain causing "liquids"were spilled on the sensor? one creating instant stains which remain the same and the other slowly developing stains?
Could it be that:
-some have no stains
-some have stains type a
-some have stains type b
-some have both???

There are still no definate stain free batches..

At least in Holland. My store called me and told me they have not yet received ny, nor did they receive any news about it. They have offered me to send a K-5 to keep until the good bodies come.

You are not to far from the truth, did you read my other post, also could be :

Some have stains, some dont luck of the batch.
Stains will appear bigger on some cameras do to more oil used.
Some will shoot continuos mode producing more oil splatter.
Some might just be dust ?
some will not have any now, but will later on, say a couple of months.

some will have different stain patterns, as it would be next to 0 to replicate the same stain, just like human DNA.

some will not notice it and have it, do because they have not read or herd of it.
some might just deny they have it.
some might just do a wet clean get rid of it, and the next days shoot have more.
The list can go on and on.

My take is if pentax dont do something in camera, change the oil or whatever the problem will always be there, and eventually wet cleaning is the only way one can get rid of it, temporarily only, regards Alan.

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Ishpuini Veteran Member • Posts: 6,250
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Don't hesitate Mike. Send your K-5 in to DB through your vendor. They are replacing the affected units as we speak. I hope to receive my replacement (my original one was nowhere as badly affected as yours) next week. For the moment my K-7 is keeping me happy.

Wim

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awaldram
awaldram Forum Pro • Posts: 13,271
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

I await my 3rd body to come in.

My current replacement was passed clean by Pentax , SRS and Myself.

Only during use did I notice a small drop (yes singular) on the left hand side of the sensor, This stain has remained constant since late Dec.

It is due to be replced from the 'known clean' latest shipment probably this or next week.

Even so I love the k5 and don't regret one little bit the early purchase.

Both bodies have suffered from the dodgy P-ttl exposure bug
Neither body has any issue under low EV focusing.
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janneman02 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,733
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

awaldram wrote:

I await my 3rd body to come in.

My current replacement was passed clean by Pentax , SRS and Myself.

Only during use did I notice a small drop (yes singular) on the left hand side of the sensor, This stain has remained constant since late Dec.

It is due to be replced from the 'known clean' latest shipment probably this or next week.

Thts was due in last week with shipments to buyers alst friday...

Even so I love the k5 and don't regret one little bit the early purchase.

Same here, the early adopters are clearly the winners here as they have helped to spot (ouch, no pun intended) the problem(s) and if they were lucky enough to be able to keep their cameras until a stainless one arrives, have been able to take shots those who say "that is why I am not an early adopter" can only dream of...

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OP Mousehill Veteran Member • Posts: 7,539
Re: K5 Sensor stains developing in time?

Hi Wim,

I already had contact with DB and I can send it in as soon as I can miss it for a week or 3. DB doesn't get much information from Pentax though, so the mistery about the origin remains vague at best.

Hope the new shipments are 100% OK though!

Cheers,
Mike

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