New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

Started Jan 4, 2010 | Discussions
op1318 Regular Member • Posts: 315
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

taz002dev wrote:

A thing that confirms first post is that a550 is called the top end APS-C Sony DSLR.

Well, i don't think A550 could be called a top end anything. Except for the frame rate, it is nothing but an entry-level camera.

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gfrensen Veteran Member • Posts: 3,627
Re: No A7xx replacement theorie !!!

PierreChris wrote:

DSLR’s have 2 major problems: 1. Mirror that slows down the frame rate. 2. Mirror that causes long “lens to sensor plane” distance.

What is so suddenly wrong with the lens to sensor plane distance? Will picturures with a shorter distance result in visible better IQ? I doubt it. (D)SLRs are used by pros for decades now and the are not replaced by (digital) range finder cameras...

So APSC DSLR’s will be replaced by EVIL cameras in the future – with electronic shutter and high frame rates. Sony new prototype 3D video camera uses frame rate 240 fps at 2×2 MP.”

What potographer needs 240 fps or even 50 fps? Maybe nice for pro film makers, but not for (pro) photographers....

and

“Sony knows that by eliminating the mirror, a superior system could be developed. Sony is in the forefront of display technology, unlike Conikon, so it can produce better EVF than the competition – a VF that will not go dark with the push of DOF preview button, or when it’s dark outside. It will also zoom and allow for easier manual focusing. Add OLCD’s. The OVF suddenly loses its strength. If Panasonic, Olympus, and Samsung are working on EVIL, so is Sony. Look at their past and you will understand. Also this is the only explanation for the gap between the 300 and the 900 series, as the 500 series is only an extension of the 300 series. The 850 is only an extension of the 900 series.

What fun it would e i Sony did come with a A700 camera... We are all walking in the dark...

It is my belief that Sony will fill the gap between A550 and A850 with a superior EVIL system, maybe with 14 and 18 MP bodies, which will be, with an adapter, usable with A-mount lenses .

I agree, Sony will come out with an EVIL camera, but if it is the replacement of the A700 is to be seen....

APSC will be phased out in time. Current FF will be expanded up and down.

APSc is just the size of the chip, it will be in many EVIL cameras. So APSc will not die, even when EVIL will make DSLRs redundant. (and I think that will heappen in the future...) And I do think there is no reason for not making an EVIL FF body, so I think the FF DSL will die too. But when?

If Sony planned to bring out A700 replacement, it would be here by now. The hole in product offering between FF and APSC has existed in Japan now for some time. This is not normal. Sony is dumping A700 even in India, where it has otherwise hardly any presence.

May be, may be not.There could be some problems with the design they started. It could be de development of the A900/A850, A500 took the resources from the A700 team. It could be that Sony miss calculated the fast clearing stock of A700 in the last months. Who can tell (only Sony, and the won't)

Sony created, from their A200-350 line, the two new lines, one is the 500 line. There is no 700 camera (line) replacement. The APSC lens offering is weak, although APSC is the Sony’s bread and butter.

But most A700 users (not all, but most) are buying FF lenses so they can enjoy the bet IQ from there lenses and the possability to upgrade to FF. All FF lenses are usable on APSC bodys reverse is not true! So when you have limmited resources and both FF and APSc cameras, go for develop FF lenses instead of APSc...

Few FF’s are sold, but all new serious lens offerings are FF.

EVIL camera can have same or better resolution as FF, because of less diffraction. The lenses will be smaller. The cameras will be lighter and can be smaller.

How can they have better resolution, the smaller (APSc) chip will have photosites so small noice and nopice redction will kill the resolution, and what will it do to DR?

EVIL will make APSC redundant.

True! but how long will it take. It all depends on the quality of the bodys (EVF, Focus speed, IQ etc), lenses (smaller lenses to be used on those bodys, and good adapters for eisting lenses) and the way the marked responds to these type of cameras.

FF will still have an advantage in DOF control and sensitivity. You need to have it to demonstrate that you play with the big boys.

But FF can still be an EVIL camera, don't has to be a DSLR, but it will take the pros some longer to go for this new technology.

I see it as follows:

Now 2 lines:
230-550
850-900

later 3 lines:
100-550 (the 100 series will have no OVF)
EVIL 14 and 18 MP models to fill the gap between FF and APSC
800 – 1000

later 3 lines:
100-550
EVIL (2 series, 4 models)
800 – 1000

later 3 lines:
EVIL basic to full pro lines
EVIL 3D
FF “

Well I think there will be a EVIL FF camera too!

taz002dev New Member • Posts: 5
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

Well, You can call it top of the APSC line when you have nothing better in production.

How would you call a550 , when a700 is discontionued and nothing better is released in apsc line?
I really don't like how it sounds ...but what can I say?

op1318 wrote:

taz002dev wrote:

A thing that confirms first post is that a550 is called the top end APS-C Sony DSLR.

Well, i don't think A550 could be called a top end anything. Except for the frame rate, it is nothing but an entry-level camera.

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gil Forum Pro • Posts: 16,735
Sigh :(. If a small part of that speculation energy is diverted....(m)

to increasing one's skills, the world may be a bit more worry free :).
--
Cheers,
gil - San Jose, CA
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Like happiness, photography is often better created than pursued.

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plesbit Contributing Member • Posts: 560
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

Dave Oddie wrote:

Would you compare a Nikon D90 to a Canon 7D? No and neither would the magazine so they should be comparing the A550 to the D90 not a D300s and should not be using warped logic to include the A550 in a test.

I seem to see this quite a lot and I don't understand it. The A550 is NOT the equivalent of the D90, or at least if Sony think it is they should just give up now. The A550 is the D5000 not the D90. Sony has nothing in its range that equates to a D90. The electronics may be similar between the two Nikon's but as an overall tool they are aimed at completely different market segments - the A550 and D5000 both being smallish, lightish plastic, menu driven bodies with pentamirror OVF. The D90 is a larger, heavier, much more solid body with bright pentaprism OVF and direct control access to more advanced features to suit enthusiast users.

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cyainparadise Veteran Member • Posts: 5,577
CES is an electronic show, so I wouldn't expect much Alpha news

In your original post, you failed to mention PMA, which Sony attends, although Canon has decided to drop from their schedule. PMA is the PHOTO show, and Sony continues to support it.

Also, you failed to mention that this is a PHOTOKINA year. This is the big PHOTO show.

cyainparadise Veteran Member • Posts: 5,577
Re: No A7xx replacement theorie !!!

PierreChris wrote:

DSLR’s have 2 major problems: 1. Mirror that slows down the frame rate. 2. Mirror that causes long “lens to sensor plane” distance.

So APSC DSLR’s will be replaced by EVIL cameras in the future – with electronic shutter and high frame rates. Sony new prototype 3D video camera uses frame rate 240 fps at 2×2 MP.”
and

“Sony knows that by eliminating the mirror, a superior system could be developed. Sony is in the forefront of display technology, unlike Conikon, so it can produce better EVF than the competition – a VF that will not go dark with the push of DOF preview button, or when it’s dark outside. It will also zoom and allow for easier manual focusing. Add OLCD’s. The OVF suddenly loses its strength. If Panasonic, Olympus, and Samsung are working on EVIL, so is Sony. Look at their past and you will understand. Also this is the only explanation for the gap between the 300 and the 900 series, as the 500 series is only an extension of the 300 series. The 850 is only an extension of the 900 series.

It is my belief that Sony will fill the gap between A550 and A850 with a superior EVIL system, maybe with 14 and 18 MP bodies, which will be, with an adapter, usable with A-mount lenses .

APSC will be phased out in time. Current FF will be expanded up and down.

If Sony planned to bring out A700 replacement, it would be here by now. The hole in product offering between FF and APSC has existed in Japan now for some time. This is not normal. Sony is dumping A700 even in India, where it has otherwise hardly any presence.

Sony created, from their A200-350 line, the two new lines, one is the 500 line. There is no 700 camera (line) replacement. The APSC lens offering is weak, although APSC is the Sony’s bread and butter.

Few FF’s are sold, but all new serious lens offerings are FF.

EVIL camera can have same or better resolution as FF, because of less diffraction. The lenses will be smaller. The cameras will be lighter and can be smaller.

EVIL will make APSC redundant. FF will still have an advantage in DOF control and sensitivity. You need to have it to demonstrate that you play with the big boys.

I see it as follows:

Now 2 lines:
230-550
850-900

later 3 lines:
100-550 (the 100 series will have no OVF)
EVIL 14 and 18 MP models to fill the gap between FF and APSC
800 – 1000

later 3 lines:
100-550
EVIL (2 series, 4 models)
800 – 1000

later 3 lines:
EVIL basic to full pro lines
EVIL 3D
FF “

So, you think Sony will have to develop two separate lens lines? They can't even support their Alpha line with a complete line-up of lenses, and will have to do two different lens system. Even with an adapter, it will cause Sony DSLR/EVIL users to complain.

gfrensen Veteran Member • Posts: 3,627
Re: No A7xx replacement theorie !!!

So, you think Sony will have to develop two separate lens lines? They can't even support their Alpha line with a complete line-up of lenses, and will have to do two different lens system. Even with an adapter, it will cause Sony DSLR/EVIL users to complain.

Well it does not matter Sony users on this forum will complain. When Sony comes out with a killing EVIL camera with 100 lenses from cheap to expensive, they will complain that they are to late, that they forgot the Alpha line, that the camera is not killing enough, it has no OVF, MLU, DOF or things like that. They will complain. I wonder if the Samsung buyers are complaining the line only has a few lenses yet....

The Alpha users will complain when the EVIL camera will be better then the Alpha range, the evel should have a mirror and an A-mount And the lenses should be Alpha mount.

When Sony made no EVIL camera they will complain Sony is missing the boat. So this is the forum of cry baby's. They tel 1000 times how bad Sony cameras are, even when they are very good... (look at the A700 that was a bad camera when it was launched, no LV, no micro adjust etc. Now it is the best camera ever build and they are complaining about the new cameras without cripled video mode and some (by the target group) hardly ever used features...

They are all cry babys (exept the freaks who actualy use the cameras, they are loving their equiptment, but those are brainless fanboys! )

antares103 Senior Member • Posts: 1,154
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

hmm a Canon mark 4 will be announced? sounds like last Oct to me.

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Film is a four letter word

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dougas Regular Member • Posts: 323
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

Not sure that "focalized" is in the English dictionary.
--
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Dave Oddie Veteran Member • Posts: 4,138
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

plesbit wrote:

Dave Oddie wrote:

Would you compare a Nikon D90 to a Canon 7D? No and neither would the magazine so they should be comparing the A550 to the D90 not a D300s and should not be using warped logic to include the A550 in a test.

I seem to see this quite a lot and I don't understand it. The A550 is NOT the equivalent of the D90, or at least if Sony think it is they should just give up now. The A550 is the D5000 not the D90. Sony has nothing in its range that equates to a D90. The electronics may be similar between the two Nikon's but as an overall tool they are aimed at completely different market segments - the A550 and D5000 both being smallish, lightish plastic, menu driven bodies with pentamirror OVF. The D90 is a larger, heavier, much more solid body with bright pentaprism OVF and direct control access to more advanced features to suit enthusiast users.

You are probably right given the prices the A550 is going at these days. At launch it was close to D90 prices in the UK but what you say just reinforces my point that it was stupid to compare the A550 to a camera like the D300s and Canon 7d just because it is the most expensive aps-c camera Sony currently make.

Dave

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fulford Contributing Member • Posts: 997
Re: Sigh :(. If a small part of that speculation energy is diverted....(m)

gil wrote:

to increasing one's skills, the world may be a bit more worry free :).
--
Cheers,
gil - San Jose, CA
Cheap Lens, JPG and 100% Handholding Provocateur
Like happiness, photography is often better created than pursued.

Have to agree here but I would also add that increasing one's opportunity by getting away from these forums and actually using what they have.

Trace

Gionni Dorelli Senior Member • Posts: 1,063
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

dougas wrote:

Not sure that "focalized" is in the English dictionary.
--
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for sure is on someone else dictionary.
be creative!
Nobody is here for English classes.

Anastigmat Forum Pro • Posts: 12,664
Re: wat

JanKritzinger wrote:

source?

He got all this from his wet dream last night. LOL

Jb502 Contributing Member • Posts: 518
Re: wat

You forgot one predictio

Jan 4th, 2010, A450

for such a detailed description of what is going to happen in the next couple of months, and even into 2011, how could you leave this out.

Maybe because you don't have a reliable source, and all of this is just a guess.

If this was from a reliable source, you surely would have let us know about tonights announcement.

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Theresa_N Forum Member • Posts: 54
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

There is no need for more pixels in the 35mm format. Low noise at high isos I can see a need for, as well as more fps and an expanded lens lineup. As far as video goes, I doubt if it would be part of the alpha line. In all, I think this post is somebody's fantasy.

headofdestiny Veteran Member • Posts: 9,226
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

antares103 wrote:

hmm a Canon mark 4 will be announced? sounds like last Oct to me.

I believe he meant a 1Ds IV, which will surely be 30mp or so.

Phixel Veteran Member • Posts: 3,777
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

Geir Eivind Mork wrote:

They probably are up to 32 mp at one point, but not in 2010. That I can put money on. And I would think a a700 replacement is more imminent than a higher end camera than the a850, considering the possible sale volume and earnings thereof.

I'll take that bet! I predict the a950 will arrive with more MP, while an a700 replacement is still in the wind!

-Phil

Phixel Veteran Member • Posts: 3,777
Re: New Sony 2010 Roadmap at CES Las Vegas !!! no A7xx ??

plesbit wrote:

Dave Oddie wrote:

Would you compare a Nikon D90 to a Canon 7D? No and neither would the magazine so they should be comparing the A550 to the D90 not a D300s and should not be using warped logic to include the A550 in a test.

I seem to see this quite a lot and I don't understand it. The A550 is NOT the equivalent of the D90, or at least if Sony think it is they should just give up now. The A550 is the D5000 not the D90. Sony has nothing in its range that equates to a D90. The electronics may be similar between the two Nikon's but as an overall tool they are aimed at completely different market segments - the A550 and D5000 both being smallish, lightish plastic, menu driven bodies with pentamirror OVF. The D90 is a larger, heavier, much more solid body with bright pentaprism OVF and direct control access to more advanced features to suit enthusiast users.

Having used a borrowed Nikon D90 for over a week, I can definitely say the D90 is without a doubt a higher class of DSLR than the a550. While the Nikon D90 borrows from the highly specified D300, the Sony a550 borrows from the relatively poorly specified cheaper entry level a380.

-Phil

cgarrard
cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,673
What is weird about Canon

Is that when I looked at the vendor list for PMA 2010, Canon was on it.

I agree with you by the way about CES. So many sky is falling posts here, it really gets tiring at times to sift through.

Carl
--
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