Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

Started Sep 1, 2009 | Discussions
Future Blues New Member • Posts: 21
Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

I upgraded from my 20D to the 5d2 when it was released because I wanted full-frame coverage, delicious bokeh and, well, I mean, the 5d2 and it's predecessor both have an excellent reputuation, but after all this time, because of a vacation I'm about to embark on, I'm seriously considering ditching my 5d2 and going 4/3rds (micro 4/3rds? which is it?) Hear me out and tell me what you think...

First off, I'm traveling to Cambodia and Thailand and my initial thought was to invest in a water resistant, shock resistant, freezeproof camera, but I wanted an integrated GPS and a quality image and eventually, after a lot of research, determined that they don't make that camera yet.

Meanwhile, friends on my side of the fence were telling me: "Dude, take the DSLR, I want to see the awesome pictures you'll take..." And I too still go back and forth. The quality of the 5d2 rivals film, right? And you want to take good pictures of Angkor Wat, right?

However, there are a couple of problems with this. First, the only travel insurance I've found (world nomads) that I can get on the spur of the moment without a ton of paperwork only insures luxury goods (cameras, diamonds, etc.) up to $500 which doesn't even cover the LENS on the 5D2, much less the camera itself. And, if my camera is lost or stolen, because I'm currently living and working abroad, I have no homeowner's insurance or equivalent to cover the camera, meaning I'd be out a paycheck and a half if it got pinched from my bag while I was in Cambodia. Add the fact that I'm not sure I can find my original recipt for the 5d2 and/or the lens to the equation and I'm basically not going to be able to get ANY coverage at all on my camera equipment, which is a second reason I'm considering ditching the 5d2 for something smaller and lighter...

And finally, I'm traveling light. A single, very rugged waterproof sealed-backback and little else-- possibly a camelbak for day expeditions. As it stands, the 5d2 24-105 fits but the combo is heavy, in my bag and around my neck and while it all handles well enough, I wouldn't call it intuitive or anything-- video mode is, especially, a pain in the ass.

Which brings me here to the Micro 4/3rds board. Should I ditch all this and just grab a GH1 for the trip? Will it and the kit lens be a lot lighter/easier to manage than my big ol' DSLR full-frame job? I'd be able to insure it for about 1/2 of it's value with the recipt and I'd be less stressed, as its not even a 3rd of the value of my big rig. Meanwhile, I feel it would be a great change to try out, and hell, everything I've read about the GH1 seems to be roses and rainbows. Is there anything I'm overlooking here? Am I crazy to want to downgrade like this? And no, this isn't the only thing I'm planning on doing with the GH1-- in addition to it being my travel go-to camera, I'm thinking of letting it handle my casual photography needs and sort of pushing the 5d2 into the background until uh, I guess I need it again. Until I start printing in magazines, or something I guess.

Jeff Tokayer Veteran Member • Posts: 6,289
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

The best walk around lenses from Olympus are the 12-60 and 14-54.
Instead of an m4/3 body, consider the E-620.
E-620/14-54 II combo sounds like what you need.

Jeff.

TEBnewyork
TEBnewyork Forum Pro • Posts: 11,337
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

If video is important to you then the GH1 is a good choice. With the kit lens it isn't that tiny or fast. So, you will want to supplement with one small fast prime lens. Perhaps the 20 f1.7 that is due to be announced in the next 24 hours (not sure when you leave on the trip).

If you are traveling that light what are you doing for image processing or image storage?
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Godfrey Forum Pro • Posts: 29,496
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

I can't advise you as to what's going to work for you, but I can see myself heading out on the next trip with the G1, my Cosmicar 12.5/1.4, the Panasonic 20/1.7, the Oly Pen F 40/1.4 and 70/2. Whole kit will fit in a tiny bag and weigh less than 4 lbs.
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Jogger
Jogger Veteran Member • Posts: 8,441
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

I would get the E620 before i get the EP1. It does everything better aside from CDAF and video. Plus you get to use 43 lenses as they were intended.. the EP1 you have mediocre lenses and if using 43 lenses, you are not saving any size.

Having said that, if i were in your situation, i wouldnt hessitate to bring my D700 and f2.8 zooms.

Future Blues wrote:

I upgraded from my 20D to the 5d2 when it was released because I wanted full-frame coverage, delicious bokeh and, well, I mean, the 5d2 and it's predecessor both have an excellent reputuation, but after all this time, because of a vacation I'm about to embark on, I'm seriously considering ditching my 5d2 and going 4/3rds (micro 4/3rds? which is it?) Hear me out and tell me what you think...

First off, I'm traveling to Cambodia and Thailand and my initial thought was to invest in a water resistant, shock resistant, freezeproof camera, but I wanted an integrated GPS and a quality image and eventually, after a lot of research, determined that they don't make that camera yet.

Meanwhile, friends on my side of the fence were telling me: "Dude, take the DSLR, I want to see the awesome pictures you'll take..." And I too still go back and forth. The quality of the 5d2 rivals film, right? And you want to take good pictures of Angkor Wat, right?

However, there are a couple of problems with this. First, the only travel insurance I've found (world nomads) that I can get on the spur of the moment without a ton of paperwork only insures luxury goods (cameras, diamonds, etc.) up to $500 which doesn't even cover the LENS on the 5D2, much less the camera itself. And, if my camera is lost or stolen, because I'm currently living and working abroad, I have no homeowner's insurance or equivalent to cover the camera, meaning I'd be out a paycheck and a half if it got pinched from my bag while I was in Cambodia. Add the fact that I'm not sure I can find my original recipt for the 5d2 and/or the lens to the equation and I'm basically not going to be able to get ANY coverage at all on my camera equipment, which is a second reason I'm considering ditching the 5d2 for something smaller and lighter...

And finally, I'm traveling light. A single, very rugged waterproof sealed-backback and little else-- possibly a camelbak for day expeditions. As it stands, the 5d2 24-105 fits but the combo is heavy, in my bag and around my neck and while it all handles well enough, I wouldn't call it intuitive or anything-- video mode is, especially, a pain in the ass.

Which brings me here to the Micro 4/3rds board. Should I ditch all this and just grab a GH1 for the trip? Will it and the kit lens be a lot lighter/easier to manage than my big ol' DSLR full-frame job? I'd be able to insure it for about 1/2 of it's value with the recipt and I'd be less stressed, as its not even a 3rd of the value of my big rig. Meanwhile, I feel it would be a great change to try out, and hell, everything I've read about the GH1 seems to be roses and rainbows. Is there anything I'm overlooking here? Am I crazy to want to downgrade like this? And no, this isn't the only thing I'm planning on doing with the GH1-- in addition to it being my travel go-to camera, I'm thinking of letting it handle my casual photography needs and sort of pushing the 5d2 into the background until uh, I guess I need it again. Until I start printing in magazines, or something I guess.

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Dan Clark Senior Member • Posts: 2,703
Crazy? Absolutely not.

I have a Nikon D70. While it's not in the same league as a 5D, it's a good camera. And I have a Canon HV30 video camera. Dragging this stuff around is a hassle for me. Taking both on vacation? MAJOR headache!

That's why I'm looking at the GH1. If video is important to you, a GH1 is the probably the best travel camera out there.

If video is not important to you, then an EP-1 or G1 might be better options that will save you some bucks.

Like any other tool, any of these cameras will have their ideosyncracies. All cameras have their downsides, it's just a matter of 1) deciding if a particular camera meets your needs and 2) getting used to it to find the workarounds that meet your needs. And do this well in advance of going on vacation.

Regards,

Dan.

Stevejac Contributing Member • Posts: 918
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

I added a G1 to my existing 5d (the original) and several L lenses. The g1 is really good. Not as good as either 5D, but it's so light that I barely notice it's there. I carry it with the 14-45 and 45-200 lenses and the whole kit is incredibly light.

The suggestion of an e-620 is certainly reasonable. I've not looked at that model but owned an e-520. The advantage of the G1 is, believe it or not, the viewfinder. If the e-620's vf is like the 520, you aren't going to like it much compared to your canon. The review on this site is not complimentary.

The EVF on the panasonic is much easier on my late middle-aged eyes, and the ability to change most parameters with the camera to my eye, and having a live histogram in the VF is truly amazing. The EVF of the G1 has been (in my opinion) unfairly criticized because in dim light it gets grainy. True enough, but the 5d's vf gets a bit dim and the e-520 gets downright dark in low light conditions. The problem with the G1's vf in low light isn't that it's less usable but that the image is quite ugly.

The articulated lcd on the G1 and the e-620 is a real plus as well. While I don't like using it for general photography--I want the camera to my eye-- there are times when it is priceless.

I'm keeping my 5d for landscape work-- for now. The last time I picked it up I was shocked at how heavy it is with my preferred 24-70L2.8.

We are going to spend 2 wks in Australia next month and I would want to lugging my 5d and canon gear all that time.

Do note that neither the 5d nor the g1 nor the e-620 are truly weather sealed. If you want a good quality dslr in a relatively sealed form, take a look at the new Pentax K-7. I've never seen one of these, but it looks promising. Also, if you want to capture rapid motion situations such as sports, the G1 is probably not the best.

No movies on the G1, but you might consider the GH1 whose movies are reportedly excellent.

I've got a GH1 in transit to me as I've got a new grandchild to video.

Enjoy your trip!
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BJN
BJN Veteran Member • Posts: 5,110
GH1 is not rugged or weather sealed.

It's compact and a capable camera, but it's not designed to be a rugged pro or semi pro camera.

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DRabbit
DRabbit Veteran Member • Posts: 4,724
As someone who owned a 5D and got rid of it...

I certainly understand your desire for something lighter.

If theft or damage is a serious concern, my suggestion would be to buy a used e-410 or 420 and the 14-54 f/2.8-3.5 lens. Perfectly capable dSLR, very small and light combination, and you could get it for a steal.

If you decide after the trip that you like Olympus you could always upgrade later to the e-620 (which is very similar in size and has some nice features, but isn't going to be covered by your insurance either).

I have the 620 and 14-54mm lens... Love it. I also have the E-P1 and it's incredibly compact with great image quality. Problem with the E-P1 is lens options at this point. I use a lot of manual focus lenses and enjoy the experience immensily, but that may not be you. If you have a local camera shop where you live, best to go down and try the cameras you're thinking about.

BTW, any reason you haven't considered a Rebel? I certainly wouldn't pursuade you away from Olympus, but since you've got a 5D and Canon gear already, it might make more sense to stick with that system. Get a cheap used Rebel and the Tamron 28-75 f/2.8 lens... you'll have a small "kit" and still be able to use both in the future with your other Canon stuff. The Tamron Lens is amazingly good (often compared to L-glass) but awesomely cheap. Just a thought.

Amy
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Ann Chaikin
Ann Chaikin Veteran Member • Posts: 7,094
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

I would. I have a 5D which is a fine camera but... it weighs a ton. Take the small one. You'll get really fine pictures and amazing video. Give yourself a break. Easier to carry, easier to keep close to you, less worry. I don't take my 5D with me anymore and use it for tripod work mostly these days though I will be taking it to an opening on Friday as I really need the low light ability. Otherwise it would be my GH1 along for the ride.
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John Carson Veteran Member • Posts: 4,262
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

Jogger wrote:

I would get the E620 before i get the EP1. It does everything better aside from CDAF and video. Plus you get to use 43 lenses as they were intended.. the EP1 you have mediocre lenses and if using 43 lenses, you are not saving any size.

Say what? He asked about the GH1, not the EP1.

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Charles Lau Forum Member • Posts: 75
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

Absolutely Not Crazy!

That is probably the main reason a lot of us bought a micro 4/3 as a backup camera.

I have D200/D700 Nikons, Great for Shooting trips when you have a car, but definitely not flying overseas.

I bought a Canon G9 as a travel camera, really fine camera under good light and low ISO, but I could'nt be happier with the recent purchase of the EP1.

Almost pocket-able with the stock lens and drew no attention at museums etc. It also have 1280x720 video; vs 1024x720 with the G9.

The Pany/ Lumix 45-200 zoom worked very well on it too.

Highly recommended for travel.
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Archiver Veteran Member • Posts: 3,677
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

Future Blues wrote:

However, there are a couple of problems with this. First, the only travel insurance I've found (world nomads) that I can get on the spur of the moment without a ton of paperwork only insures luxury goods (cameras, diamonds, etc.) up to $500 which doesn't even cover the LENS on the 5D2, much less the camera itself. And, if my camera is lost or stolen, because I'm currently living and working abroad, I have no homeowner's insurance or equivalent to cover the camera, meaning I'd be out a paycheck and a half if it got pinched from my bag while I was in Cambodia. Add the fact that I'm not sure I can find my original recipt for the 5d2 and/or the lens to the equation and I'm basically not going to be able to get ANY coverage at all on my camera equipment, which is a second reason I'm considering ditching the 5d2 for something smaller and lighter...

And finally, I'm traveling light. A single, very rugged waterproof sealed-backback and little else-- possibly a camelbak for day expeditions. As it stands, the 5d2 24-105 fits but the combo is heavy, in my bag and around my neck and while it all handles well enough, I wouldn't call it intuitive or anything-- video mode is, especially, a pain in the ass.

Given your limitation of travel insurance (or lack thereof) and baggage load, it would make more sense for you to get a weathersealed Oly DSLR, and perhaps the 12-60. It would be a lot lighter than the 5DII, but without the benefit of video.

On the other hand, I recently got back from a three month road trip on which I carried the 5DII, G10 and Sigma DP1 in a shoulder bag. My primary lens was the 24-105L. It did get heavy, but the images were well worth it. Of course, I had insurance, and made myself very familiar with the video mode.

None of the m43 cameras are weather sealed at this time. Oly is supposed to be coming out with a 'pro' grade m43 camera with weathersealing, but this is only so much vaporware before it arrives. The upcoming Panasonic GF1 or present GH1 look like a good m43 solution if you are willing to give up weathersealing.
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Chez Wimpy
Chez Wimpy Veteran Member • Posts: 9,053
I don't take the 5D2 travelling

Future Blues wrote:

I upgraded from my 20D to the 5d2 when it was released because I wanted full-frame coverage, delicious bokeh and, well, I mean, the 5d2 and it's predecessor both have an excellent reputuation,

We have that in common

but after all this time, because of a vacation I'm about to embark on, I'm seriously considering ditching my 5d2 and going 4/3rds (micro 4/3rds? which is it?) Hear me out and tell me what you think...

You can stop right there. The 5D2, on the go, can be a royal pain. I know. I just hiked a national park here in Japan with tripod, ballhead, TSE lenses, ect, and it was the first time the weight of gear really impeded progress (stop and setup for a shot here? just getting things out of the bag when you are exhausted becomes a barrier). I have mine gripped + handstrap because, when not on the go, thats how I shoot. Degripping, strapping, ect for travel is bad enough, but the lenses weigh me down even more (70-200/2.8IS is not meant for travel), and I prefer to shoot primes because when I can pick my spots, I try to shoot with the best lens possible. Travel though... I took my 20D on one trip with the 17-40L five years ago (in the ballpark of the 5D2 + 24-105), and that was the end of it. I moved to the 350D + kit lenses, and they served me well in place.

If you are starting fresh though, the GH1 would be a great choice. I have a friend with the G1, another friend with the E-P1, and I have used them extensively. They are both great cameras (the E-P1 is beautiful, and the G1 ready for a daybag), but I think the GF1 is closest to what I am looking for (less emphasis on video than the GH1, but a sleeker package with the 20/1.7, EVF, presumably the focus system of the G1, and very little footprint). I am also planning on getting a lighter Canon (the 500D is coming at some point, but even that isn't want I want , more to satisfy the need of stitching landscapes). If I were you I would really consider the 500D + either the kit lens or the new 24-85/IS which looks to be the "killer" Canon crop all-in-one optic.

And no, this isn't the only thing I'm planning on doing with the GH1-- in addition to it being my travel go-to camera, I'm thinking of letting it handle my casual photography needs and sort of pushing the 5d2 into the background until uh, I guess I need it again. Until I start printing in magazines, or something I guess.

Well, if that is how you feel... it might be worth it to drop the 5D2 completely. I love the camera when I am shooting in my element, but if I didn't have those needs, I doubt I would have gotten it in the first place (or a > $1k DSLR for that matter!).

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iano Senior Member • Posts: 1,889
I have made the same move

Don't bother with the full frame stuff that often now

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Bollo Regular Member • Posts: 121
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

Well if you're carrying a FF DSLR, you're carrying rig worth more than the average Cambodian earns in a year or two. Carrying a humbler set might make you feel more safe and it could be easier to aproach locals too when taking photos.

nugat Contributing Member • Posts: 699
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

If you are going on a professional (moneymaking) trip to a difficult zone take a weathersealed bulletproof brick. If you don't make a living off this trip, travel light and inconspicuous. I'd go with E-P1 + 14-42, 45-200 and one fast prime plus an LX-3 as a backup.

alexzn
alexzn Senior Member • Posts: 1,787
Take the 5D, here is why.

Well, it depends... If you think that with m43 you will get the same pictures as you would with 5D2, you are dreaming. The pictures from the 5D2 will be noticeably better than the m43 (I own both the original 5D and the EP1, and enjoy using both).

If you really care about bringing back good pictures, I would take the 5D because of two things: The extra dynamic range that you will get from the larger full-frame sensor and the faster AF, which is VERY useful for quick grab shots. A third factor is that high ISO is also better on 5D2.

m43 makes a great tiny travel camera, but you do get a bit noisier picture and a much slower AF (even with a Panny cameras). Bu the large elephant in the room is m43 lenses. To get an equivalent quality zoom lens for m43 you need to go to the f2 Olympus 4/3 zooms which are rumored to be at least as good or not better than the L glass, but they are not much smaller and cost about the same. So if you go for the really good glass, you loose most of the m43 advantage. If and when someone like Leica or Cosina come out with a couple of small top-quality dedicated primes for m43, the equation could change, but for now, you are going to loose in lens quality by going to m43. I love the pictures I get from my EP1, but I know that I always can use my 5D and L zooms when I really need that extra bit of IQ.

I don't quite understand people recommending the 620: it is another SLR, it is not that much smaller and you will be getting into a whole new system. And frankly, 620 cannot hold a candle to the 5D, unless you put on the aforementioned Oly zoom, which will make it quite large (and still the 5D2 will have better DR and HD video). The OP already has one of the two best semi-pro SLRs available, why would he change?

My recommendation is to leave your tripod at home and just take a good sturdy mini-tripod (Bogen makes the one I like). You can always put it up on something and get the shot. Not having to lug a tripod makes a huge difference. Also if that helps, my travel solution is to put the DSLR in a neoprene form-fitting case (Zing or its clones) and throw it in the daypack. Padded cases are too large and too cumbersome.

Best of luck on our trip.

Alex

P.S. Angkor Wat is somewhat overrated; the most interesting site (both culturally and photographically) in that region is Bagan in Myanmar (Burma).

alexzn
alexzn Senior Member • Posts: 1,787
Re: Am I crazy? Full frame to Micro 4/3rds??? (travel, casual, etc.)

If you are carrying any decent camera, you are carrying more than an average Cambodian makes in a year, so it does not make much difference. Just keep your camera strap around your arm at all times and obviously use your best judgment.

BigBarney Senior Member • Posts: 2,722
Right problem, wrong solution?

Future Blues wrote:

I upgraded from my 20D to the 5d2 when it was released because I wanted full-frame coverage, delicious bokeh and, well, I mean, the 5d2 and it's predecessor both have an excellent reputuation, but after all this time, because of a vacation I'm about to embark on, I'm seriously considering ditching my 5d2 and going 4/3rds (micro 4/3rds? which is it?) Hear me out and tell me what you think...

You have clearly identified the problems with your Canon equipment on such a journey (weight, size, uninsurability), but I think you may have selected the wrong solution in the GH1 unless you are desperate for some quality video on your expedition. May I suggest that a suitable alternative to consider may be the Panasonic DMC-LX3 or the Canon Powershot G10/11?

These would give you the benefits of small size, light weight and a purchase price that could be covered in your insurance policy, as well as not drawing attention to yourself as the well-heeled tourist. Personally speaking I carried my LX3 with me throughout my holiday/vacation this year in Southern Italy, and not once did I long for my G1 and its 45-200mm zoom telephoto lens. The naysayers, of whom there will be plenty , will tell you that the LX3 is limited to a maximum telephoto focal length of 60mm (equivalent), although you can increase this to over 100mm by using extended zoom or digital image cropping in post processing. What they ignore is the incredible f2.0 24mm (equivalent) wide angle on the Leica lens, which will be a godsend at a site like the Angkor Wat. Wide angle lenses are far more important in most travels than telephotos in my experience.

So yes, the GH1 and a small number of lenses will be cheaper, lighter and smaller than your Canon dSLR rig, but please consider that it may not be the optimal solution in a world where nothing will be perfect.

Oh and the LX3 will give you the faclity to shoot 720p HD video whereas the Canon G11 is limited to VGA only video resolution, although it does give you greater telephoto zoom and a lower wide angle view.

If size really is critical you could also consider the Olympus EP1 or the yet to be formally announced Panasonic GF1 if you can find one in stock anywhere.

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