Congratulations Cephalotus, the source of EVIL!

Started Mar 11, 2009 | Discussions
Joseph S Wisniewski Forum Pro • Posts: 34,170
Congratulations Cephalotus, the source of EVIL!

The best I could do with dpReview's search shows that Cephalotus coined the acronym EVIL - Electronic Viewfinder Interchangeable Lens on December 31, 2005.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1000&message=16506994

In response to yet another of those "what do we call the G1" threads, I took a look at how common the term has become.

A simple Google for "EVIL Panasonic G1" turns up 66.200 hits.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=EVIL+panasonic+G1&btnG=Search

The first page of results includes sites like: dpreview.com, luminous-landscape.com, photo.net, rangefinderforum.com, and dpnotes.com.

The G1 was announced September 12, 2008, or 180 days ago. That means that just in discussing the G1, every four minutes (on the average) someone uses your acronym when discussing the G1.

It's been used thousands of times on dpReview.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=EVIL+%22electronic+viewfinder%22+site%3Adpreview.com&btnG=Search

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=EVIL+%22interchangeable+lens%22+site%3Adpreview.com&btnG=Search

Even dpReview staff use the term.

How does it feel to have named something, to create a term that will live throughout the photographic community for many years?

Again, congratulations!

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Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: Congratulations Cephalotus, the source of EVIL!

This is correct. I recall the "conversation" and that was the first time I'd ever heard the term suggested. Since then, I've researched the term on multiple occassions to see if anybody had independently coined or used the term that way before and was unable to find any reference. So I think it is pretty safe to say that Cephalotus coined the term.

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BJN
BJN Veteran Member • Posts: 5,084
The handle made me think of H.P. Lovecraft

...but cephalotus is actually a carnivorous plant, not a tentacled overlord from the "Cthulhu Mythos". I was just curious how evil the originator of EVIL might be.

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BJ Nicholls
SLC, UT

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omr Senior Member • Posts: 1,118
Congratulations Jay! (And Probepro too)

Jay Turberville wrote:

... I recall the "conversation" ... ...
... I think it is pretty safe to say that Cephalotus coined the term.

You deserve credit for coining "EVI" and "DEVIL", which
inspired Cephalotus to simply note that "the D is not necessary."

Question:
Who was first (in the DPR forums) to suggest the concept
of an EVIL camera (years before the acronym appeared)?
The earliest such post that I can find is dated July 15, 2001,
by "probepro", who envisioned cameras that
"... will be lightweight ... compact, with EVF ...", and
"with the high-end having interchangeable lenses."

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1024&message=1282706&q=evf+compact+interchangeable&qf=m

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omr

LLS1 Regular Member • Posts: 423
Re: Congratulations Cephalotus, the source of EVIL!

Somehow I don't see the manufacturers adopting this name.

zygh
zygh Senior Member • Posts: 1,798
EVIL would leave the righteous crowd out... (nt)
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Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: Congratulations Cephalotus, the source of EVIL!

Somehow I don't see the manufacturers adopting this name.

It will be interesting to see how it evolves. It really comes down to what the photography community - especially those who are attracted to this camera type - decides to use. Camera companies actually have only a fairly small influence over these kinds of things. I don't know of any Olympus users who use the term "Evolt" for instance.

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Undah Veteran Member • Posts: 5,330
Nice find - a visionary

looks like probepro was right on both counts - Sony's 'whacky' designs a la f7x7 didn't last, and the EVIL came into existence.

omr wrote:

Question:
Who was first (in the DPR forums) to suggest the concept
of an EVIL camera (years before the acronym appeared)?
The earliest such post that I can find is dated July 15, 2001,
by "probepro", who envisioned cameras that
"... will be lightweight ... compact, with EVF ...", and
"with the high-end having interchangeable lenses."

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1024&message=1282706&q=evf+compact+interchangeable&qf=m

Tim the Grey Veteran Member • Posts: 6,310
That's because it's a rEvolting name... (nt)
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Jon Ragnarsson
Jon Ragnarsson Veteran Member • Posts: 5,281
Love EVIL, but...

I suggested sometime SLV.
SLV - Single Lens View, close enough to SLR.
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Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: Love EVIL, but...

I suggested sometime SLV.
SLV - Single Lens View, close enough to SLR.

Like many alternative suggestions, SLV applies to every compact and camera phone out there. So it really isn't a good answer.

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scott karch Regular Member • Posts: 157
Re: Love EVIL, but...

I was thinking about this on the way into work this morning and have come up with MIL Mirrorles Interchangeable Lens

It's hard, because if you only describe it with what it has, it sounds like a SLR or possibly rangefinder. Even MIL fits Rangefinder cameras. EVIL is super accurate, just not likely to be used by companies.

Maybe MILS Mirrorless Interchangeable Lens System
Sounds sellable.

Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: Love EVIL, but...

As you point out, MIL or MILS includes rangefinders. It technically could include an SLR that used a prism instead of a mirror as well.

I'm not particularly concerned whether or not camera makers adopt the use of "EVIL". I suspect that in the short term, their approach will be to avoid any term that lumps their new standard in with other similar standards. Hence we see micro four-thirds.

Samsung is naming their system "NX" and calling the camera class a "hybrid" - at least for now. I suspect more makers will use "hybrid" at least in the short term.

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BJL Veteran Member • Posts: 9,165
'hybrid' used for both video-capable EVILs, GH-1 and NX

Jay Turberville wrote:

Samsung is naming their system "NX" and calling the camera class a "hybrid" - at least for now. I suspect more makers will use "hybrid" at least in the short term.

Panasonic has also used "hybrid" in reference to the GH-1. The meaning for both GH-1 and NX seems to be the still-video mix, not EVIL alone. But if soon all EVILS do video, that name might take over.

MIL was one of my proposals too, and I doubt that hair-splitting over SLR's with prisms and rangefinders will worry people much.

I still want a name based only on the key positive features: interchangeable lenses and video style (live view) composition; not based on a non-feature (mirror).

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Tom_N Forum Pro • Posts: 15,474
Re: Congratulations Jay! (And Probepro too)

omr wrote:

Jay Turberville wrote:

... I recall the "conversation" ... ...
... I think it is pretty safe to say that Cephalotus coined the term.

You deserve credit for coining "EVI" and "DEVIL", which
inspired Cephalotus to simply note that "the D is not necessary."

What do you mean, the 'D' is not necessary? Without it, how are we to get the

Canon Digital EVIL EOS-666D (a.k.a., Canon DEVIL-666)

Tom_N Forum Pro • Posts: 15,474
Re: 'hybrid' used for both video-capable EVILs, GH-1 and NX

BJL wrote:

I still want a name based only on the key positive features:
interchangeable lenses and video style (live view) composition; not
based on a non-feature (mirror).

Call it a Digital Camera Component System (DCCS) (by analogy to stereo component systems). To qualify, a camera must be digital, have interchangeable lenses, and allow for external flash. (Preferably, the sensor should be of a reasonable size, too.)

This definition would include DSLRs and (D)EVIL cameras, but exclude compacts.

DCCS isn't catchy, but it doesn't have the negative marketing connotations of (D)EVIL, either. And it does capture the essence of what the camera does.

Wayne Larmon Forum Pro • Posts: 10,319
B&H calls them SLRs

Jn Ragnarsson wrote:

I suggested sometime SLV.
SLV - Single Lens View, close enough to SLR.

Panasonic Lumix DMC-G1 SLR Digital Camera (Black) with 14-45mm Lens

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/583537-REG/Panasonic_DMC_G1K_Lumix_DMC_G1_SLR_Digital.html
Wayne

Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: 'hybrid' used for both video-capable EVILs, GH-1 and NX

DCCS isn't catchy, but it doesn't have the negative marketing
connotations of (D)EVIL, either. And it does capture the essence of
what the camera does.

But like so many suggested alternatives, it doesn't differentiate between a DSLR and an EVIL camera. In other words, it doesn't get the basic job done.

I think what so many people miss is that EVIL is not primarily a marketing term. It isn't a camera name. It is merely a term for a camera category.

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Jay Turberville Forum Pro • Posts: 12,917
Re: B&H calls them SLRs

Sure. Because they aren't about to redesign their website for one camera type. Don't be surprised if the simply evolve their site to have interchangeable lens and fixed lens categories.

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Adrian Lewis Regular Member • Posts: 423
Negative connotations can make great marketing ...

... just look at the long-running French Connection UK "FCUK" campaign.

Tom_N wrote:

DCCS isn't catchy, but it doesn't have the negative marketing
connotations of (D)EVIL, either. And it does capture the essence of
what the camera does.

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