EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

Started Sep 19, 2008 | Discussions
Mike Fried
Mike Fried Senior Member • Posts: 1,621
EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

A friend of mine shared a link with me over IM about CHDK, which I had never heard of before - in relation to getting raw recording on my PowerShot SD870 IS (not a feature I wanted). However, I was intrigued and went over to the CHDK wiki ( http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/CHDK ) and noticed a recent note at the top about hacking the 40D to do video recording. In case you didn't spot the link on the homepage it goes to here ( http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/40D ), and there is a link to a youtube video here ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlKywUVFJW4 ).

Is it ready for prime time? No. Clearly not. But it's cool nonetheless. CHDK has been discussed over in the Canon talk forums in the past (see http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1010&message=25769055 for example), however, this recent post on the 9th of September, 2008 is worth taking a peek.

What is interesting to me is that these people are apparently using some feature of DIGIC to run programs off of their memory card in the camera to add features temporarily and apparently without re-flashing/changing the firmware (and thus not voiding the warranty)! So in other words, if their hacks are buggy and don't work right, all you need to do is swap out the batteries and they are flushed from camera memory. Then you delete the program files on your CF card.

I might have to play around with it and see if I can throw my hat into the ring when my 50D arrives. If the 5DII and 50D share DIGIC 4 in common, and the 5DII has 1080P mode, it stands to reason that there is some set of commands/program one could write for the DIGIC 4 CPU that could be used on the 50D to give it a video recording feature (minus the audio recording as it doesn't have a microphone).

Just about every digital device with a bunch of CPUs has a group of people who figure out how to program it and eventually share/publish that information on the internet. Your Canon EOS and PowerShot digital cameras are clearly not an exception to this rule.

It would be nice of Canon to actually make a feature of this and publish an API for people/3rd parties to write programs for their cameras and "unlock" features/customize their cameras beyond their designed firmware/software functionality (in a supported way), but the unfortunate reality of businesses like Canon's is that they can't possibly support these features.

-Mike

http://demosaic.blogspot.com

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Elwood_98034 Contributing Member • Posts: 926
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

You will burn in hell for even wanting video.

Just ask any of the Real Photographers on here.
--
Elwood.

xblk33360 Regular Member • Posts: 175
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

actually, as of lately, i'm tired of these 'real' photographers that keep telling people around here that they are 'real' photographers.

i think these 'real' photographers should burn in hell instead.

ya wanna go first?

tknterry Senior Member • Posts: 1,711
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video! Another yawn, sorry

Hmmm, I think this may be a case of projection bias. Although I do not yet consider myself to be a "real photographer" (I just play with my $1000 cameras), astonishingly, I have no interest in video on my dSLR either. Its very perplexing!

Elwood_98034 wrote:

You will burn in hell for even wanting video.

Just ask any of the Real Photographers on here.
--
Elwood.

-- hide signature --
Mike Fried
OP Mike Fried Senior Member • Posts: 1,621
Be nice, now. :)

Elwood_98034 wrote:

You will burn in hell for even wanting video.
Just ask any of the Real Photographers on here.

Ironically, real photographers don't live in cyberspace.

xblk33360 wrote:

actually, as of lately, i'm tired of these 'real' photographers that
keep telling people around here that they are 'real' photographers.

I think Elwood_98034 (I used to live in 98034, now I'm in 98072.) was being a bit faceitious here. It's really hard to guess, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt and laughed.

-Mike

http://demosaic.blogspot.com

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DumboDave New Member • Posts: 22
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

Video??? I'm still trying to figure out how to take pictures!!!!
--
OFBU

Elwood_98034 Contributing Member • Posts: 926
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

I first started using a Spotmatic F in 1976, and I am the first to admit that I am very definately not a Real Photographer. I just take pictures and video's and stuff for my own enjoyment.

When I am at work I take pictures and video and stuff, and get paid for it.

Lugging two different cameras around is a pain in the @ss. That is why I want a Swiss Army camera.

A camera is just a tool. I don't understand why some people are so anti-video. It is like the porn channel on TV, if you don't like it, don't go there - but don't criticize those who do.

You know...don't get all bent out of shape about it all. It's only a camera.

And I apologize for making fun of all those people who take themselves so seriously. One day I will take myself seriously too, I'm sure. Or, maybe not.
--
Elwood.

Elwood_98034 Contributing Member • Posts: 926
Re: Be nice, now. :)

Mike Fried wrote:

I think Elwood_98034 (I used to live in 98034, now I'm in 98072.) was
being a bit faceitious here. It's really hard to guess, but I gave
him the benefit of the doubt and laughed.

; }
--
Elwood.

DugT
DugT Senior Member • Posts: 1,159
Re: Is the hardware tough enough?

I would worry that the hardware would fail because it is not designed to withstand the 30 or more frames per second that video requires. For example, won't the sensor get too hot? If the hardware can withstand the stess, then Canon probably would have sold it with that feature. Then would have beat Nikon to the punch and sold a lot more camera's.

Besides that, video has no future. TV, YouTube and and cinema are just a fads.

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Elwood_98034 Contributing Member • Posts: 926
Re: Is the hardware tough enough?

usedtobedontrustme wrote:

I would worry that the hardware would fail because it is not designed
to withstand the 30 or more frames per second that video requires.
For example, won't the sensor get too hot? If the hardware can
withstand the stess, then Canon probably would have sold it with that
feature. Then would have beat Nikon to the punch and sold a lot more
camera's.

I was wondering about the heating too. The new 5D and the 50D sensors are reported to be 'new', so maybe the operating voltages are lower and there is less heat involved.

Some of the new P&S' can run video to the 4gb capacity of their cards, but I don't think the 5D can do that, so something must be holding it back. Heat is the logical thing, unless it is a buffer bottleneck...

There would need to be some serious testing carried out to make sure the sensors aren't going to fail prematurely due to overheating. If it happened during warranty, it would cost a fortune and ruin Canon's reputation. If it happened out of warranty, it would pretty much eliminate any future sales.

I don't mind if they put it off for a few product cycles if long term reliability is at all an issue. Video would be fun to have, but I don't want to be replacing a sensor two years out of warranty.

And I would really hate to hack my existing xxD and fry the sensor.

Besides that, video has no future. TV, YouTube and and cinema are
just a fads.

-- hide signature --

Elwood.

Mike Fried
OP Mike Fried Senior Member • Posts: 1,621
Re: Is the hardware tough enough?

usedtobedontrustme wrote:

I would worry that the hardware would fail because it is not designed
to withstand the 30 or more frames per second that video requires.

Then why do they make the Live View mode in the first place? In order to be running the mode, they need to take the sensor and capture some high number of frames per second, process the output, and display it on the LCD screen. If this doesn't heat the sensor up and have an impact on the overall quality of the photos produced during Live View mode, then storing those bits off to the flash memory shouldn't either.

For example, won't the sensor get too hot? If the hardware can
withstand the stess, then Canon probably would have sold it with that
feature. Then would have beat Nikon to the punch and sold a lot more
camera's.

Not necessarily. One of the games that the businesses like to play is the whole incremental upgrade game. If they gave you video in the 50D, you (being some percentage of the market) might not buy a 60D or 5D II.

Besides that, video has no future. TV, YouTube and and cinema are
just a fads.

Maybe you think computers and iPods and the internet and electronics are just fads, too, but these multi-billion dollar technology industries aren't shrinking, the technologies are just gradually shifting.

-Mike

http://demosaic.blogspot.com

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DugT
DugT Senior Member • Posts: 1,159
Re: I still don't think the hardware is tough enough.

Then why do they make the Live View mode in the first place? In order
to be running the mode, they need to take the sensor and capture some
high number of frames per second, process the output, and display it
on the LCD screen. If this doesn't heat the sensor up and have an
impact on the overall quality of the photos produced during Live View
mode, then storing those bits off to the flash memory shouldn't
either.

I believe Live View is viewed at much lower resolution. Therefore, it is possible that the data is gathered from the sensor at less than full resolution. Also, isn't there a warning in the manual about Live View possibly overheating the sensor?

My Canon G9 takes good video but the max video resolution is a fraction of the 12.1 M resolution.

Besides that, video has no future. TV, YouTube and and cinema are
just a fads.

Maybe you think computers and iPods and the internet and electronics
are just fads, too, but these multi-billion dollar technology
industries aren't shrinking, the technologies are just gradually
shifting.

Sorry but I was kidding. I firmly believe TV, YouTube and the Cinema have a strong future.

I am optimistic and if I really wanted to squeeze video out of my 40D I would find rationalizations that it would work. However, my optimism has gotten me into trouble enough times for me to want to recommend to others to proceed with caution when I think optimisim might be getting the best of them.

-Mike

http://demosaic.blogspot.com

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Mike Fried
OP Mike Fried Senior Member • Posts: 1,621
Re: I still don't think the hardware is tough enough.

usedtobedontrustme wrote:

I believe Live View is viewed at much lower resolution. Therefore, it
is possible that the data is gathered from the sensor at less than
full resolution. Also, isn't there a warning in the manual about Live
View possibly overheating the sensor?

I don't know, as I don't have a 40D, but what happens if the sensor "overheats"? Does this just affect image quality, or is there potential to actually damage the sensor?

Sometimes I shoot 4 or even 8 minute long exposures on my 10D, at full resolution. Aside from the shots showing hot and stuck pixels that need software adjustments to fix, my experience is that doing this is fine.

My Canon G9 takes good video but the max video resolution is a
fraction of the 12.1 M resolution.

Same with my wife's 870 IS. 640x480 at 30FPS is enough quality from a $200 P&S. The 870IS lets you shoot video until the card runs out, and at the VGA 30FPS quality, that's about 2hours for our 8GB SDHC card.

Sorry but I was kidding. I firmly believe TV, YouTube and the Cinema
have a strong future.

Haha. You got me! Don't forget to use a winking smiley - - if you're making a snarky comment, so I know the difference. Sometimes I can tell when people are actually being snarky and not, but I missed it.

I am optimistic and if I really wanted to squeeze video out of my 40D
I would find rationalizations that it would work. However, my
optimism has gotten me into trouble enough times for me to want to
recommend to others to proceed with caution when I think optimisim
might be getting the best of them.

Well, I don't have a great need for video from a DSLR, but it would be fun to play with it, and I surely some people will follow the CHDK work and point out when they make it so that we can do cool new things with our cameras. The 50D with the whole AF during Live View might be interesting if some software hacks can enable video recording (even if just at the VGA resolution used on the 50D LCD screen in Live View).

And for that matter, I wonder if the 40D and 50D have the software to play back video shot with other Canon cameras on the memory card (such as the PowerShots and the 5D II), even if without sound... If all these cameras share the same DIGIC innards, they certainly have the hardware capacity to do this - it's just a matter of software. I don't have a 40D, but I have a 10D and I have a 50D on order.

-Mike

http://demosaic.blogspot.com

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bronxbombers Forum Pro • Posts: 18,226
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

I might have to play around with it and see if I can throw my hat
into the ring when my 50D arrives. If the 5DII and 50D share
DIGIC 4 in common, and the 5DII has 1080P mode, it stands to reason
that there is some set of commands/program one could write for the
DIGIC 4 CPU that could be used on the 50D to give it a video
recording feature (minus the audio recording as it doesn't have a
microphone).

indeed they might even be able to locate the video code in teh 5dmkii FW and copy onto the memory card and then have it hook into it without even having to try to program the video themselves.

a proper autoiso, if they can figure out the relevant commands to control ISO,ap and shutter should be trivial to program in.

gavin
gavin Veteran Member • Posts: 8,126
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

Real? The camera is a tool. I welcome ability to take video so I can leave my S3 IS at home. Just don't use the features you don't like.
--

What camera do I have? I rather you look at my photos http://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinz

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Bob Blount Veteran Member • Posts: 7,458
Re: EOS 40D (hacked) does video!

Don't see a reason to risk my warranty for something of questionable value for me.

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Bob

'There are always two people in every picture: the photographer and the viewer.' - Ansel Adams

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John Ott9 Junior Member • Posts: 32
Re: Be nice, now. :)

Any ideas on how to adjust my camera for the new shooting location. I am guessing that I will have to really turn down the red channel and change the color temperature to match hell's lighting. John

ove2 Regular Member • Posts: 386
Uhmmmm you can't take it with you :-( ...

Sad but true

Yoss Junior Member • Posts: 40
Re: I still don't think the hardware is tough enough.

If Live View is viewed at lower resolution that would mean either it reads only from part of the sensor or it read full resolution and resize the output.
I believe it's the latter.

And if you read DataGhost's reply - he clearly said that in order to create a video out of the 40D - he dumped the Live View buffer.

see http://chdk.setepontos.com/index.php/topic,2259.msg21411.html#msg21411

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Yoss!

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