Rumours of K20D

Started Dec 19, 2007 | Discussions
nosnoop Senior Member • Posts: 1,694
Re: As usual, the Metz flashes like 48 AF-1 are left out

mutleybird wrote:

The 58 AF-1 or 48 AF-1 aren't going to go obsolete in
one model cycle, and are P-TTL.

Well, that's what happens to the Sigmas.

Also, if Pentax makes changes where
the current Metz internals need to be adjusted, you can update them
yourself by USB.

As I said, not everyone is comfortable with firmware upgrades; which is an inherently risky procedure albeit small.

The Pentax flashes have no way to update them, are very high priced,
and they would be the ones that have to be thrown away.

Did you get it the wrong way round? Last time I checked the price at Adorama, AF540FGZ is $294 after rebate, and Metz 58AF costs $374. That's quite a significant difference. In addition, the power pack for 540FGZ costs $150, while the one for Metz 58AF costs $484 + a $48 cable.

And as I mentioned in another thread, not all features are supported in Metz. Being a Pentax flash, any new Pentax camera models are obviously designed to work with it. Unless Pentax abandons P-TTL; so your "thrown away" comment has totally lost me.

Gareth_R Senior Member • Posts: 1,683
Oi! what's your problem?

mutleybird wrote:

As if this is some Pentax advertising site, responses completely
ignore the phenomenally well made Metz P-TTL flashes such as the Metz
48 AF-1 which even has swivel head compared to the Pentax 360.

You also forgot to include

Gareth_R wrote:

There are also various 3rd party flashes which I've never used personally.

I'm not sure what the problem is, I've given my honest opinion on the Pentax gear which I've actually used. While I've gone on to say that there are 3rd party flashes but I know nothing about them. No point talking about 3rd party stuff if I have no experience using the gear, IMO.

Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: Rumours of K20D

Yes, there are lot of things that causes noise to the image signal - and by avoiding noise as much as possible, the new camera has lower noise levels than the K10D. Then this noise can be further lowered by optional noise reduction.

The Sony 10Mp is not built to avoid noise, so there are actually more noise coming from it than has to be there. With a more clever design, the Sony 10Mp would be less noisy than it is today.
--
Take care
R
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Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: Rumours of K20D

The Nikon D2x achieves the fastest speed by cropping the frame. The Nikon is a 12.4Mp CMOS camera with ISO 100 - 800, and with a "high speed crop mode" allowing for 8 fps.

The new model from Pentax is a 14Mp CMOS APS-C with more ISO range than the Nikon, and it has a very competetive high speed solution. When I first saw the fps of the new camera from Pentax, I thought it was a misprint. It will not have a "crop mode" for the ultra speed mode, it will still be APS-C - but there will be several solutions for speed and resolution.

I say that the Pentax solution is better, and that for much less money.
--
Take care
R
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Patrick Medina Regular Member • Posts: 296
All we know about K20D
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TheLastMan Regular Member • Posts: 425
Re:And another thing ..... ? K100D Super

Well done Jens! You will enjoy your new camera. Keep the money you have saved by not buying the K20D for some lenses.

Most people find out their photographic subject matter and style quite quickly. Keep an eye on whether you are always hankering after "wider" or "longer" focal lengths than that offerd by the kit 18-55mm and then buy a second lens covering either the shorter or longer focal lengths that you feel you are missing.

Report back here when you think you know what you need, and you will get lots of suggestions!

Jensw61 wrote:

OK I bought it yesterday! And am practisng, practising,
practising...if only my human subjects would stand still!!!! Going
out to shoot some plants!

Thanks for all your tips and advice. Jen

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VeijoM Contributing Member • Posts: 513
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

Even though most of my shots are from non moving objects, I dare to say that the next camera I am willing to pay full price need to have predictive autofocus. Have they tried such in the next K*0D? Are there any real chances that Pentax will ever develop such?

-Veijo-

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kyc888 Regular Member • Posts: 151
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

VeijoM wrote:

Even though most of my shots are from non moving objects, I dare to
say that the next camera I am willing to pay full price need to have
predictive autofocus. Have they tried such in the next K*0D? Are
there any real chances that Pentax will ever develop such?

Trying to read between the lines here, so this is pure speculation.

Live view might be a clever means to allow for more sophisticated AF and burst speed. Theoretically live view means you should be able to capture whatever FPS matches the LCD screen refresh rate, assuming memory throughput can handle this. I suspect that there could be a "live view" mode that uses the full sensor data for AF (allows for very sophisticated predictive AF), AWB and high speed burst.

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DLBlack Forum Pro • Posts: 14,885
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

kyc888 wrote:

VeijoM wrote:

Even though most of my shots are from non moving objects, I dare to
say that the next camera I am willing to pay full price need to have
predictive autofocus. Have they tried such in the next K*0D? Are
there any real chances that Pentax will ever develop such?

Trying to read between the lines here, so this is pure speculation.

Live view might be a clever means to allow for more sophisticated AF
and burst speed. Theoretically live view means you should be able to
capture whatever FPS matches the LCD screen refresh rate, assuming
memory throughput can handle this. I suspect that there could be a
"live view" mode that uses the full sensor data for AF (allows for
very sophisticated predictive AF), AWB and high speed burst.

This sounds very nice!! Now if it is true we can only guess at this time.

Dave

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lock Veteran Member • Posts: 6,202
14 mp..

will give you plenty of room to decrease the number of pixels to allow you to increase fps. As long as the reduced resolution keeps the details.

lock

lol101 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,855
Re: 14 mp..

lock wrote:

will give you plenty of room to decrease the number of pixels to
allow you to increase fps. As long as the reduced resolution keeps
the details.

lock

Yes but decreasing the number of pixel by some kind of pixel clustering means that you first took the image full rez... which means that it's no faster

There must be another trick, like completely droping some pixels from the sensor in high speed mode but it would lead to some interpolation problems...

Oh well, january 24 isn't that far... (well OK, it is that far... ;-)).

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lol101 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,855
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

kyc888 wrote:

Trying to read between the lines here, so this is pure speculation.

Live view might be a clever means to allow for more sophisticated AF
and burst speed. Theoretically live view means you should be able to
capture whatever FPS matches the LCD screen refresh rate, assuming
memory throughput can handle this. I suspect that there could be a
"live view" mode that uses the full sensor data for AF (allows for
very sophisticated predictive AF), AWB and high speed burst.

Now that would be ground breaking as the current implementation of LV on other SLRs generaly means awkwards and slow AF...

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Vaards Senior Member • Posts: 1,328
Re: not in january

Roland Mabo wrote:

Are you trolling?
It is up there with the best in bright light (differencies are less
than 0.1-0.2 seconds), and in dim light it is average. Now, average
means "in the middle" - not the best and not the weakest. All this
according to scientifical measurements in the swedish magazine FOTO.

For shure - I am trolling somtimes to boil up atmosphere. In this case I just like that other user want to say - I am sure - pentax AF sucks. Only thing that really sucks. All other things are good!

I bought to my friend (Have contacts in USA, etc) some weeks ago MARK III Ds. It is considered like slow camera (in comparison with other mark). But... In low light conditions I tried some tens of shots with my SD card and EF 50mm/1.4... You know - all pics were with right focus. Just on that flower or barmen where I wished it to be.

After holidays I will take that camera for some day and try to shot one by one some objects, persons, etc. And then count from hundreds of average level shoter produced snapshots how good/bad is pentax in comparison with top end 35mm camera at this moment. Even not considering fact that I know pentax k10d tips 'n tricks and usability really good, but Canon is not known to me.

At this moment I have huge quantities with shots what is out of focus, backfocus and frontfocus. My 14mm/2.8 lens even can't lock focus due to cameras will to move somewhere beyond infinity. Ok - I still have debug mode on. But then there is front focus issue, if infiniti is right :)))). And different lighting changes all conditions again.

Hope Pentax will address these issues in near future cameras - because I really like all my sexy small lenses.

V.

always shoot raw

But you can get terrific JPEG's too!
--
Take care
R
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RaSoFe Regular Member • Posts: 375
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

kyc888 wrote:

Live view might be a clever means to allow for more sophisticated AF
and burst speed. Theoretically live view means you should be able to
capture whatever FPS matches the LCD screen refresh rate, assuming
memory throughput can handle this. I suspect that there could be a
"live view" mode that uses the full sensor data for AF (allows for
very sophisticated predictive AF), AWB and high speed burst.

Dear kyc888,

Virtually all p&s cameras have live view, and they do use full sensor data for AF.

Nevertheless, the AF performance in all p&s cameras is far inferior to dslr. This is because the contrast detection method (used to evaluate focus from sensor data in p&s) can only tell you whether you are in focus or not, while phase sensitive AF system (a special hardware in dslr) tells you how far the subject is, i.e. the system can jump directly to the focus after a single measurement, not to search for the focus by small incremental steps.

That said, with fast image sensor (say, 100 frames per second) and very fast image processor a contrast detection method can, in theory, reach similar performance.

Regards,
Andrey.

KRG1953
KRG1953 Regular Member • Posts: 295
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lock Veteran Member • Posts: 6,202
Re: 14 mp..

Well, I did not mean to say it had to be clustering. But if the number of pixels is reduced, one way or the other, than smaller files will be produced and more files per second can be written to memory (more fps).

lock

lock Veteran Member • Posts: 6,202
Re: Autofocus - any predictivity?

Casio embedded a Hybrid AF system (Phase Difference and Contrast AF) in their P600 and p700. It only made a difference in low light. But the P600 was a fast Billy, and I think it can still beat some P&S cameras easily.

lock

Kabe Luna
Kabe Luna Veteran Member • Posts: 9,502
Shoot RAW and use great lenses and you won't have any problems with image quality.

In-camera JPEGs have always been the achilles heel of the Pentax DSLRs. The K10D gives great results when you shoot RAW. No need to wait for it.

If you need or prefer JPEGs, I'm afraid you should probably look elsewhere.

Jensw61 wrote:

Hi, the search feature isn't working so please forgive me if this has
been asked before (and direct me to the relevant thread!)...

I'm very keen to buy the K10D but the reviews aren't that great re
image quality, and there is rumour of a K20D coming out at the end of
Januaury. Should I wait for that model? Will it address the image
quality problems? Will it be much more expensive?

I've waited so long to have the money...

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Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: 14 mp..

Yes, that is true.

I think that the speed of 14Mp will be enough for many - it is not slow - but for those wanting really fast, there is a solution for them.
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Take care
R
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janneman02 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,733
Pentax will die....

..at least according to many posts towards the end of january 2008....

I mean, I doubt it will be available within a few weeks and history has shown that that will raise the number of "The End is Near" posts.....
Better not visit the forum by then.
Fortunately Yours Truly will be at Carnaval in the beginning of february

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