Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

Started Sep 6, 2007 | Discussions
Ken_5D Forum Pro • Posts: 11,820
Re: How can an entry level camera compete?

Daniel Roos wrote:

1) There's only a single dial for both time and aperture like on D40x
and 400D entry level cameras

Wrong.. there are two

2) There's no top LCD display, just the bottom like on D40x and 400D
entry level cameras

And the 7D which in its time was at this level. .. I have not missed it once since I picked up my KM 5D (my first non-Canon/Nikon Since 1978...)

3) The camera lacks the dedicated dial for focus method, like on D40x
and 400D entry level cameras

If you are talking about MF/Single Shot/Tracking..

The dedicated Dial is on the front near the lens.. and then a button that instantly switches between MF/AF.. so it sort of has TWO dedicated controls for choosing focus method.

1 out of three... no bonus round for you...

...So how can this $1500 entry level camera compete with D40x and 400D?
(not even mentioning the lack of 51 area focus, Expeed, D-lighting,
CLS command etc)

DRO is a simluar techology to D-lighting and it had several variations this time.

I think the D300 is an amazing camera... but I have to admit.. I haven't figured out what one does with 51 focus points. But it does sound good.

If Sony had messed this up.. I was going to sell my stuff and get a D300..
I am happy enough that I am keeping my 5D and will have two bodies..

I think both Nikon to a major effect and Sony to a lesser degree are telling Canon its time to wake up.

I ended up ordering mine tonight and hope to be shooting A700 images in 4 weeks.

You're in the wrong forum. Check the Nikon D80/D70/D50/D40 forum
instead.

Nope right forum to talk about this competition...:) Again.. Congrats on the sweet D300...

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shaocaholica Contributing Member • Posts: 870
Re: How can an entry level camera compete?

Daniel Roos wrote:

1) There's only a single dial for both time and aperture like on D40x
and 400D entry level cameras

It has 2 dials. In manual mode, one is shutter speed and one is aperture

2) There's no top LCD display, just the bottom like on D40x and 400D
entry level cameras

This is not a "Pro" or "Entry" level feature. There are semi pro cameras that break this rule (A700) and entry level cameras that break this rule (D70). I would consider it more of a "new age" design concept. You really think Sony skimped on this to save a few bucks?

3) The camera lacks the dedicated dial for focus method, like on D40x
and 400D entry level cameras

No it doesn't. Get your facts right.

...So how can this $1500 entry level camera compete with D40x and 400D?
(not even mentioning the lack of 51 area focus, Expeed, D-lighting,
CLS command etc)

It's not supposed to compete with entry level cameras because its not one. Expeed is simply the Nikon processor equivalent to Sonly's Bionz and Canons Digic. D-Lighting is just like Sony's DRO. They're just different names for the same features.

You're in the wrong forum. Check the Nikon D80/D70/D50/D40 forum
instead.

You're in the wrong thread.

cayzi Contributing Member • Posts: 564
Re: Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

PhotoTraveler wrote:

Nikon wouldn't have been
able to even think of Doing FF in F mount.

Nikon did a FF in F mount -> D3 and film F6 and many others

jerry lambert New Member • Posts: 3
Re: Both

The maximum seven has top and back display, I have a maximum nine and a seven and also the maximum 7d and I prefer the back display, I have used. The d 200 and other n, cameras, I can shoot with my face away from the camera and see all my readings, also in a crowd of people and see all my display at the same time

PhotoTraveler Forum Pro • Posts: 11,700
Re: Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

I know this!

You have missed the point. The previous poster was trolling A mount can't do FF the same as people Trolled F mount couldn't do FF.

Pepe-Lepue Senior Member • Posts: 1,942
Why the rude response

200mm wrote:

Not sure what elicited your crude insulting response to my question.

Please do elaborate on how I am an example citing the differences between a Nikon and a Canon user?

Using your logic; Should I assume that all Nikon users are nitwit elitist fanboys based solely on the likes of you?

Do you even know what gear I am currently shooting photography with? Currently which am I; A Nikon user or a Canon user? Please do tell.

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knowknowless Forum Member • Posts: 81
It's not the same sensor

Diddlbiker wrote:
I don't see why not. I cannot believe Sony would develop two 12MB
APS-C CMOS sensors (something they haven't done before)
simultaniously.

AFAIK the 14 bit on the D300 are coming out of a 12 bit sensor by
doing some fancy tricks during the readout of the sensor.

johnnygate wrote:

it has 12 bit on the sensor... Nikon has 14 bit on the sensor. Its
not the same sensor as the D300....

Nikon has designed & developed their new sensor, and they have about 30 patent on the design and inventions on that new sensor. So it's very expensive for Sony to make the same sensor.

And after all, is it so important who builds the sensor - I mean if you compare the Alpha 100 and the D80 it's a big difference in the final result - THE PICTURE. Just shoot a picture inhouse without flash and you wil se what i mean.

The sensor is stupid - it's the algorithms around the sensor who makes the stunning results. I prefer a medium sensor with great algorithms instead of a great sensor with bad algorithms....

BR

Adam

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Dan179 Senior Member • Posts: 1,466
Minolta

don't use top lcd this is the fact a700 is not competitor for D300.Simply D300 is far away beter compare to a700

Debankur Mukherjee
Debankur Mukherjee Contributing Member • Posts: 695
Re: Minolta

Just dont compare D300 with A700....Its no way near D300....
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Dan179 Senior Member • Posts: 1,466
Re: Minolta

I don't compare Read what I wrote

JulesJ
JulesJ Forum Pro • Posts: 45,680
Re: Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

Will this one feel like a toy in your hands like the Alpha?
Jules

M-L wrote:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/AA700/AA700A.HTM

The preview link in dpreview doesn't work for now.

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Black moles do not destroy information.

CAClark Senior Member • Posts: 2,817
Re: Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

I like verything except the styling of the camera, and the thing is GINORMOUS with the battery grip attached.... way way to deep in my opinion..... but the specs seem to be very strong, especially if the AF is better than the awful noisey 7D af.

Cheers!
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F-Nine ~ DIGITAL
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CAClark Senior Member • Posts: 2,817
Re: Top LCD

I'd agree in general, but having moved from KM 7D which used the rear panel to the D200, I do find that the top LCD setup is a little more convenient rather than having to effect meter up the camera just to see the rear screen status.

Cheers!
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CAClark Senior Member • Posts: 2,817
Re: Sony drops their bomb ---- A700 is here

It looks to be similar build level to the old 7D (and the D200/300), so I would say not it won't. Mag body/chassis never feels like a toy.
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toni
toni Senior Member • Posts: 1,657
Re: Soft & NR processed - Sony marketing is losing pace...

I believe the "softness" you refer is related with the lens they used to give that effect and "probably" nothing to do with sensor.

The lens used is a 135 STF and I don't know the condition used for taking that photo but @5.6 gives that kind of softness to the oof areas.
Check the plants at the outside window in 100%, do you see what I mean ?

Here is a link explaining the concept behind that lens.

http://www.dyxum.com/columns/articles/lenses/SAL-135F28/Sony-AF-135-STF-SAL-135F28_review.asp

Mauro.B wrote:

Examined at 100% is nothing to write home about.

a700_01.ipg is soft with smoothed-out details (eyebrows are little
more than a brown stripe, shirt texture barely acceptable on shoulder
and wrist only), skin seems waxed with evident NR in underexposed
neck area, and so on.

As a marketing effort, it seems too short or too early.

(It's a long way).

Thanks for the link.

M

Suntan Veteran Member • Posts: 6,011
Re: Both

Good for you, I'm glad you found what works for you.

If this is supposed to be some sort of rebuttle to my comments though, I really could care less. Your shooting style is your shooting style. It has no bearing on my preferences. AKA, it still doesn't change the fact that I would not pay as much for a camera that doesn't have a top LCD.

-Suntan

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Mauro.B
Mauro.B Senior Member • Posts: 2,500
Thanks for the info

Wheras the a700_01.jpg pic has been shot through a 135 mm lens @ F2.8, the a700_03.jpg pic has been shot through a 24 mm lens @ F8 and shares the overall soft and overprocessed look of the latter.

Take a look at skin ("waxed" texture) and hair to understand what I am talking about. Even wood texture is missing.

Even if a700_03.jpg has an angled subject, there is no area in perfect focus, which would tend to exclude front or back focus issues on either lens or camera side.

Most probably the raw to jpeg conversion software (either in-camera or external) used by Sony to generate posted images is too aggressive on luminance noise, hence the grazed-out details. It also appears to me that the same software applies to much smoothing on skin.

Let's see what happens during further development.

M

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toni
toni Senior Member • Posts: 1,657
Re: Soft & NR processed - Sony marketing is losing pace...

Looking better to the samples I think you are right, the other samples also show the same problem.

The results aren't that great if looking closer, still we don't know what settings where used in camera, lets wait for Phills review.
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toni
toni Senior Member • Posts: 1,657
Re: Thanks for the info

I have answer before reading your response
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shaocaholica Contributing Member • Posts: 870
Re: Minolta

Debankur Mukherjee wrote:

Just dont compare D300 with A700....Its no way near D300....

I'm pretty sure that everyone agrees that the A700 is spec'd lower than the D300 but that doesn't mean its "no way near" or "not even in the same class" as the D300. Its a notch down, not a step. And being only a "notch" lower still qualifies it for comparison for many of its features which we'll see in the upcomming reviews.

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