CLS Exposure Question

Started Jun 21, 2007 | Discussions
lightp8nter Contributing Member • Posts: 865
CLS Exposure Question

I have a D200 and 2 SB800s.

My question is this: What is the the difference between adjusting the flash output level (iTTL) and adjusting the D200 exposure compensation.

I would think the D200 exposure comp would adjust both camera and flash, but the flash would only effect the flash output.

Do I have this right?

Thanks,

Nate
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Sharma Regular Member • Posts: 175
Re: CLS Exposure Question

ya man ur right

Sharma

Jim Kaye Senior Member • Posts: 2,791
Re: CLS Exposure Question

This is a complicated question. Presumably you are using an auto-exposure mode on the camera (A, S, or P) and either TTL or TTL-BL? And are you using one flash or are you using one to trigger the other remotely (as well as perhaps to light the scene some itself). Technically a single flash is also part of the "Creative Lighting System" although you may be using the term CLS to mean wireless remote flash.

If you are using TTL (rather than TTL-BL) and a single flash attached directly (or through a cord) to your hotshoe is providing most of the light on the subject (such as shooting a person outdoors at night with a low enough ISO, small enough aperture, and fast enough shutter speed that the ambient light doesn't contribute much to the exposure), then changing exposure compensation and changing flash compensation should have pretty much the same effect. (They aren't exactly the same if you measure carefully under a wide enough range, but they have close enough to the same effect to consider them the same for practical purposes.)

If there is more ambient light, the ISO is higher, the aperture is wider, and/or the shutter speed is slower (say, normal indoor lighting) so that the ambient light contributes to the exposure, then the effect of exposure compensation and flash compensation for a single flash will differ. Exposure compensation will increase the expousre of the subject lit by flash as well as the exposure of the background. Flash compensation will increase only the exposure of the subject (assuming the background is far enough away not to be lit mostly by the flash). In a typical living room, the difference may not be so obvious because the flash may provide more light to the background than the ambient light source does.

If you're using TTL-BL or multiple wireless flash (which is always a form of TTL-BL), and the ambient light, ISO, aperture, and shutter speed are such that the ambient light contributes to the exposure, it is more complicated. The camera may adjust both exposure compensation and flash compensation to provide what its little eyes and brain think is a "pleasing" balance of flash and ambient light. Whatever you dial in for exposure compensation or flash compensation may be overridden or ignored, and you don't know what the camera is doing, ultimately.

This is one of the reasons why experts like Thom Hogan recommend for flash photography that you use manual camera exposure settings (to control how much ambient light contributes to the background exposure) and use TTL (rather than TTL-BL) with flash compensation (set either on the camera or the flash but preferably not both, because they are additive) to determine how much the flash illuminates your subject. This approach has the additional advantage that it allows use of all apertures on your lens (which shooting in P mode won't) and that it encourages you to think about different situations (flash providing the main light on subject, flash providing only fill light on subject, etc.) in the same way.

I'm sure Thom or others will jump in here if I've misstated or omitted anything.
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Jim Kaye

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Pradipta Dutta
Pradipta Dutta Veteran Member • Posts: 9,782
Jim summed it up extremely well

Only additional comment I will make is that camera's EV compensation and the flash compensation are additive. So, in the TTL example (where flash is the main contributor of light), if you dial in, say, -1EV flash compensation and +1EV exposure compensation, the background will be brightened while your main subject will be expose the way the set up would have done if you had not compensation dialed in either the flash or the camera.

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PLF Junior Member • Posts: 49
Re: CLS Exposure Question

Nate:

Check out this site -- I found it very useful.

http://www.planetneil.com/faq/flash-techniques.html

Pete

jean bernier Veteran Member • Posts: 3,181
Re: CLS Exposure Question

Camera exposure compensation will affect both camera(ambient light) and flash at the same time.
Flash exposure compensation will affect only flash.

The two compensations will be combined if you're using both so that if:

camera comp=minus 1 stop
flash comp=minus 1/3 stop

result is: ambient is 1 stop underexposed
flash is 1+ 1/3 = 1 1/3 stop underexposed

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OP lightp8nter Contributing Member • Posts: 865
Thank you all

Your responses were very helpful. I really want to control the light and understanding how the D200/CLS works is a big part of that.

BTW: I am eagerly awaiting Tom's update to his flash book. I have already learned a lot from his D200 manual.

Thanks again.
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dbvand Senior Member • Posts: 1,915
Re: CLS Exposure Question

It looks like you've already gotten some excellent replies but if you got the little booklet entitled "A collection of example photos" with your flashes, it shows a great pictoral explanation on the second-to-last page that helped me understand the difference.
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Jim Kaye Senior Member • Posts: 2,791
Thanks, Pradipta (nt)
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Jon Scott Regular Member • Posts: 241
Re: CLS Exposure Question

PLF wrote:

Check out this site -- I found it very useful.
http://www.planetneil.com/faq/flash-techniques.html

Useful indeed. Flash is one of the harder things to master IMO, and I'm nowhere near understanding it. Thanks for the link.

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Thanks,
Jon.
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