Why is D200 that much noiser than D80?

Started Jun 2, 2007 | Discussions
Joe0Bloggs Veteran Member • Posts: 5,391
Certainly possible

There's a lot that determines image noise other than the sensor... A/D converter, readout speed... Readout speed of 5 vs 3fps alone is enough to increase noise from a CCD. (not so CMOS?)

Joe0Bloggs Veteran Member • Posts: 5,391
But...

In that post you said you shot jpegs... did you shoot RAW too later?
--
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Hardly a single working camera. 100% experience-free poster. 100% theoretical musings.

RudivanS Veteran Member • Posts: 4,480
Re: sad to spend too much time looking at blowups of test images

Clark Hampton wrote:

Get a camera and start taking pictures. Get 12x18 prints from all
these cameras and you would be hard pressed to tell the difference.
Even at higher ISOs...really.

Ha, I take plenty of pictures mate.
--
Rudi -
15 years in Blade Runner Tokyo - back in Sunny Sydney now

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Kim Letkeman
Kim Letkeman Forum Pro • Posts: 33,435
100% crops are the bane of the beginner

RudivanS wrote:

side by side then.
Anyone?

While very useful to evaluate subtle image quality issues, 100% crops are on most monitors are the equivalent of looking at a 4foot wide print from less than 2 feet.

Completely unrealistic.

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Toermalijn
Toermalijn Forum Pro • Posts: 15,993
Re: That was my point.

some people can learn more, faster etc. Don't generalize people or insult them because you think you're superieur. Someday you might find out you can't know everything.

Tom Christiansen Senior Member • Posts: 2,239
Re: Analog circuit

kuma37 wrote:

In the Japanse camera site, Nikon engineer had answered
this issue (the difference of noise in D200 and D80).

According to the article, the main difference is in the
analog circuits of D200 and D80. D80 is refined to
eliminate as much noise as possible in the analog circuit.

That's very good information, particularly for those of us
who don't read Japanese (presuming it hasn't been translated).

Could you please give us the URL anyway?

thanks,

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tom

Toermalijn
Toermalijn Forum Pro • Posts: 15,993
Re: 100% crops are the bane of the beginner

yet you use em to evaluate your shots or to edit.

Toermalijn
Toermalijn Forum Pro • Posts: 15,993
Re: That was my point.

Some are satisfied with the incamera settings and don't wanna know everyhting about a camera. these people are satisfied with the quality it does that way.

I am not one of those but i don't judge other people for that.

In the end, a better picture that brings emotion or memories is much better then any static technically superieur picture.

Toermalijn
Toermalijn Forum Pro • Posts: 15,993
Re: Ok, it is noisier, but still better overall

probably right after the d3x and dh3.................................................

Hellashot Veteran Member • Posts: 7,234
lol, funny (nt)

(nt)

John Senior Member • Posts: 1,299
Re: Why is D200 that much noiser than D80?

I have two D200s and 1 D80 and the D80 is noisier than either D200.

Kim Letkeman
Kim Letkeman Forum Pro • Posts: 33,435
Re: 100% crops are the bane of the beginner

Toermalijn wrote:

yet you use em to evaluate your shots or to edit.

Quite true ... but we are talking about noise. And noise at 100% looks far different from noise at normal viewing distances. It is very misleading to evaluate noise differences only at 100%.

My point: a difference that makes no difference, is no difference.

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Kim Letkeman
Kim Letkeman Forum Pro • Posts: 33,435
Re: That was my point.

Toermalijn wrote:

I am not one of those but i don't judge other people for that.
In the end, a better picture that brings emotion or memories is
much better then any static technically superieur picture.

While this is true ... you have to have a "spectacular" subject (e.g. images from a war zone) before a technically inferior shot is even remotely compelling.

As for snap shots and memories ... that is not what a gear head site like dpreview is about. Anyone with the cheapest p&s can do fine in that department.

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AndreasE Contributing Member • Posts: 909
Yes, I did shoot RAW later

Unfortunately I don't have enough webspace to host it on the web. But all 11 cams had been used and compared on RAW was well.

Same result applies. D200 is noisier than D80 and D40X. What is different vs. the JPEG comparison, is that the D80 and D40X are about the same.

Andy

drip01
drip01 Senior Member • Posts: 2,906
But true, LOL (nt)
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kevm14 Senior Member • Posts: 2,253
Re: Why is D200 that much noiser than D80?

According to the tests I've seen, my impressions on the D200 were that I preferred its less aggressive NR (check out the huge dip in noise at ISO800 in the D80). As far as detail differences between sample images at higher ISO, I'd chalk that up to sharpening. Add a tight USM (300/0.2 or 0.3) to the D200 and I think you'll find the detail is there.

Get the D200!

DenverBryan Senior Member • Posts: 1,014
To Kim...

Thank you, thank you, thank you. I was going to say that AGAIN, but wanted to bail on this post.

I NEVER look at a photo at 100% for anything other than my own enjoyment. I process for noise and sharpness at 50% for ALL print sizes.

In fact, I just printed a football photo for a client at 11x14 that looks fantastic! At 100% it shows noise in the shadows. But I got it processed at 50% and it is great!

Photogs comparing at 100% are not living in the real world. Only bit land.

DenverBryan Senior Member • Posts: 1,014
My point

wasn't to insult anyone. Maybe you are just defensive?

And it wasn't to say anyone is or isn't superior.

It was that people shouldn't bad mouth different equipment until they have taken the time to learn the body, or the lens. THAT was my point.
You don't think that is true? You don't think that is a rational statement?

You think people should say this stinks, or that stinks, without really learning how to use the equipment, then making an educated judgment?

Wow! Welcome to DPReview!

kuma37 Regular Member • Posts: 130
Re: Analog circuit

Here it is.

http://dc.watch.impress.co.jp/cda/dslr/2006/10/16/4825.html

The engieer says as follows.

Nikon engineer:
The CCD used for D80 and D200 are basically samce.
The color filter and open ratio are same.
Regarding the S/N (noise), the signals comming from
CCD itself is same.

Interviewer:
But, how come the noise seems much reduced in D80 compared
to D200?

Nikon engineer:
Well, the color tuning between D80 and D200 is quite different.
That is one reason why the IQ looks different.

Interviewer:
You say CCD spec is same and also image engine LSI is same.
Does it mean, D80 is applying massive NR to the image?

Nikon engineer:
No, the NR of D80 and D200 is almost same.
But the path from CCD to the analog front end is different.
It could happen that 4ch CCD picks much noise than 2ch CCD.

RudivanS Veteran Member • Posts: 4,480
Re: Analog circuit

"It could happen that 4ch CCD picks much noise than 2ch CCD."
Intersting. Nice post too.
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