K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Started Sep 13, 2006 | Discussions
Sweets
Sweets Contributing Member • Posts: 656
K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

The specs from Steve's... stated:

'To provide shake reduction, the cam must know the focal lenght of the lens in use. F, FA, D-FA and Da automatically relay this info to the cam. ....K100D allows users to manually input focal lenght via SR-menu....'
My conclusions in using foreign lenses (non-Pentax):
K10D SR won't work.
K100D SR only works with fixed focal length lenses.

Is it possible that my conclusions are richt ?
--
rgrds. Henk (*istD&DBG-1).

 Sweets's gear list:Sweets's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GF2 Pentax K-01 Panasonic Lumix G 14mm F2.5 ASPH Panasonic Lumix G X Vario PZ 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 ASPH OIS Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +18 more
David Chin Forum Pro • Posts: 11,670
Question - is Pentax the only ...

... camera with built-in shake reduction that adjusts the SR according to the focal length of the lens?

This is fantastic if so!

Sweets wrote:

The specs from Steve's... stated:
'To provide shake reduction, the cam must know the focal lenght of
the lens in use. F, FA, D-FA and Da automatically relay this info
to the cam. ....K100D allows users to manually input focal lenght
via SR-menu....'
My conclusions in using foreign lenses (non-Pentax):
K10D SR won't work.
K100D SR only works with fixed focal length lenses.

Is it possible that my conclusions are richt ?
--
rgrds. Henk (*istD&DBG-1).

-- hide signature --
GossCTP Veteran Member • Posts: 4,751
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

I would imagine any modern third party lens would relay focal length to the camera. If it didn't, the camera will ask you for the focal length as it does for the old manual lenses. K10d and K100d should be no different from each other in this regard. For zooms, you can either turn the camera on and off to set different focal lengths, or you can set the minimum focal length (which results in less effective stabilization at the long end but will not cause problems).
--

We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom that is in it—and stop there; lest we be like the cat that sits down on a hot stove-lid. She will never sit down on a hot stove-lid again—and that is well; but also she will never sit down on a cold one any more. - Mark Twain

 GossCTP's gear list:GossCTP's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5 Pentax K-5 II Pentax K20D Pentax 16-85mm F3.5-5.6 WR Pentax smc DA 16-45mm F4 ED AL +7 more
selfnoise04101 Forum Member • Posts: 54
Re: Question - is Pentax the only ...

Well, SR works just fine with the kit zens, which is an 18-55mm zoom. So that's clearly fine. The k100d always knows what focal length the zoom is set at, btw, and presumably bases the SR setting on that.

I don't know how it would work with an old manual zoom, though... might be problematic.

As for third party lenses... I think they work? Don't have any, though. I certainly haven't heard any complaints so far.

Jim King
Jim King Veteran Member • Posts: 8,274
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Sweets wrote:

The specs from Steve's... stated:
'To provide shake reduction, the cam must know the focal lenght of
the lens in use. F, FA, D-FA and Da automatically relay this info
to the cam. ....K100D allows users to manually input focal lenght
via SR-menu....'
My conclusions in using foreign lenses (non-Pentax):
K10D SR won't work.

K100D SR only works with fixed focal length lenses.

Is it possible that my conclusions are richt ?

The K10D SR should work the same as the K100D SR - I suspect that as long as you manually input the focal length it will function with any lens, even a zoom if you use it at the FL you have set. As I don't have the K100D I can't test this. Anybody out there who can try a non-Pentax lens on a K100D and report the results?
--
Jim King - Retired Colormonger - Suburban Detroit, Michigan, USA; GMT -4h (EDT)

* * * * *
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

  • Sir Winston Churchill

* * * * *
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.

  • Albert Einstein

 Jim King's gear list:Jim King's gear list
Pentax K-3 Leica M Typ 240 Pentax MX-1 Fujifilm X30 Sony RX100 III +92 more
Jim King
Jim King Veteran Member • Posts: 8,274
You guys type faster than I can... :<) (nt)
-- hide signature --

Jim King - Retired Colormonger - Suburban Detroit, Michigan, USA; GMT -4h (EDT)

* * * * *
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.

  • Sir Winston Churchill

* * * * *
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.

  • Albert Einstein

 Jim King's gear list:Jim King's gear list
Pentax K-3 Leica M Typ 240 Pentax MX-1 Fujifilm X30 Sony RX100 III +92 more
Sweets
OP Sweets Contributing Member • Posts: 656
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Sweets wrote:

The specs from Steve's... stated:
'To provide shake reduction, the cam must know the focal lenght of
the lens in use. F, FA, D-FA and Da automatically relay this info
to the cam. ....K100D allows users to manually input focal lenght
via SR-menu....'
My conclusions in using foreign lenses (non-Pentax):
K10D SR won't work.
K100D SR only works with fixed focal length lenses.

Is it possible that my conclusions are richt ?
--
rgrds. Henk (*istD&DBG-1).

But than again, the focal length is always written in the exif data, even at non-Pentax lenses (Sigma, Tamron): so it is always known. So: SR should work in those cases.
Can a K100D owner (eg.Janneman) confirm on this ?
--
rgrds. Henk (*istD&DBG-1).

 Sweets's gear list:Sweets's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GF2 Pentax K-01 Panasonic Lumix G 14mm F2.5 ASPH Panasonic Lumix G X Vario PZ 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 ASPH OIS Pentax smc DA* 50-135mm F2.8 ED (IF) SDM +18 more
distudio Veteran Member • Posts: 3,913
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Sweets wrote:

But than again, the focal length is always written in the exif
data, even at non-Pentax lenses (Sigma, Tamron): so it is always
known. So: SR should work in those cases.
Can a K100D owner (eg.Janneman) confirm on this ?

No FL information is available when using genuine A series Pentax lenses either.

-- hide signature --

Rob

 distudio's gear list:distudio's gear list
Sony RX100 II Pentax K-3 Pentax K-5 IIs Pentax 645Z Nikon D750 +19 more
pic_ist Senior Member • Posts: 1,375
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

I don't think that is right my Sigma 70-200 APO reports focal lengths to my DS without any problems... hopefully someone can chime in with a K100D
--
mike

  • Problem behind camera *

Mark Stiebel Regular Member • Posts: 310
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Any lens, from any manufacturer, that transmits focal length to the camera will work automatically with SR.

Any lens, from any manufacturer that does not transmit the focal length to the camera, will work with SR providing that the focal length is manual selected from the camera's menu. In the case of a zoom length, best results are gained from inputting the currently selected focal length.

janneman02 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,733
I am sooo sad....

I am not taken seriously, my non-scientific approach is not taken seriously, not everybody reads my post.
Otherwise, I can't explain that there is still no answer to Sweets question.
Or a link to my test:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1036&message=19649980&q=sr+test&qf=m

-- hide signature --
RoscoT Senior Member • Posts: 2,943
Anyone w/K100D

Where in the menu do you enter FL for SR. Is it in the Fn menu or the main menu? If the main menu, how deep do you need to dig to get to the options?
Thanks
--
Rosco
Terminal Stage LBA
http://www.pbase.com/roscot

 RoscoT's gear list:RoscoT's gear list
Nikon D300 Nikon D700 Tamron AF 28-75mm F/2.8 XR Di LD Aspherical (IF) Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR Tokina AT-X 16-28mm f/2.8 Pro FX +10 more
Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

No, you are very wrong.

Lenses that follow the KAF mount specification, tells the actual focal length to the camera.

It's part of the KAF specification. This is true for Pentax own KAF lenses (F, FA, FA J, D FA and DA) and also the KAF lenses from third party companies, such as Sigma and Tamron.

The SR system relies on the same information as the automatic picture modes does in the K100D, and they work with Sigma etc...

When you use a zoom, the focal length is changed and the zoom lens tells the change to the camera, so SR works with a zoom. No problem!

Take care
R

Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

The manual focus A serie lenses (KA mount) doesn't contain the electronic chip that KAF lenses does! A lenses can only transmit the widest aperture to the camera, that's all they do. With the introduction of the KAF mount in 1987, Pentax also introduced focal length, distance information and other neat things. This information is given by any lens compatible with Pentax KAF mount. The third party makers KAF mount lenses must provide this information, otherwise they wouldn't work on Pentax AF bodies! The reason for the lenses to give the focal length to the camera is that Pentax patented multsegment metering uses the focal length information when it calculates the exposure! The focal length information is also used by the flash autozoom. Yes, when I put my 10 years old AF330FTZ flash on my camera, it autozooms to the focal length choosen by me on the lens. When I use a zoom, the flash autozoom to the choosen focal length. It works with all KAF compatible lenses, like the Tokina AF 28-105 f/3.5-4.5 AL I had for a couple of years before I replace it with the FA 28-105 f/3.2-4.5.

This is a silly discussion...

Take care
R

Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: Anyone w/K100D

When a lens is attached that do not transmit focal length to the camera, the K100D and K10D automatically pops up a menu where you set the focal length. You only have to do this once as long as the lens is attached to the camera.

Take care
R

janneman02 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,733
Re: Anyone w/K100D

Yes

RoscoT wrote:

Where in the menu do you enter FL for SR. Is it in the Fn menu or
the main menu? If the main menu, how deep do you need to dig to get
to the options?

It is on the main menu.
Two ways of getting there:

If you put a manual lens on the camera and turn on while the SR switch is "on"too, the screen will light up with the bar on wich you can choose focal length.

If a manual lens is mounted and the camera us swiitched on without SR engaged and, then engaged, the screen will stay black. Go to menu --> rec. mode --> scroll down to shake reduction and the SR focal lenght barr appears..

Only known Pentax focal lenghts are programmed. Will be a bit cumbersome with manual zooms I guess.

Also SR won't allow for changed FL due to use of a converter (If it is an AF converter). With AF converters no possibility of manually entering the FL. Would love to see that fixed in firmware update.

Thanks
--
Rosco
Terminal Stage LBA
http://www.pbase.com/roscot

-- hide signature --
distudio Veteran Member • Posts: 3,913
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

Roland Mabo wrote:

This is a silly discussion...

Be specific then, save the less well informed from confusion.

-- hide signature --

Rob

 distudio's gear list:distudio's gear list
Sony RX100 II Pentax K-3 Pentax K-5 IIs Pentax 645Z Nikon D750 +19 more
Roland Mabo Forum Pro • Posts: 12,462
Re: K100D & K10D, shake reduction and 'foreign' optics.

I think that I'm very specific in my statements that KAF mount lenses works with the SR mechanism, because all KAF lenses provides information about focal length. If they didn't, they wouldn't work on any Pentax KAF camera. Pentax introduced the KAF mount in 1987 with the SF bodies and the F lenses. This was Pentax first AF system (it is true that Pentax introduced the ME-F body with in-lens autofocus in 1982 I think, but it was not a complete system, it was only one body and one single lens. It was never sold in large numbers).

So, any lens compatible with Pentax KAF will give information about the actucal focal length to the camera, this also works with zooms, and it has worked since 1987. Yes, third party lenses will work if they are Pentax KAF compatible which is the same as compatible with Pentax autofocus mount. Pentax autofocus mount is the same as Pentax KAF. KAF = Pentax K bayonet autofocus mount. With the term "third party lenses", it means lenses from other manufacturers than Pentax, this includes lenses from Tamron, Tokina, Cosina/Soligor/Vivitar, Sigma (sometimes labeled as Quantaray on the US market). The Schneider-Kreuznach D-Xenon lenses are also compatible since they are made for Pentax KAF and they are manufactured by Pentax.

To sum up - all autofocus lenses that can be used on Pentax autofocus bodies works with the Shake Reduction system without the hazzle of dialing in focal lengths manually.

Is this being specific enough?

Take care
R

Erik37 Veteran Member • Posts: 4,558
Leica

have introduced a system which marks old MF lenses with a
bar code that's painted on the lens and read by the body when
the lens is mounted. So the camera knows what lens is used.
Perhaps something for Pentax to copy?

Just my two öre
Erik from Sweden

D TONG Senior Member • Posts: 2,538
Re: Anyone w/K100D

Roland Mabo wrote:

When a lens is attached that do not transmit focal length to the
camera, the K100D and K10D automatically pops up a menu where you
set the focal length. You only have to do this once as long as the
lens is attached to the camera.

Take care
R

Confirmed. Also it remember the last time focal length you set as well. I have an A300mm for it. Each time I pop the lenes it shows 300mm (set earlier) and asks for confirmation. Very smart.

Daniel, Toronto
http://www.pbase.com/danieltong

Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads