Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

Started May 15, 2006 | Discussions
aIexander Junior Member • Posts: 43
Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

Hi, all.

This may seem like a redundant question, but I couldn't find straight answers in threads.

I ordered the R2400 printer and would like to print out some of my photographs. I am interested to print in 13X19 or close to this size on a heavy matte paper for gallery framing. Longevity and stability is a concern, so I would like some paper which contributes to fade resisting (RC ???) . Most works are BW, but not all. I am not interested in swapping cartridges or printing Glossy prints, which would somewhat narrow the selection of papers. But I am indeed confused with the choice of Ilfords, etc. as well as possibility to actually load them into the printer, etc.
ICM Profile availability is also very important.
Money is not concern but consideration.

Is there any value to the "velvet" and other interesting choices by Epson? I am not sure what they concider "art" paper.
Thank you for help.

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Chris the tech guy Senior Member • Posts: 1,401
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

as for longevity, you can see how Epson's papers fare be visiting Wilhelm/s site or visit http://www.inkjetart.com/news/longevity/index.html where I've distilled it down a bit
--
Webmaster and Tech Support guy at inkjetart.com

Robert Snow Contributing Member • Posts: 921
That's easy...

And my favorite Epson matte finish paper is Velvet Fine Art. Check the price before ordering though so you won't be too surprised.

It is an excellent paper with deep blacks and prints great - pro

It is very delicate and the coating can 'chip off' if not handled with care - CON

Advice - brush off before printing with a draftsman's brush to remove any loose coating.

Another paper that prints beautifully is "Hama-mules" Photo Rag. It is higher than Velvet fine Art but is a fine paper.

You can check out both of these at Chris' inkjetart.com

bob snow

Chris the tech guy Senior Member • Posts: 1,401
Re: That's easy...

Robert Snow wrote:

Another paper that prints beautifully is "Hama-mules" Photo Rag.
It is higher than Velvet fine Art but is a fine paper.

Hahnemuhle and despite how a few of the salespeople here insist on saying it, it's not pronounced "han-e-mule-RRRR"
--
Webmaster and Tech Support guy at inkjetart.com

aIexander OP Junior Member • Posts: 43
Re: That's easy...

thank you so much, guys. bookmarking Chris' site now.

do you have any opinion of Ilfords? I remember them from my darkroom days, just visited the site and see they have a wide selection. any takers?
thanks again!

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thkhor Regular Member • Posts: 143
Re: That's easy...

Hi Chris, so how would you pronounce it? Hah ner mu ler?
--
TH

brettw Regular Member • Posts: 133
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

I got some sampler packs from Legion and Red River. They aren't very expensive and have a lot of different papers to try out. I thought it was a lot of fun trying out all the different weights and surface styles.

Brett

Chris the tech guy Senior Member • Posts: 1,401
no "r" in Hahnemuhle (nt)
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aIexander OP Junior Member • Posts: 43
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

Thanks, Brett.

To be honest, I pretty much understand there is a very wide range of paper available, and the cost is not an issue.

I want paper that lasts and works with Matte color on the R2400 and doesnt' impair print's worth.

I guess Hahnemuhle is the choice for me, because i heard of them from some galleries. I wonder if anyone had problem with this printer and the thickness of some of these art papers.

And in the meantime, I would go with some cheaper art line by epson for the try and tweak phase and for my parent's reduced copies

brettw wrote:

I got some sampler packs from Legion and Red River. They aren't
very expensive and have a lot of different papers to try out. I
thought it was a lot of fun trying out all the different weights
and surface styles.

Brett

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a.

Robert Snow Contributing Member • Posts: 921
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

aIexander wrote:

I guess Hahnemuhle is the choice for me, because i heard of them
from some galleries. I wonder if anyone had problem with this
printer and the thickness of some of these art papers.

Just use the second tray (not the front feed). The first on on top is for medium and low thickness papers...right behind it the 2nd one for the thicker art papers.

Enjoy the r2400. I sure have.

bob snow

Danny D Regular Member • Posts: 416
some i've tried

Hi, good to see you at least got some ideas here. I recently posted the same question and got no responses, so I began testing papers myself.

The good people from hawk mountain were kind enough to send me some free paper to try out. So far I like there's much better the the hanemhule paper.

Consider the grayhawk for proofing and merlin for gallery prints. Blows away the hanemhule photo rag which so many here reccomend.

Have also tried epsons line of FA papers-not impressed at all.

Arches Infinity smooth-very good, better than hanemhule photo rag.

I will be trying the following soon:red river, moab, crane museo silver rag and hanemhule's new FA pearl paper when sheets become available.
I am also printing fine art work like you.

Just a note on printing with the 2400:
Use the manual rear feed for these papers.
Brush off both sides of paper.
Handle by edges.

Run through some blank sheets plain paper to clean printer feed rollers after several prints.

aIexander OP Junior Member • Posts: 43
Re: some i've tried

Danni, thank you for the detailed reply - much appreciate it!

So far I only ordered a couple of Epson Velvet Fine Art in letter size for trial prints and gifts-sized prints to fill the dormant ikea frames and ship to relatives.

My printer is still on the way, and I am guessing I will have a few days to even get a "feel" for everything, play with advanced BW, etc.

I am not much of an experimenter, but willing to find 2 or 3 trusted perfect papertypes, regardless of cost. I am foreseeing having questions regarding paper settings in the driver when loading those "not listed" papers. When I do, I will post a question here, hoping you come across it.

Out of curiocity, what do you do for matting/framing and what/where do you display?

Thanks again!
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Laurence J. Segil Regular Member • Posts: 411
Re: some i've tried

My favorites:
1) Epson ultrasmooth fine art paper
2) Epson velvet fine art
3)Hahnemuhle museum etching
I soft proof them in PS and go with whichever looks best.
LJ

aIexander OP Junior Member • Posts: 43
Re: some i've tried

thank you for this list.

i forgot all about soft-proofing. is it a reliable estimate? i guess it is, since you use it.

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Danny D Regular Member • Posts: 416
softproofing, frames,etc...

Hi,

for softproofing, if you have a hardware calibrated monitor(CRT), and setup the software correctly, and have a good icc profile, yes it works, and is a must.

I softproof and it works well for me.

As for print driver settings and 3rd party papers:

1.Most good 3rd party paper suppliers will offer these icc profiles and driver settings for the 2400 b/c it is a popular printer right now for fine art. If they don't I would not even bother to use there paper. It is sort of a necessary part of the product in order for them to sell it, to help you get the best results out of using there product, if not why bother to buy there product, just by someone elses who does offer this service.

2.If you really find a paper you like and will use, some people say to get a custom profile made. I have not done this so can't comment on it. All I can say is, if you go this route, consider that each batch of ink and paper you buy, even though the same, will still have variances, so you may find yourself having to repeat it often or buying the equipment and doing it yourself.

BTW-from what I can ascertain from these forums, everyone reccomends buying the gretag macbeth or X-rite systems for this (a considerable sum to invest).

3.Framing and matting-depends on your "final destination" for the print.
Here are some ideas-

a.buy ready made stuff when possible, doing it yourself to much trouble, but possible.

b.Target has some nice gallery frames on the cheap, just swap out the mattes, which are cheapey.
c.Check out http://www.farmedestination.com and http://www.americanframe.com .
d.Also check http://www.pfile.com and http://www.archivalusa.com . (MCS Poster Frames)

e.Lately I've been mounting my prints to foamcore and spraying with premier art printshield. Then I mount directly to wall unframed, has a nice look to it. You may want to use gatrofoam for this, then glue a piece of lightweight wood to the back of the board and mount to wall.

f. Also with mattes be sure to measure your prints first before ordering any to get the exact measurement off the opening.

Be sure and check out framedestinaton website, has a lot of useful info on framing.

g.For canvas, I am still working on perfecting the stretching and framing. I buy the stretcher bars from http://www.misterart.com and box frames from http://www.americanframe.com which fit the stretcher bars perfectly. I will try to find out which one exactly and post back.

Good luck and any Q's just post back.
Danny

gnuyork Contributing Member • Posts: 905
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

It's been quite a while since I have posted or even visited the forum. Been into vintage guitars and amps lately... but I just did quite a bit of B&W prinitng last week with the 2400.

I have tried the following with the 2400:

Epson Enhanced matte
Epson Fine Art Velvet
Hahnemuhle Satin rag.

My favorite for B&W is the Satin Rag... it has an ever so slight bit of a warmer tone than the B&Ws made with the Velvet, and it has an very interesting sheen.

I prefer the velvet for my color work, the color seems to have a little more saturation and pop than the Satin rag...

I do most of my proofing on the enhanced matte... however sometimes I end up using the enhanced matte for final prints as well... some times the other papers just don't work out on some images where I need shadow detail... the others have very rich dmaxes and sometimes I can't pull out the detail without losing contrast.

I have also tried PermaJet Delta, but I used that mainly when I was doing B&Ws with the 1280 and MIS inks... to me the 2400 is a better system than the MIS and much easier to use.

POAH Contributing Member • Posts: 597
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

olmec optimum satin
ilford smooth pearl
epson premium luster

all have ICC profiles for them
--
PhD Student and photographer

James Bemus Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: Paper reccomendations for R2400, please

Kodak's Professional Inkjet Photo Paper comes in glossy and luster, and they both use the same ICC/ICM profiles.

In the US Kodak has 5 sheet sample packs of the Professional Inkjet Photo Paper in Luster and Glossy finish in 8.5x11 size. You can request one for free by calling the technical support line 800-235-6325 x83.

Kodak also has ICM/ICC profiles (for color & B&W images) available for the paper for use with many Epson and Canon printers. Kodak also provides the workflow method to get the best results for both color and B&W printng. These can be downloaded for free at :

http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/professional/products/ekn02891.jhtml?id=0.1.14.24&lc=en

aIexander OP Junior Member • Posts: 43
Re: softproofing, frames,etc...

Thank you sooo much, Danny, for the detailed reply. It is very helpful.

Danny D wrote:

Hi,

for softproofing, if you have a hardware calibrated monitor(CRT),
and setup the software correctly, and have a good icc profile, yes
it works, and is a must.

Monitor is calibrated bi-weekly like a clock.

I softproof and it works well for me.

As for print driver settings and 3rd party papers:

1.Most good 3rd party paper suppliers will offer these icc profiles
and driver settings for the 2400 b/c it is a popular printer right
now for fine art. If they don't I would not even bother to use
there paper. It is sort of a necessary part of the product in order
for them to sell it, to help you get the best results out of using
there product, if not why bother to buy there product, just by
someone elses who does offer this service.

That's what I was sort of expecting of them, but wanted to make sure. Thank you

2.If you really find a paper you like and will use, some people say
to get a custom profile made. I have not done this so can't comment
on it. All I can say is, if you go this route, consider that each
batch of ink and paper you buy, even though the same, will still
have variances, so you may find yourself having to repeat it often
or buying the equipment and doing it yourself.
BTW-from what I can ascertain from these forums, everyone
reccomends buying the gretag macbeth or X-rite systems for this (a
considerable sum to invest).

I had exactly the same thought about this. Will get a custom profile when I have a 50+ print queue to be done at one go, so I buy ink-paper together, hoping for the same batch, profile at Inkjetart.com and go nuts starting from there. I am hoping the calibration devices and spectometers would drop down to a few hundred soon (in years). Spyders did.

3.Framing and matting-depends on your "final destination" for the
print.

I will probably end up buying bulk frames of standard size, but cut custom mats for each picture, depending on the picture. these links are very helpful, thank you!

Here are some ideas-
a.buy ready made stuff when possible, doing it yourself to much
trouble, but possible.
b.Target has some nice gallery frames on the cheap, just swap out
the mattes, which are cheapey.
c.Check out http://www.farmedestination.com and
http://www.americanframe.com .
d.Also check http://www.pfile.com and http://www.archivalusa.com . (MCS Poster
Frames)
e.Lately I've been mounting my prints to foamcore and spraying with
premier art printshield. Then I mount directly to wall unframed,
has a nice look to it. You may want to use gatrofoam for this, then
glue a piece of lightweight wood to the back of the board and mount
to wall.
f. Also with mattes be sure to measure your prints first before
ordering any to get the exact measurement off the opening.

Be sure and check out framedestinaton website, has a lot of
useful info on framing.

g.For canvas, I am still working on perfecting the stretching and
framing. I buy the stretcher bars from http://www.misterart.com and box
frames from http://www.americanframe.com which fit the stretcher bars
perfectly. I will try to find out which one exactly and post back.

Good luck and any Q's just post back.
Danny

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