DPReview.com is closing April 10th - Find out more

Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Started Jan 2, 2006 | Discussions
CHIA Veteran Member • Posts: 3,158
Re: sarcasm can....

wmsc wrote:

CHIA.... just checked out your gallery.... there are some nice
portraits in there.....

Thank you very much....mostly just family shots & stuff around town, but sure have a ton of fun, really appreciate the kind words.

Looks like you have had some pretty cool opportunities to shoot some live concerts....very nice as well...that would be a blast!

CHIA

http://www.pbase.com/chia/

mdunmore New Member • Posts: 3
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I just got done wasting my time reading all these repsonses and still have the same opinion...

if you want the features and benifits of a point and shoot then buy one. Don't force point and shoot features on the DSLRs just to satisfy your wants for a flipout screen with live preview.

Their are plenty of highly capable and extremely high qaulity point and shoots out there if you prefer using one. Nothing wrong with knowing your requirements and buying a camera that meets them.

I would never buy a DSLR with a flip out screen and live preview, I would never use it and it would mostly likely just break anyway.

Damo83 Regular Member • Posts: 361
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

hmm. i wonder if consumers/photographers stop requesting features then maybe we won't see any more breakthroughs....

it may seem like the technology for live preview in a dSLR is in it's infancy, but personally i appreciate people who have (seemingly) unrealistic expectations. good on everyone for being vocal.

damo

mdunmore wrote:

I just got done wasting my time reading all these repsonses and
still have the same opinion...

if you want the features and benifits of a point and shoot then buy
one. Don't force point and shoot features on the DSLRs just to
satisfy your wants for a flipout screen with live preview.

Their are plenty of highly capable and extremely high qaulity point
and shoots out there if you prefer using one. Nothing wrong with
knowing your requirements and buying a camera that meets them.

I would never buy a DSLR with a flip out screen and live preview, I
would never use it and it would mostly likely just break anyway.

-- hide signature --

**********************************
Eye Ecs Yoo Ess Four Hundred
http://www.designsbydamian.com.au

 Damo83's gear list:Damo83's gear list
Canon PowerShot S400 Nikon D7000 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 50mm F1.4G
mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Apparently thare are some who feel that the dSLRs have gone about as far as they NEED to go. My opinion is that, with the limitations of the mirror box and the flipping mirror, they have gone about as far as they CAN in many areas. The live preview being one. (I know you can add a CCD in the light path like the Oly 330, but that's a makeshift cludge).

But I see a new breed of digital camera that will leapfrog the dSLR and will be the best of both the dSLR and the digicam. Whether fixed lens or interchangeable lens will depend on the manufacturer and target market. The Sony R1 is just a baby step in that direction. More technological developments in noise reduction in live-view CMOS sensor and high resolution/refresh displays are needed yet to be competitive.

That's my opinion. And no, we don't need no stinking live view on a dSLR.

-- hide signature --

mamallama

 mamallama's gear list:mamallama's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 +1 more
kema Regular Member • Posts: 113
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

And now Oly has come up with its E330, a dSLR with Live preview LCD.

I believe the trend is not stopping there ...

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Except the live preview doesn't come from the sensor that records the image. It's more like a stopgap gimmick.

-- hide signature --

mamallama

kema wrote:

And now Oly has come up with its E330, a dSLR with Live preview LCD.

I believe the trend is not stopping there ...

 mamallama's gear list:mamallama's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 +1 more
justin Regular Member • Posts: 283
what I do with Live preview

I make my living with photography and every tool has its use . A live preview and flip screen really helps me when I must

  • shoot with my camera held overhead (up to 2 - 2 1/2 meters depending how long my arms are on a particular day) this is great in crowds occaisionally.

  • shoot low and difficult to see points of view such as archirectural models and artist's maquettes that otherwise require a periscope, 90 degree finder or some type of waist level viewfinder.

  • shoot with the viewfinder flipped out when in extremely tight corners on a tripod

  • shoot with the viewfinder flipped backwards for copystand work thus removing the need for a stool

  • shoot with the viewfinder pointed towards the front when I need to see an arrangement or composition that is interactive (self portraits, moving small things around on a seamless . .. )

  • close ups and macro stuff is a joy when you do not have to put your face where the camera is - it is wonderful to "explore" with the flip screen and live preview .

  • and of course , for shooting surreptitiously on the bus!

The live preview flip screen has made certain types of pictures practical, that were very awkward or difficult before. It accounts for a fair amount of the work I do. It is a fabulous feature.

I use a pro1 when using this.

It will be an invaluable tool for many on DSLR cameras.

Jessedog Forum Member • Posts: 83
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

"There is no reason for any individual to have a computer in his home."
Ken Olsen, President, Digital Equipment, 1977
US computer engineer & industrialist (1926 - )

-- hide signature --

http://www.pbase.com/stu_m
Canon 300D
Tamron 12-24 f4
Sigma 18-50 2.8 EX
Canon 28-135 IS, Canon 70-200 f4L, Canon 75-300 IS
Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 85mm 1.8

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Ken statement was correct for the time it was spoken, 1977. A computer defined then took at least a room (DEC minicomputer), consumed lots of power and could do little of interest for an indivdual that a handheld calculator couldn't do. It's just what a computer is now and what it can do have changed.

What's your point?

-- hide signature --

mamallama

Jessedog wrote:

"There is no reason for any individual to have a computer in his
home."
Ken Olsen, President, Digital Equipment, 1977
US computer engineer & industrialist (1926 - )

 mamallama's gear list:mamallama's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 +1 more
Jessedog Forum Member • Posts: 83
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

You are exactly right and that is my point. A live preview on a DSLR may not be something that can be implemented to meet the high standards of professional photographers today... however you can be sure that in a relatively short-time (

Those people who claim that live preview is not useful or will never be used by high end professionals are the same people who claimed that professionals would never use digital. We should not underestimate the advancements in technology. And I for one can't wait for an implementation of live preview that will be functional and useful.

-- hide signature --

http://www.pbase.com/stu_m
Canon 300D
Tamron 12-24 f4
Sigma 18-50 2.8 EX
Canon 28-135 IS, Canon 70-200 f4L, Canon 75-300 IS
Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 85mm 1.8

SNGX1327 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,186
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

gee, i bought an SLR camera to get more into photography and away from this "pointing and shooting"...

LCD preview isn't all it's cracked up to be. i was looking at some pictures i took a year ago, and i realized that they were all ruined because they were out of focus. there is no way i could have known what was in focus. it was pictures of a turtle walking in tall grass, taken with the camera down in the grass. of course, the camera focused on some blades of grass in front of the turtle every time. had i had a TTL optical system i would have been dead on.

if you use photography for a living, you should probably have more than one camera body anyway

i just don't see why you would want to merge the two. if were two similar camera released one with LCD one without, i would go for the non-LCD camera every time.

so you use your LCD. okay. then why do you want and SLR camera? it doesn't make sense to me. just get a point and shoot camera. look at the S3 IS, it's got a better lens than my rebel! heck, my G2 took better pictures out of the box than my 350D until i learned how to use it, and sometimes i think that the G2 may have been better for some shots, but i enjoy using the SLR so much more that i don' trelaly care

and finally, you know taking pictures without using the viewfinder ISN'T HARD TO DO! i do it all the time! with a wide angle lens it's pretty hard not to get a picture of what you're aiming at. focus is the only thing you have to worry about-same problem that you have with a point and shoot anyway

and finally if you REALLY need a live preview, they make an angled-viewfinder extender. if you didn't want to buy extras for your camera you shouldn't have gotten an SLR in the first place!

PixelMinded Senior Member • Posts: 1,033
Congratulations but let's be fairer

SNGX1327 wrote:

Congratulations on your new buy, but being happy with it should not make u belittle P&Ss unfairly like this. Unless u want to justify the higher price that u had to pay for the DSLR.

LCD preview isn't all it's cracked up to be. i was looking at some
pictures i took a year ago, and i realized that they were all
ruined because they were out of focus. there is no way i could have
known what was in focus.

There is manual focus with magnification (digital zoom) on the screen. Also newer P&Ss are much better than older ones. Among the Powershots of Canon for example DigicII vs DigicI makes a big difference. A610 is DigicII and I took over 3000 shots so far with no focusing problems like what u describe (even AF shots).

LCD (or EVF) has a big plus point over the optical viewfinder (OVF) of SLRs in that they show u the exposure, white balance...etc as they will appear in ur photo, OVF doesnt show any of this. What see in the OVF might be more similar to reality --than LCD-- but much less similar to the photo. And presuming that u are not using the camera as a binocular, I would guess that u need similarity to the photo not to reality.

Also OVF is the main reason why a DSLR has to be heavy/bulky/expensive: In order to have a wide OVF u need a bigger mirror which requires the lens and sensor to be of a much wider diameter/digonal and this results in the huge size&price difference between SLRs and P&Ss. This is in addition to the direct effect of the reflex system on size/weight/price. Also no LCD means no swivel or difficult-angle shots.

 PixelMinded's gear list:PixelMinded's gear list
Canon PowerShot Pro1 Sony a5100 Sony E 16-50mm F3.5-5.6 PZ OSS +1 more
Jessedog Forum Member • Posts: 83
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I've been an SLR user for 20 years and barely use my "point and shoot" camera, although I do own one. Your comments about not being able to focus with the current LCD is what I believe will be a non-issue as technology catches up to the reality of using a live preview. The point of my comments in this thread is that we don't realize yet what we will need or use as technology advances. Just because we don't need a live preview today, does not mean we won't need it in a few years from now.

I didn't need a cell phone 10 years ago, but I need it now.
Thanks.

-- hide signature --

http://www.pbase.com/stu_m
Canon 300D
Tamron 12-24 f4
Sigma 18-50 2.8 EX
Canon 28-135 IS, Canon 70-200 f4L, Canon 75-300 IS
Canon 50mm 1.8, Canon 85mm 1.8

Auriga Contributing Member • Posts: 562
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I've read on more than one occasion that a live preview LCD would degrade the performance of a dslr - I'm just wondering by how much?

Let's take the existing Canon CMOS chip and throw it out the window... let's say Canon develops an APS-sized CCD chip i.e. similar to the 1/1.8" for the G6 or 2/3" for the Pro1, only the size is equal to that of the one found in the Canon 1.6 crop dSLRs.

from a general perspective, is it possible to guess how it's performance would compare to the CMOS chip? Would the chip really get that hot if it provided a live-preview?

-- hide signature --
OP TimK. New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

TimK. wrote:

I might consider getting an SLR camera if Canon made one with a flip-around display in the back. What's the deal? Is a flip-around display on an SLR too much to ask?

Well, they're here now.  But it took a few years.

OP TimK. New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I do love those flip-around displays.

KEG
KEG Veteran Member • Posts: 4,910
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

TimK. wrote:

I do love those flip-around displays.

I have got to admit that I kind of like the implementation of the screen on G7 mk II over G2.

-- hide signature --

KEG

 KEG's gear list:KEG's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS R Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 32mm F1.4 Canon RF 50mm F1.8 STM +21 more
KEG
KEG Veteran Member • Posts: 4,910
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Auriga wrote:

I've read on more than one occasion that a live preview LCD would degrade the performance of a dslr - I'm just wondering by how much?

Let's take the existing Canon CMOS chip and throw it out the window... let's say Canon develops an APS-sized CCD chip i.e. similar to the 1/1.8" for the G6 or 2/3" for the Pro1, only the size is equal to that of the one found in the Canon 1.6 crop dSLRs.

from a general perspective, is it possible to guess how it's performance would compare to the CMOS chip? Would the chip really get that hot if it provided a live-preview?

After a decade and a half with liveview DSLRs and mirrorless cams I can safely confirm that there is no difference at all.

-- hide signature --

KEG

 KEG's gear list:KEG's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS R Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 32mm F1.4 Canon RF 50mm F1.8 STM +21 more
KEG
KEG Veteran Member • Posts: 4,910
Re: I want a live feedback LCD

mamallama wrote:

Jogn V:

Your ideas seem like an impractical cludge, frought with many pitfalls. I think better solutions are coming soon to have a live preview on a camera that rivals the speed and AF performance and image quality of dSLRs. Many thoughts have put forth in earlier threads here.

It only took 15 years for this to get into sport level pro Canon mirrorless (Canon EOS R3)

-- hide signature --

KEG

 KEG's gear list:KEG's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS R Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 32mm F1.4 Canon RF 50mm F1.8 STM +21 more
KEG
KEG Veteran Member • Posts: 4,910
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

TimK. wrote:

I do love those flip-around displays.

Reading the comments I am just wondering what everyone would have thought of EOS R3 way back in 2006.

-- hide signature --

KEG

 KEG's gear list:KEG's gear list
Canon EOS M6 Canon EOS R Canon EOS M6 II Canon EF-M 32mm F1.4 Canon RF 50mm F1.8 STM +21 more
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum MMy threads