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Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Started Jan 2, 2006 | Discussions
TimK. New Member • Posts: 17
Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I might consider getting an SLR camera if Canon made one with a flip-around display in the back. What's the deal? Is a flip-around display on an SLR too much to ask?

Michael McCarthy Senior Member • Posts: 1,561
Yes, its too much to ask

At least for a resonable price. DSLR's do not have a live preview on the LCD like the point and shoots do. The LCD is used onl;y to inspect the shot after it is taken. I believe a manufacturer has a modified DSLR with live preview but it is expensive and may have compromises to do this.

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

Yes. Too much to ask at this time. It's impossible with the flipping mirror design because the light path is diverted to the OVF and only available to the CMOS sensor during exposure. Moreover even if you got rid of the reflexing mirror and let the light go directly to the sensor during composing, the current Canon CMOS sensors could not feed a live signal to an LCD. You would need a CCD or a CMOS sensor like the one in the Sony R1 to get a live output to an LCD.

TimK. wrote:

I might consider getting an SLR camera if Canon made one with a
flip-around display in the back. What's the deal? Is a
flip-around display on an SLR too much to ask?

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Zarathustra Senior Member • Posts: 1,797
A limited flip-around display CAN be done....

It can be done with todays sensors without sacrifying anything except Live preview.

Now, that is a big compromise, but at least such a flip-around display can be useful in certain circunstances.

I have no idea why no company has come with such simple idea yet.

Maybe 2006 is the year when we are going to see D-SRLs with live preview with the flip-out LCD, BUT compromising image quality, such is the case with the Sony R1.

I think there is a market for a Rebel XT with flip-around but not live preview. I would buy one.

That feature alone is enough to sway me into other brands too!

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: A limited flip-around display CAN be done....

Zarathustra:

I'm at a loss as to figure out in your design what's the light path around the flipping reflex mirror that diverts the light to the EVF.

What's the feed to the flip-around display for composing?

True the R1 sensor has it's limitations, but it's breakthrough technology that goes in an exciting direction that's will be developed and improved.

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mamallama

Zarathustra wrote:

It can be done with todays sensors without sacrifying anything
except Live preview.

Now, that is a big compromise, but at least such a flip-around
display can be useful in certain circunstances.

I have no idea why no company has come with such simple idea yet.

Maybe 2006 is the year when we are going to see D-SRLs with live
preview with the flip-out LCD, BUT compromising image quality, such
is the case with the Sony R1.

I think there is a market for a Rebel XT with flip-around but not
live preview. I would buy one.

That feature alone is enough to sway me into other brands too!

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secret Contributing Member • Posts: 507
ZigView...

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Visit me at: http://www.digital-imagination.be

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: ZigView...

Now that's desperate for just a waist-level viewfinder. Wonder how much degradation you get compared to the much touted OVF?

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mamallama

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Michael McCarthy Senior Member • Posts: 1,561
Why a swivel LCD?

Maybe I have no imagination but if there is no live preview what benefit is there to a swiveling LCD. I found it useful on my G2 but can't figure out how it would be helpful without live preview even if it could be done.

OP TimK. New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display (like Olympus)

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/olympuse330/

See? Olympus can do it.

I suppose now it's just a matter of time before Canon follows suit.

Mark B.
Mark B. Forum Pro • Posts: 29,745
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display (like Olympus)

As long as they keep the optical viewfinder, and don't make it dim like the Oly supposedly is that's fine. No EVF however, please.

Mark

David Doran Regular Member • Posts: 210
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display (like Olympus)

Now that somebody has done it, the others will have to come up with something, just to keep competitive. I got some shots with my S1 that I couldn't have gotten without a swivel LCD. Not to mention It made taking pictures at a base ball game muchy easier because I could sit normally, and just move the camera around. I think canon will at least add this feature to the Rebel lineup at first. Perhaps later they will incorporate it into the other bodies. One quiet feature of a swivel LCD is the ability to rotate it towards the camera for storage, minimizes scratches/cracks.

TimK. wrote:

http://www.dpreview.com/articles/olympuse330/

See? Olympus can do it.

I suppose now it's just a matter of time before Canon follows suit.

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display (like Olympus)

I'm not convinced that the Olympus solution to this live-view, flip display is the right solution for others to follow. Need an extra sensor to do it and Oly's display just tilts up and down not around.

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mamallama

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John Valliant Lauritzen Regular Member • Posts: 349
I want a live feedback LCD

I take about 5 % of all my photos without actually looking through the viewfinder of my SLR (a Rebel XT that I will upgrade soon to something in the 20D class). I guess I would take about 25 % of all my photos using an LCD only and probably about 10% of my photos using both an LDC and the viewfinder, if my camera had live feedback. I thought to move to the new Olympus in stead of doing the upgrade but then I’ve read about the relatively small viewfinder and that is unacceptable to me.

I fail to see the difficulty in making the live preview function on an SLR camera (I’m not an engineer so that may explain why). Even if the live feedback is of low quality and only lasts for a few seconds it would still be worth having, especially with a swivel LCD but even without one (and without one it can’t really be that expensive to make, I would think). I would like to have the mirror flip up and stay there by just clicking a button and then to either have the LCD turns on automatically if the sensor can take it or to be able to choose when the LCD turns on, if the sensor only has a limited time before it heats up and has to shut off.

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Regards,
John Valliant Lauritzen

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: I want a live feedback LCD

Jogn V:

Your ideas seem like an impractical cludge, frought with many pitfalls. I think better solutions are coming soon to have a live preview on a camera that rivals the speed and AF performance and image quality of dSLRs. Many thoughts have put forth in earlier threads here.

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wmsc Regular Member • Posts: 412
Re: Canon SLR with a flip-around display

I used to think exactly the same thing, but since having a DSLR, i couldn't imagine taking a photo not using the viewfinder (except when i need the camera way over my head)...... i now find myself getting confuse taking photos on my little ixusi P&S

TimK. wrote:

I might consider getting an SLR camera if Canon made one with a
flip-around display in the back. What's the deal? Is a
flip-around display on an SLR too much to ask?

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Re: ZigView...
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CHIA Veteran Member • Posts: 3,158
typically....

...when I see someone ask for a live preview on a DSLR, they are point & shooters, who have no concept as to what a DSLR operates like, and what they may or may not want....totally driven by inexperienced newbies to the camera world.

That said, there are exceptions, and I am by no means any type of pro myself. One thing I can say, is that I cannot imagine trying to track any type of fast moving sports or action with my 70-200 + 1.4TC, or larger lens, with a live LCD that's situated inches or feet from my face....not to mention the totally akward stance....it's actually just plain funny to imagine

How about using an external flash holding the camera at waist heigt....could make for some creative shots, but hardly practical? The first and foremost benefit I found when moving into my first DLSR from my 3rd P&S, was being able to hold the camera to my face, very still, track subjects, and actually capture them when I pushed the shutter...OH WHAT A FEELING! A live preview would be a step backwards IMO.

For someone who would be content to operate an inexpensive DSLR with a cheap kit lens, the live preview may be marketable....for anyone who actually makes aliving with their camera, or takes photgraphy a little more seriuous not as likely IMO.....always exceptions, but highly unliklely.

I have seen this one debated about 500 times over the last few years on this forum.....rarely a topic seen in the 1D forum, but often on the Canon P&S forum.

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mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: typically....

CHIA wrote:

...when I see someone ask for a live preview on a DSLR, they are
point & shooters, who have no concept as to what a DSLR operates
like, and what they may or may not want....totally driven by
inexperienced newbies to the camera world.

Now that's presumptuous.

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Mark B.
Mark B. Forum Pro • Posts: 29,745
Re: typically....

mamallama wrote:

CHIA wrote:

...when I see someone ask for a live preview on a DSLR, they are
point & shooters, who have no concept as to what a DSLR operates
like, and what they may or may not want....totally driven by
inexperienced newbies to the camera world.

Now that's presumptuous.

The last line was, but for the most part the rest of it it true...the majority of requests for a live LCD on a DSLR are made by P&S users who have not ever used a DSLR - specifically because it doesn't have the live preview like their beloved P&S.

Mark

mamallama
mamallama Forum Pro • Posts: 60,058
Re: typically....

Mark B. wrote:

mamallama wrote:

CHIA wrote:

...when I see someone ask for a live preview on a DSLR, they are
point & shooters, who have no concept as to what a DSLR operates
like, and what they may or may not want....totally driven by
inexperienced newbies to the camera world.

Now that's presumptuous.

The last line was, but for the most part the rest of it it
true...the majority of requests for a live LCD on a DSLR are made
by P&S users who have not ever used a DSLR - specifically because
it doesn't have the live preview like their beloved P&S.

You soften it a bit with the word "majority", but unless you have facts to support it, it's still presumptuous.

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