100mm with Raynox DCR vs MP-E 65mm

PhasmatosOculus wrote:

Hi all,

Body I am using is an R7

Can an R7 engage flash while you're using a zero-vibration mode? I know my Nikon Z7 can't.

Currently have a Canon 100mm f/2.8 USM lens with Raynox DCR-250 for my macro.

I can handheld stack (especially as I use a flash to "freeze" the action) and get relatively close to insects and with the Raynox, I adjust focus/magnification via the ring manually.

I am considering a Canon MP-E 65mm 5x Macro lens - aware it is manual only. Also aware that I can go from 1:1 to 5:1 and move back and forwards for focusing.

Does anyone have experience with the latter, handheld?

Yes. I found it pleasant at 1x, but excruciating past 2x: near impossible at 5x.

The MPE-65 has a working distance of 42mm at 5x, which doesn't sound so bad until you realize that the front tube diameter is an ungodly 60mm. You will find setting up lighting to be frustrating because you run into the shadow of the lens anything closer than 35 degrees off center. You can't really change magnification on the fly because the front of the lens moves so much when you do that you'll be outside the lighting setup you had for a different magnification.

I will stick with my bellows and a 50mm f/2 Leitz Photar. The front end of the Photar is only 35mm in diameter, and the working distance at 5x on a bellows or tubes is 50mm. You can get your lights within 19 degrees of the lens axis.

If I set the MP-E to the same sort of mag produced by the former setup, will handheld be just as possible?

Only with flash at high mag, but then again a DCR-250 on a 100mm Canon, you're looking at a WD of about 40mm at max magnification, which should be about 2.6x.

I am just wondering if it was upgrading to the MP-E 65mm lens (and sell on the Canon 100mm as I only use it purely for macro)

There's a massive difference in the perspective you have with your entrance pupil nearly 200mm from the subject at 1:1 with the 100mm vs. about 90mm for the MPE. Seriously, for my own work I like to be out past 100mm, and typically resort to a 200mm 1:1 macro on a 2x TC. DLAATW.

as I may want the additional magnification which would be easy by a turn of the lens.

It doesn't feel that easy when you start doing it. I personally found the old setup with a Photar or Luminar on a bellows to be easier.

And if there are any clever people who can calculate working distances for both setups, I'd greatly appreciate that too.

I sort of did that on the fly, but Canon states the MPE-65 drops to 42mm at 5x, and my calculations for the Raynox are nearly identical, but that's based on a wild guess that the focal length of the Canon 100mm at max mag is 60mm.

At least the Raynox has a smaller front: down around 50mm if you dismount it from the clip-on contraption and purchase the proper step-down rings to get you from its M43 rear threads to the M67 on the 100mm. I'd go four rings: 67-62-58-52-43.