Marco Nero wrote:
Larawanista wrote:
While my wife still loves her M3, I am in general parting ways with my M6 Mark II and all lenses. My daughter who's a doctor/surgeon will now be using the M6 Mark II as she finds it useful for her work (so we're keeping the fabulous EF28mm 3.5 Marco which she needs and likes using).
My dentist uses the M6 with the 28mm Macro lens. That lens is not bright enough for me to carry and use all the time since I generally shoot in fairly low light - but the images it produces are indeed impressive. You may find you get similar results with the closeup abilities of the RF 35mm Macro lens on your new RP camera. Those two make an ideal combination, they really do.
This has nothing to do with M bodies, particularly the M6 Mark II, as they are top performing photographic tools. It has nothing to do with the possibility that Canon will no longer upgrade the M series with new body or lenses.
I think we're all cautiously optimistic that Canon will continue to support the M system in future. All camera systems come to an end and eventually even the fairly new R system will be replaced someday. Canon are currently looking into Medium Format for consumer use. And almost all future Canon products will be a gain in price due to sales being affected by smartphones each and every year.
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EOS M6 on my belt. (The R6 pulls my pants down!)
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It’s simply doing what makes more sense for me, as well as consolidating my gear towards something more certain – which is the EOS RF system. The lineup of RF lenses keeps improving, and expanding in terms of pricing options. There are affordable primes and “single-kidney” priced ones. Canon no doubt is investing its best on the RF system, which makes it the best way to go.
There's no right or wrong with your decisions. Just as there is no perfect camera or perfect lens. I recently took my EOS R6 with me on a very short walk around the corner to photograph some Springtime cherry blossoms that were blooming with the RF 85mmL lens... and my hands ached a little when walking due to the weight. I'm also careful to carry this combination in a way that doesn't have it banging up against my belt of keys when I walk... but I was relieved to return home again just to put it down. It weighs close to 3kg or more with the battery extender grip on. The EOS M would have made more sense but I really wanted the smooth defocused backgrounds. The images didn't even turn out that nice. But an iPhone would have made even more sensor since I usually listen to music when I walk.
My typical combo now will be the R + R6 or the RP + R6. I added back the RP to my system so I don’t have to miss the portability of the M6 Mark II. The RP with the RF35mm is quite portable. Very portable with the RF50mm 1.8 (which makes me lose IS, just like my erstwhile favorite combo M6II+32mm).
I feel that the RF 35mm Macro capable lens is one of the best lenses for the R-system cameras. Strangely, there are some who dislike it. But I'm of the opinion that it offers a superb ratio of price, size, weight and image quality.
Let me also share that this is a decision that dovetails nicely to both my personal and professional circumstances. On the personal front, my priority is family travel photography as we are now able to resume some degree of domestic travel and likely some foreign travel by the next quarter of next year. This means mirrorless FF assures me of “no-hassle” photography under any lighting condition (as we love visiting night markets to feast on street food). Nearly all of my paid gigs (a passive but lucrative source of income for me) is now leaning towards corporate portrait and product photography, for which the RF system again is superior.
If you are shooting paid gigs then a larger camera is what the clients expect to see. Turn up with a tiny camera or a smartphone and you'll likely draw scorn from the people paying you. Imagine turning up to a wedding with an iPhone for a paid gig?!
Do I recommend this for all M system fans? No. The 32mp inside the M6II is a very capable sensor. It is not perfect. It does need some help from DxO software past ISO800. But the level of detail it captures, with the right lens and the right settings, is worthy of praise.
A few weeks or months later, maybe I will regret having taken this path. Or maybe not. I will post here how it’s been by then since anyway, I “conjugally” still have an M3 that I could occasionally use 😊
You have to make the right decisions for yourself and those decisions can be marred by many other influences such as money, practicality and application. It doesn't make a lot of sense to have two unrelated systems if you only use one. The EOS RP is a fairly small camera. So small that it's worth buying the grip-extender plate that offers a little more ergonomics. With me, I'll use anything that gives me good results. There's time when I reach for Full Frame cameras but most of the time APS-C offers me more reach or similar shallow DOF to what I can get with a FF camera. There's a lot of different reasons to want to buy a new product. It can inspire you to do more and it can simply be a desire to upgrade tools or to enable you to better pursue your preferred hobby. Is anyone asked me why they ought to buy a Full Frame camera, I'd normally reply that you can work in lower light with it or you can generate slightly softer background defocus with it. The difference only becomes night-vs-day when using expensive wide-aperture lenses.
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The EOS Ra (The Ra shares the same body as the EOS R so they're exactly the same size) alongside my EOS M. Presumably shot with my crappy iPhone. The difference in size is amazing.
EOS RP (left) alongside the EOS R (right) for scale.
EOS RP (left) alongside the EOS R (right) for scale.
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I have two EOS R cameras: an EOS Ra for astrophotography and an EOS R6 for general use (which I bought because I felt guilty with my RF lenses barely being used for anything but astro). I have also kept some of my Full Frame DSLRs although I really haven't used one in nearly 2 years now. But the resale prices were too low and it's often good to have something on hand for emergencies I suppose. But of all the cameras I use the most, the EOS M6 is without a doubt the most frequently handled photographic instrument I tend to reach for. I even use it for Astrophotography from time to time alongside the larger R-series cameras. I've never been disappointed with the R6 and what it can do. And the R6 II would be the logical replacement if something happened to my R6.
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The myth of Full Frame cameras being "better"...
There's a myth that Full Frame is better than APS-C and this is usually perpetuated by the camera companies. Even Canon themselves use the phrase "step up to Full Frame" in their brochures and EOS R advertising. Full Frame systems have an advantage when it comes to low-light performance. APS-C systems have advantages when it comes to size, price and more magnification, especially with longer lenses and wildlife. Full Frame will not offer you the same focal lengths that you get from a longer lens on the EOS M cameras. The Canon EOS RP is a camera I bought for my wife but she rarely ever uses it since she prefers to use the camera on her 'OPPO' brand smartphone - which easily compares to a Full Frame camera when it comes to low light performance. I'm actually more than impressed with her smartphone camera in this respect. But she's just photographing everyday things and so photography is more of a hobby for her these days.
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The differences in magnification (due to the sensor crop) between APS-C and Full Frame sensors, when using the very same lens on each camera.
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Now that myth of Full Frame cameras may not apply to you. You appear to be interested in the new lenses becoming available for the EOS R system so you may enjoy using them. Generally speaking, Canon have brought out some interesting new lenses for the R-system although the better ones tend to be absurdly expensive.
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Be aware that Canon is rushing hard to get all (any?) of their lenses out. They can't supply enough to meet demand and global shipping delays are adding to the problem. We are seeing some serious quality control issues with many of the RF lenses and those issues extend even to the very expensive L-series lens models.
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I'm not likely to retire my EOS M system cameras just yet, although I did recently purchase an Apple iPhone 13 Pro Max (which is still delayed) and this is a smartphone that makes images that are virtually indistinguishable from the shots taken by the Full-Frame EOS R6 camera that I already own (when using similar focal lengths).
I have zero reason to believe that the 13 is that much better than 12 and the woefully outdated Canon Powershot SX60 kills the 12 Pro Max in the IQ department and I have pics to prove it.
I think I just put up a thread on the subject over here: www.dpreview.com/forums/post/65567084 ... I've said it before and I'll say it again.... if I had to start buying gear from scratch right now, knowing what I know... I would buy another EOS M camera (probably an M6 II) and skip all the EOS R models and lenses. They're good but it's still early days. The EF-M 11-22mm lens is amazingly wide and sharp especially on an APS-C sensor... so I'm passing on the wider RF lenses at present. Cameras like the EOS RP are intentionally crippled (to get consumers to consider a higher model) and are otherwise nearly identical to the features and settings on the EOS M cameras.
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The EOS RP is a smart looking camera. But buying into the R system, I was surprised that it does not include the shutter shield feature that protects the camera sensor - like the ones featured on other R cameras. The shutter speed limitations are probably the only other thing to be mindful of.
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Canon's EOS RP camera with base plate extender attached (and RF 35mm lens)
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Finally, a smartphone has emerged that will get me to spend less time with my EOS M6 camera and even my EOS R6 camera. There will be times when I need a longer optical zoom though and there will be times when I need a more professional looking camera for clients or to shoot in exceptionally low light. That's probably the only reason I will retain the two systems I presently have on hand. Not everyone will need or want two systems.
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If you're shooting gigs that demand that you produce a larger camera, it's probably even necessary that you consider something from the R-system stable of equipment. I think you'll enjoy it although if you already have the EF-M 32mm f/1.4 lens you may ask yourself if you made the right choice on occasion. Passing the disused camera on to somebody else makes perfect sense if you weren't considering selling it or trading it in for other gear. It's getting harder to sell cameras these days due to a glut of them on the market from people migrating to newer smartphones with better camera capabilities. I think you'll enjoy your new RP and if you find it leaves you a little underwhelmed, there's always a chance to return to the EF-M system which is still flourishing on the seller's shelves. There's very little I can't do with the EOS M system. Astro is a little better with the R and so is the general performance in low light but that's about it for me if you ignore the new IBIS and Eye-Detect AF features on the newest R cameras (R5+R6). I sure wish we had these choices 20 years ago! But good luck with your decision and personally I do like the RP camera and came VERY CLOSE to buying a second one for myself when the R6 was announced. I'm sure we'll meet again, even on another forum.
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Guess which combo I try to avoid carrying unless absolutely essential?
