A7Riii front focus with wildlife problems, need help

pappatho · Apr 18, 2021

Just moved to a Sony A7Riii and am having consistent front focus problems for wildlife pictures. The camera seems to typically focus on something in front of the intended subject. For example if I put the flexible spot S on a bird on water usually a ripple in the water in front of the bird is sharp. Bird in a tree and I'll get a nearby stick closer to the camera that is sharper. Animal in grass and I get grass closer to the camera sharper. I have tried wide, zone and flexible spot small. Nothing has worked as well as the results I use to get with a Nikon D7100 and D500.

Here are a couple of examples where the spot was on the animal. These were with a Sony 200-600 and at least on the bird a 1.4X teleconverter. These are cropped.

Any ideas what I can do differently to get the intended subject in focus? Right now I'm pretty frustrated with the money I laid out and am getting worse results.

I did buy the camera primarily for landscape, but wanted it to do this well too.

pollup · Apr 18, 2021

Can you try without the TC?

The A7Riii might not be able to use PDAF at f/9, I think it might be limited to f/8.

pappatho · Apr 18, 2021

pollup said:
Can you try without the TC?

The A7Riii might not be able to use PDAF at f/9, I think it might be limited to f/8.

Here is an F6.3 from before I bought the TC. Same issue where it seems to be focusing on the water ripples in front of what I was putting the spot on.

Uncropped versions of the above Hummingbird and duck.

daran · Apr 18, 2021

pappatho said:
Just moved to a Sony A7Riii and am having consistent front focus problems for wildlife pictures. The camera seems to typically focus on something in front of the intended subject. For example if I put the flexible spot S on a bird on water usually a ripple in the water in front of the bird is sharp. Bird in a tree and I'll get a nearby stick closer to the camera that is sharper. Animal in grass and I get grass closer to the camera sharper. I have tried wide, zone and flexible spot small. Nothing has worked as well as the results I use to get with a Nikon D7100 and D500.

Here are a couple of examples where the spot was on the animal. These were with a Sony 200-600 and at least on the bird a 1.4X teleconverter. These are cropped.

Not sure what's going wrong there, but it maybe something simple: the focus points may be more generous than what you are used to. As in where a DSLR focus point would probably try to focus on something in the center of the focus point, the small focus point may also grab focus on something on it's edge. I'd experiment with this on a static subject.

Scott Alan · Apr 19, 2021

The A7RMK3 with 200-600mm with 1.4TC is limited to F9. That means the focus system goes from phase detection PDAF which is limited to F8 to contrast detection CDAF. It requires a slightly larger focus area with some contrast in order to focus. It will drive the lens into focus and slightly beyond and back into focus so you will get a slower focusing system that requires area of higher contrast to achieve sharp focus. If you are using small spot try a larger spot. Also I have good results with using AF-S and focus magnifier on stationary subjects.

Hope this helps.

Scott

pappatho · Apr 19, 2021

I don't think it is a pd vs cd issue since it happens at f6.3.

I can try a larger spot next time I'm out, but that seems like it would give the camera more leeway to focus on something even further from the intended subject.

It seems like the small spot focus area is using a spot larger than it graphically depicts and then heavily prioritizing whatever is closest to the camera.

If anything I would expect an improvement from my DLSRs here since there are more focus points.

GF · Apr 19, 2021

To isolate the problem, I will do the following:

- Try other lenses with your A7R3

- Try the 200-600mm on other body.

Stan in NH · Apr 19, 2021

The camera will typically choose a focus point that is closest. I think that is all that is happening here. I usually will use either AF-S or AF-C with a center spot selected as the focus area with a relatively fixed subject.

You can do some simple tests by using a flat subject, with nothing in front or behind it, to check out the AF.

FrenchKiss78 · Apr 19, 2021

pappatho said:
Just moved to a Sony A7Riii and am having consistent front focus problems for wildlife pictures. The camera seems to typically focus on something in front of the intended subject. For example if I put the flexible spot S on a bird on water usually a ripple in the water in front of the bird is sharp. Bird in a tree and I'll get a nearby stick closer to the camera that is sharper. Animal in grass and I get grass closer to the camera sharper. I have tried wide, zone and flexible spot small. Nothing has worked as well as the results I use to get with a Nikon D7100 and D500.

Here are a couple of examples where the spot was on the animal. These were with a Sony 200-600 and at least on the bird a 1.4X teleconverter. These are cropped.

Any ideas what I can do differently to get the intended subject in focus? Right now I'm pretty frustrated with the money I laid out and am getting worse results.

I did buy the camera primarily for landscape, but wanted it to do this well too.

I got the same issue. If you have an uv filter. Take it out.

FrenchKiss78 · Apr 19, 2021

Scott Alan said:
The A7RMK3 with 200-600mm with 1.4TC is limited to F9. That means the focus system goes from phase detection PDAF which is limited to F8 to contrast detection CDAF. It requires a slightly larger focus area with some contrast in order to focus. It will drive the lens into focus and slightly beyond and back into focus so you will get a slower focusing system that requires area of higher contrast to achieve sharp focus. If you are using small spot try a larger spot. Also I have good results with using AF-S and focus magnifier on stationary subjects.

Hope this helps.

Scott

For static, I get tack sharp pics with CDAF.

pappatho · Apr 19, 2021

FrenchKiss78 said:
FrenchKiss78 wrote

I got the same issue. If you have an uv filter. Take it out.

I don't have any filters, so that definitely isn't the problem.

pollup · Apr 19, 2021

GF said:
To isolate the problem, I will do the following:

- Try other lenses with your A7R3

- Try the 200-600mm on other body.

I was going to suggest the same.

James C. Murray · Apr 19, 2021

Not sure if your settings are running into this limitation but if if you have a TC involved it may be a factor.

Footnote [1]: on [Hi+], if F-value is greater than F8 the focus is locked to the setting in the first shot.

duncang · Apr 20, 2021

I have the same problem with the a7riii and don't have this problem with the a9 for the same subjects/lighting conditions.

It seems the a7riii is not very good at detecting the subject and therefor tends to focus on the closest thing - a leaf or branch etc.

It also seems the focus point is not in fact a point but is a rather largish square area and there seems to be no way to focus on a small point without the surrounding things interfering.

The a9 and a1 seem to be far smarter at detecting subjects in the background but neither seem to be as accurate at point focussing as my D850 which could peek through quite small gaps in dense foliage. So far I have had no luck doing the same - it may be there is a point focus method on the Sony cameras that will do this but I haven't found it. Having said that I haven't looked too hard.

Here is an example of where the a9 managed to somehow find the subject - no idea how though because this was a tall order.

I doubt the a7riii would have been able to figure anything out here

pappatho · Apr 20, 2021

duncang said:
I have the same problem with the a7riii and don't have this problem with the a9 for the same subjects/lighting conditions.

It seems the a7riii is not very good at detecting the subject and therefor tends to focus on the closest thing - a leaf or branch etc.

It also seems the focus point is not in fact a point but is a rather largish square area and there seems to be no way to focus on a small point without the surrounding things interfering.

Thanks for the response this matches what I'm seeing. If I can get close enough that the focus point is completely covered by the object and there is nothing else closer to camera nearby it will do OK. Otherwise it will front focus on an unintended object.

duncang · Apr 23, 2021

pappatho said:
duncang said:

I have the same problem with the a7riii and don't have this problem with the a9 for the same subjects/lighting conditions.

It seems the a7riii is not very good at detecting the subject and therefor tends to focus on the closest thing - a leaf or branch etc.

It also seems the focus point is not in fact a point but is a rather largish square area and there seems to be no way to focus on a small point without the surrounding things interfering.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the response this matches what I'm seeing. If I can get close enough that the focus point is completely covered by the object and there is nothing else closer to camera nearby it will do OK. Otherwise it will front focus on an unintended object.

It was a surprise to me coming from the D850 where the single point focus was quite small.

duncang · Apr 23, 2021

pappatho said:
duncang said:

I have the same problem with the a7riii and don't have this problem with the a9 for the same subjects/lighting conditions.

It seems the a7riii is not very good at detecting the subject and therefor tends to focus on the closest thing - a leaf or branch etc.

It also seems the focus point is not in fact a point but is a rather largish square area and there seems to be no way to focus on a small point without the surrounding things interfering.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the response this matches what I'm seeing. If I can get close enough that the focus point is completely covered by the object and there is nothing else closer to camera nearby it will do OK. Otherwise it will front focus on an unintended object.

BTW have you tried AF-S and the magnify option ? I think that might give you much more precise focus for those through the bush scenarios.

pappatho · May 10, 2021

duncang said:
BTW have you tried AF-S and the magnify option ? I think that might give you much more precise focus for those through the bush scenarios.

The only magnify option I'm aware of is with manual focus or DMF. That is what I have had the best luck with to get sharp photos. Is there another magnifying option?

Sony technical support said to send the camera in. So I did and am waiting to get it back. I'm not holding my breath since it seems more like a firmware issue than hardware.

In the meantime I'm dreaming of an A9, or maybe the rumored 6xxx camera for these type of pictures.

duncang · May 12, 2021

pappatho said:
duncang said:

BTW have you tried AF-S and the magnify option ? I think that might give you much more precise focus for those through the bush scenarios.

Click to expand...

The only magnify option I'm aware of is with manual focus or DMF. That is what I have had the best luck with to get sharp photos. Is there another magnifying option?

Sony technical support said to send the camera in. So I did and am waiting to get it back. I'm not holding my breath since it seems more like a firmware issue than hardware.

In the meantime I'm dreaming of an A9, or maybe the rumored 6xxx camera for these type of pictures.

Its called Focus Peaking - set it up and use it when manual focussing.

Scott Alan · May 12, 2021

pappatho said:
duncang said:

BTW have you tried AF-S and the magnify option ? I think that might give you much more precise focus for those through the bush scenarios.

Click to expand...

The only magnify option I'm aware of is with manual focus or DMF. That is what I have had the best luck with to get sharp photos. Is there another magnifying option?

Sony technical support said to send the camera in. So I did and am waiting to get it back. I'm not holding my breath since it seems more like a firmware issue than hardware.

In the meantime I'm dreaming of an A9, or maybe the rumored 6xxx camera for these type of pictures.

The easiest thing to do to implement focus magnifier is assign it to a custom key. Mine is set to the focus hold button on lens barrel.

A7Riii front focus with wildlife problems, need help

Member

Senior Member

Member

Senior Member

Leading Member

Member

Forum Enthusiast

Senior Member

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Enthusiast

Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Member

Senior Member

Senior Member

Member

Senior Member

Leading Member

Similar threads

Keyboard shortcuts