if you are new to m4/3s read this

Started 2 months ago | Discussions thread
SteveY80 Senior Member • Posts: 1,402
Re: if you are new to m4/3s read this

joeletx wrote:

SteveY80 wrote:

joeletx wrote:

SteveY80 wrote:

I discovered this feature from recommendations in various wildlife/action photography articles and videos, as well as couple of photography workshops I attended. Olympus may not push it, but in my experience plenty of professional photographers see its worth. Once I realised how useful it was for my photography there was no going back.

Again, this is simply your opinion of one way to go about your photography! Why can't you accept the fact that someone may not agree with your approach Steve? You may be among a few that realizes of the new found approach. But that doesn't necessarily the one and only way. Again this is just your opinion period.

In no way, shape, or form have I argued that anyone else has to agree with my approach, let alone that it's the one and only way.

You are the one who started this discussion by calling requests for this feature a "pet peeve" and arguing against other people's preferences. You didn't simply state that this is something you don't personally like, instead you claimed that auto ISO and EC in M was an "oxymoron" and portrayed it as a pointless and ridiculous thing for anyone to want in their camera.

Let me quote, "To me! this must be the most oxymoron thing to do."; what part of the phrase "To me!" don't you comprehend? It was simply my opinion and that what how I feel about a "Manual" setting feature that has nothing to do with "Manual" at all.

Another quote, "An oxymoron is a term for a figure of speech. It is made up of two or more words that seem to be opposite to each other, or actually are opposite."

I borrowed the above phrase to describe the paradox aspect of setting my camera to Manual and relying on "Auto" ISO and EC to cope with exposure changes. I am saying it should not be called "Manual Mode". That is all! that what I meant by oxymoron.

That's fair enough, although that kind of argument over semantics seems rather silly to me.

I'd still consider it a "manual mode" because unlike P A & S modes it provides the photographer with full creative control, but I can see why having automatic metering in manual would bother some people. Pentax perhaps wisely have a separate TAv mode that does the same thing, rather than calling it auto ISO in M.

That said, my main issue was with your claim that auto ISO + EC in manual doesn't offer anything over P A S modes or using manual ISO in M. When you state that you don't like using it that's your valid personal opinion, but it's factually inaccurate to say that the other modes can do exactly the same thing. It looks like it was a waste of time, but you were provided with various examples to illustrate why that isn't the case.

Your gear list shown that you own a Panasonic GX-7 and a GM-1. Have you ever checked and see if the either Pana's have your desired Manual Auto ISO EC feature?

That's a reminder that my gear list is badly out of date. The lack of auto-ISO in M on the GX7 was the one thing I really hated about that camera. I was one of the people complaining on forums, signing petitions, and sending letters to Panasonic to request it. I skipped upgrading to either the GX8 or GX85 because they still lacked the ability to use EC in that mode.

I'm very glad that Panasonic finally listened to the complaints and added this feature, even if they did so later than most of their competitors. For me it was the single best thing about upgrading to the GX9.

You directly asked why someone would use this feature, but you don't seem willing to accept the explanations and examples you received in response. It's clear that you still don't get it, e.g. claiming in your last comment that it's unnecessary because people are already accommodated by P A S auto modes.

That's not to say that I think it's useful for everyone. There are certainly plenty of popular features that I don't personally bother with.

Now ask yourself, why is that?

Because people are different and have different preferences and ways of working with their camera.

Ok, you are on the right path here.

I think that's something worth considering if you find yourself confused or annoyed by people wanting features that you don't find useful.

Here, you contradicted yourself again.

No, there's no contradiction. It's something you seem to be struggling with, but it's possible to understand why other people would want a feature without liking it yourself.

I don't shoot video at all, but I can see why various video specific feature are needed by people who do. I don't deny the fact that those features are valuable to other people, or express confusion about them being requested just because I'll never use them.

What I wouldn't do is dismiss those features as completely unnecessary just because I don't appreciate them, not when other people clearly do find them of value.

Same as above Steve. You just have to accept the fact that I don't like this approach and there is nothing you can do to convince me.

I'm not trying to convince you to like this approach. All I've been trying to explain is that it offers genuine advantages that other people do find useful.

Can you accept the fact that other people do like it, and that in some circumstances, for some people, it's an approach that offers real advantages over either P A & S auto modes, or manual ISO in M?

Again,words like "genuine advantages" and "real advantages" are simply just your own opinion! really! There are literally thousand different ways photographers like you and I go about their photography.

Whether an individual likes using it is a matter of personal opinion and preference, but it's a fact that for some people it does offer an advantage in some situations. You've been provided with examples demonstrating why that's the case.

It's also a fact that the option of auto ISO in M offers functionality that isn't fully replicable in any other mode. For example, it's a statement of fact, not opinion, that manual mode provides direct control over both aperture and shutter speed, while P A S modes do not. It's also a fact, not an opinion, that adding auto ISO provides automatic adjustment of brightness as lighting/settings change. Whether that unique combination of control and automation is desired by a particular photographer is where opinion comes in.

What I don't get is why you feel the need to argue that other people's opinions and preferences are somehow incorrect, as if you know better than they do about how they should go about their photography?

 SteveY80's gear list:SteveY80's gear list
Nikon 1 J1 Fujifilm X-M1 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX7 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GM1 Sony a77 II +1 more
Post (hide subjects) Posted by
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum PPrevious NNext WNext unread UUpvote SSubscribe RReply QQuote BBookmark MMy threads
Color scheme? Blue / Yellow