What the V4 could have been...

Just got a Z50 today on the Yellow program to give it a shot. I knew the body was small, but did not expect it to be the same size (bit smaller) than my V3's ?!?

Wanted to post these since I could find a comparison with the EVF and grip.







Yes, I do understand the lens size difference.



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- JJ

Should have used 16-50mm kit zoom in the last photo! Agree Z50 is what V4 would have been. But the bigger sensor has more advantages since N1 were not that small. Same goes to micro 4/3, imo. APS-C is a better system if you can find some compact lenses. There are a lot of lenses you can adapt on Z. An adapter like Fringer transforms the Z cameras into a full featured Canon! Probably better than a lot of Canon bodies..

Let me run with this idea a bit. Suppose Nikon took the Z50, swapped out the DX sensor for the sensor from the J5 and swapped out the Z-mount for the Series 1 mount. Leave everything else as is except for any firmware changes needed to drive CX lenses instead of Z-mount lenses. And yes, that includes the hot shoe. With me so far?

The cost to manufacturing this hypothetical V4 should be close to that of the Z50. So let's say that Nikon sells it with a 10-30mm lens for the same $1000 price tag. (~$200 less than the V3). I suspect many people in this group, possibly including myself, would be lining up to buy one. But of those people not already emotionally or financially "invested" in the 1 series, how many would choose such a "V4" over a Z50?

I suspect the answer is "not a lot," and I also suspect that would be the case even if the lens reliability issue somehow magically went away. A large part of the reason Nikon chose the 1" format in the first place was so it wouldn't "cannibalize" sales of DX cameras. That much would still be true today. Nor would people be likely to choose this "V4" over a Z50 as a fast and light backup camera. So that potentially leaves a niche as a "reach" camera for wildlife and sports, but the J5 sensor would have a very tough time meeting the low-light demands of that niche.

So while it's fun to dream about a V4, "dream logic" often seems absurd after the alarm clock goes off. Such is the case here.

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Light travels at 2.13085531 × 10^14 smoots per fortnight. Catch some today!

I have been shooting N1 since the great V1 fire sale. The V1 is still in use with our Scout Troop when I teach the Photography merit badge.

I was hoping this Z50 could replace my V3 travel gear. Two V3 bodies with 6.7-13 and non-pd 10-100 & fire sale 32mm.

Since my travel shots are 85+% in good light, the N1 gear keeps up well against the Z50. I am just snap shooting for memories and the biggest display size of my audience is an iPad.

I knew the Z50 was entry level, but the build quality of the two lenses is worse that the AF-P trio of entry DX lenses. Zoom is not smooth at all, especially the 50-250. Maybe I am just spoiled from the N1 build quality. There is a bigger size difference than I expected. It is so nice to have the V3 w/ 10-100, I can hang it off my shoulder all day and forget it is there.

I will just save the $$ replace any of my N1 lenses if they fail.

Thanks to Nikon for the Yellow program, this was a really nice way to save a few $$ on rental fees to test.

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- JJ

I do have a bit of an emotional attachment to N1 gear. I have been shooting since the 70's and N1 gear is my favorite of all time. The V3's are so fast in operation they just stay out of my way.

Maybe I should have chosen a different title for the thread.

I really just posted the pics to help the gang here see the size differences. There are no good comparisons I could find that had the V3 w/ EVF & grip.

Built two of these V3 bodies out of parts, both around $600.


I am a bit invested in N1



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- JJ

I generally agree with this thread's premise. I am looking at the Z50 as the probable upgrade to my V1 and V2 bodies. I might replace or repair current N1 gear when needed. But I don't think I will add to the system at this point. Three bodies and five lenses make up a fairly-complete system. Getting repairs done and finding accessories for these bodies and lenses is only going to get more challenging over time.

The Z50 and its lenses come as close to a Nikon 1 system replacement as anything that Nikon (or any other company) has made. Since I use my Nikon 1 gear as much for video as for still photography, the improvement in video specs the Z50 offers definitely interests me. But it is a shame that it does not have IBIS.

It is unfortunate that you don't feel like keeping the Z50, but I do understand your desire to continue to use your Nikon 1 gear. When finances allow it I intend to get a Z50, 16-50mm DX Z-mount lens, and FTZ adapter to mount my F-mount lenses on the Z50. I think that I will use it alongside my Nikon 1 gear, which I hope to use for several more years.

I intend to buy a refurb Z50/FTZ next year and use my 18-55/70-300 AF-P or get the 16-50 because it seems to be an excellent lens. I'm in no hurry as long as my N1 gear holds up!

cyuill2007 said:

I generally agree with this thread's premise. I am looking at the Z50 as the probable upgrade to my V1 and V2 bodies. I might replace or repair current N1 gear when needed. But I don't think I will add to the system at this point. Three bodies and five lenses make up a fairly-complete system. Getting repairs done and finding accessories for these bodies and lenses is only going to get more challenging over time.

The Z50 and its lenses come as close to a Nikon 1 system replacement as anything that Nikon (or any other company) has made. Since I use my Nikon 1 gear as much for video as for still photography, the improvement in video specs the Z50 offers definitely interests me. But it is a shame that it does not have IBIS.

It is unfortunate that you don't feel like keeping the Z50, but I do understand your desire to continue to use your Nikon 1 gear. When finances allow it I intend to get a Z50, 16-50mm DX Z-mount lens, and FTZ adapter to mount my F-mount lenses on the Z50. I think that I will use it alongside my Nikon 1 gear, which I hope to use for several more years.

Click to expand...

Part of me sending back the Z50 is I do also have a Z6 24-70/F4. There was not enough size difference to justify the Z50. Weight for sure, that Z50 kit is really light.

I did try the 16-50 on the Z6. It worked, but the EVF looks completely different. The Z6 just shows the DX area fully in the EVF (magnified) Not like the DSLR view with the smaller box in the VF. It makes the focus boxes 4X in size & was limiting.

On a side note, the FTZ works awesome with AF-S lenses. Don't listen to the click bait on the interweb. There is a 4-wheeler test sequence with my 70-200II on the FTZ in my gallery here. He is riding at me fast.

JJoyce4699 said:

Part of me sending back the Z50 is I do also have a Z6 24-70/F4. There was not enough size difference to justify the Z50. Weight for sure, that Z50 kit is really light.

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Unless you need the lightest possible ILC or are concerned about travelling about with an expensive camera, having a Z 6 is a very good reason to not get a Z 50. It offers many of the best features of both the Z 50 and the Z 7 in one body.

Member said:

On a side note, the FTZ works awesome with AF-S lenses. Don't listen to the click bait on the interweb. There is a 4-wheeler test sequence with my 70-200II on the FTZ in my gallery here. He is riding at me fast.

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- JJ

Click to expand...

The FT1 for Nikon 1 cameras was IMO a very good adapter, even though only the center AF sensor of a Nikon 1 body could be used. The FTZ adapter does not have this limitation. And actual users of the FTZ attest to how good it is. (One reason why I ignore the clickbaiters.) I intend to buy an FTZ adapter to use my F-mount lenses on any Z bodies that I get.

If anyone wants to try a Z50, the Yellow Program was painless to send the camera back. One quick phone call and I had a UPS label.

Sad part was Nikon asked no questions on why I was returning. What a lost opportunity for customer feedback!

I work in a big corporation and deal with customer feedback with the marketing people at times. I can share that it is really difficult to separate good feedback from poor feedback. Especially if not collected in a well monitored and controlled way. The assumption is with returns that many are for financial reasons but people never say that, so they make up stuff.

OpticsEngineer said:

I work in a big corporation and deal with customer feedback with the marketing people at times. I can share that it is really difficult to separate good feedback from poor feedback. Especially if not collected in a well monitored and controlled way. The assumption is with returns that many are for financial reasons but people never say that, so they make up stuff.

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That makes sense to me. This is not my area, so the feedback is helpful. I do escalation management, my customers are generally clear & direct on their issues.

JJoyce4699 said:

I will just save the $$ replace any of my N1 lenses if they fail.

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Be warned, they will fail.

10-100 VR and 32 1.2 are among the riskiest.

Try invest on FT1 + used Nikon DSLR lens instead.

Do i love Nikon 1?

Absolutely yes, but if Nikon make no commitment to replace failed aperture / shutter, i will stay away from N1 or just use the old kit lens.

Impressive.....I remembered back in 2018, I was kinda obsessed with N1 gears and went on buying 5 lenses to pair with my Nikon J5. However, faith was lost due to failing 30-110mm and 10-30mm VR (repaired for free), both died out of sticky aperture. Knowing others can't circumvent their ultimate fate, I ditched Nikon 1.

I sold all of my former V1/V2/J5 items when I got my Z6. I'm in love with the Z6 and 24-70mm F4 S. It's an amazing combination. I actually just bought the DX Z 50-250 for my Z6. Love it! Super light/small for that amount of reach. No complaints. I don't need reach that often, but it's in my bag if/when I do. And the Z 85mm F1.8 S is my favorite lens of all time.

sillycornlotty said:

JJoyce4699 said:

I will just save the $$ replace any of my N1 lenses if they fail.

Click to expand...

Be warned, they will fail.

10-100 VR and 32 1.2 are among the riskiest.

Try invest on FT1 + used Nikon DSLR lens instead.

Do i love Nikon 1?

Absolutely yes, but if Nikon make no commitment to replace failed aperture / shutter, i will stay away from N1 or just use the old kit lens.

Click to expand...

I am lucky on that front, my old neighbor owns TC Camera Repair. He fixed a lens for another person on this forum last year. The issue was a small gear that gets out of whack, an easy fix.

shadowlands said:

I sold all of my former V1/V2/J5 items when I got my Z6. I'm in love with the Z6 and 24-70mm F4 S. It's an amazing combination. I actually just bought the DX Z 50-250 for my Z6. Love it! Super light/small for that amount of reach. No complaints. I don't need reach that often, but it's in my bag if/when I do. And the Z 85mm F1.8 S is my favorite lens of all time.

Click to expand...

I do a lot with the Scouts and there is no other way to carry 18-810mm in such a small pack. Since the pics are displayed on FB @ 2048 size, the N1 IQ is just fine. During campfires it is cool to have the 6.7-13 & shotgun mic on a tripod taking video and shooting pics with a 2nd body.

Agree with the Z6 24/70, it is really nice & like mine. I just ordered a 85mm for my Z6 today. Cannot wait to play with it tomorrow!

I tried the 50-250 on my Z6 when I had the kit, it was weird how the DX view was magnified. The focus boxes became huge. Likely would have got more comfortable given more time.

JJoyce4699 said:

shadowlands said:

I sold all of my former V1/V2/J5 items when I got my Z6. I'm in love with the Z6 and 24-70mm F4 S. It's an amazing combination. I actually just bought the DX Z 50-250 for my Z6. Love it! Super light/small for that amount of reach. No complaints. I don't need reach that often, but it's in my bag if/when I do. And the Z 85mm F1.8 S is my favorite lens of all time.

Click to expand...

I do a lot with the Scouts and there is no other way to carry 18-810mm in such a small pack. Since the pics are displayed on FB @ 2048 size, the N1 IQ is just fine. During campfires it is cool to have the 6.7-13 & shotgun mic on a tripod taking video and shooting pics with a 2nd body.

Agree with the Z6 24/70, it is really nice & like mine. I just ordered a 85mm for my Z6 today. Cannot wait to play with it tomorrow!

I tried the 50-250 on my Z6 when I had the kit, it was weird how the DX view was magnified. The focus boxes became huge. Likely would have got more comfortable given more time.

Click to expand...

The Z 85mm F1.8 S is simply amazing!!!

shadowlands said:

JJoyce4699 said:

shadowlands said:

I sold all of my former V1/V2/J5 items when I got my Z6. I'm in love with the Z6 and 24-70mm F4 S. It's an amazing combination. I actually just bought the DX Z 50-250 for my Z6. Love it! Super light/small for that amount of reach. No complaints. I don't need reach that often, but it's in my bag if/when I do. And the Z 85mm F1.8 S is my favorite lens of all time.

Click to expand...

I do a lot with the Scouts and there is no other way to carry 18-810mm in such a small pack. Since the pics are displayed on FB @ 2048 size, the N1 IQ is just fine. During campfires it is cool to have the 6.7-13 & shotgun mic on a tripod taking video and shooting pics with a 2nd body.

Agree with the Z6 24/70, it is really nice & like mine. I just ordered a 85mm for my Z6 today. Cannot wait to play with it tomorrow!

I tried the 50-250 on my Z6 when I had the kit, it was weird how the DX view was magnified. The focus boxes became huge. Likely would have got more comfortable given more time.

Click to expand...

The Z 85mm F1.8 S is simply amazing!!!

Click to expand...

It was 21deg yesterday when the lens was delivered. I am letting if acclimate for 24hrs before I use it.

Killing me staring at the box on my desk, 3 hours 18mins to go!

Thanks for the review of the Z50 JJoyce4699. There is stiff competition out there chasing the shrinking amateur camera market. I wish Nikon the best of luck.