Lack of up to date pancakes in M43?

cba_melbourne wrote:

Osa25 wrote:

cba_melbourne wrote:

Osa25 wrote:

HRC2016 wrote:

The pancakes exist to display and take advantage of the m43 small size.

If you can't get good images with a lenses you have it's not a problem with the lens.

It’s for pocketabity. But the positioning of M43 has changed and pocketability no longer the difference in a phone-centric world.

You surely mean pocketability of the lenses, not the whole camera unit as such?

Because there are precious very few m43 camera combinations that fit in a pant or shirt pocket. The GM1 with the 14mm lens attached does fit a shirt pocket. Only a very few more combinations GM1 and GM5 will fit pant pockets. Cargo pants and jackets have a little more room, and may include just a very few more, but only just.

The 14mm is the smallest "real" lens we have. It was released in 2010. The GM1 is the smallest camera we have, it came out in 2012, the GM5 in 2013. And with them some pancake lenses that were designed on purpose for these cameras. And then ---- nothing! When it comes to small cameras and lenses, there was nothing but stagnation in the m43 world for the past 7 years. That's a long time. Too long.

So they are making bigger m43 bodies and the selling point is image quality vs phone not the size.

I disagree. The selling point is not IQ vs phones, it is now only IQ vs apsc and FF MLC.

If anything in the m43 world can even remotely compete with phones, it's the GM1 with just a handful select lenses. And without a GM1/5 successor in 7 years, that fight is now all but lost.

Quite a tortureous process of avoiding the idea that a cost pocket is likely destination. I mean I don’t even know anyone who puts their phone in shirt pocket, so what’s your point about an m43 in shirt pocket? Really.

It’s irrelevant whether you “disagree” with the clear fact of M43 now moved on to bigger bodies. The GM sett Rey IRS is gone and the others they are no longer bothering with any progress on miniaturisation rather going bigger bodies. That’s just the fact.

If minaturizationnof bodies is no longer the focus then no sugar the “pancake” lens too is less of value. With the push to sell wide aperture “pro” lenses on M43, they aim to maximise the image quality deliverable on the platform, and differentiation on that parameter - no longer size as the primary selling point.

The platform cannot compete against larger formats on IQ alone. Without a size advantage, m43 would be doomed. More users are now leaving m43, than new users are moving to m43. It's market share is shrinking, not growing. What keeps m43 viable is it's inherent size advantage, and only that.

There are less fish in the water today. All are fighting over what little is left. Larger format cameras have become smaller, rivaling the larger m43 cameras. Where m43 has a real genuine fighting chance is at the smaller end - luring phone customers into small ILC cameras with small pancake lenses.

What Olympus is doing now with large cameras and pro lenses, is mainly aimed at stopping existing customers deserting m43 for larger formats. Not so much at attracting new users to m43. You cannot grow or gain market share with this strategy.

If a customer, pro or enthousiast, can choose between bodies that are the same size and the same price, but one has an FF sensor and one M43, my guess is most will get the FF one. Olympus is trying to serve a very small niche of wildlife, outdoors and sports photographers with big weathersealed bodies and lenses. Lens size, especially in the tele realm, is the only advantage I see left in this scenario.

Although analyzing and improving big corporations is my job, I know too little about Olympus' figures, to grasp why they doing, what they are doing.

My guess is that developing an advanced amateur body costs about as much as developing a pro style body, while the profit per unit is more on the pro body IF enough units are being sold. So it appears they settle for a niche hoping they will make their numbers there. Are they giving away the enthusiasts market, or was there no profit to give away in that segment anyway? People who know more in depth about Olympus, be so kind to share with me what you know.

Me I am not a pro wildlife photographer, I just want small, responsive, and ergonomic bodies with smallish high quality lenses at a decent price. Apparently I am not the Interesting market segment and if they continue to focus on the big pro stuff niche, I will gradually lose interest. On the positive side there are still the E-M10m3 and plenty of lenses to play with, so I should stop whining and enjoy Olympus, they make great stuff.