90D. Well that’s disappointing for us 7D2 users

Started 2 months ago | Discussions thread
1Dx4me Senior Member • Posts: 7,249
Re: Choosing APS-C over FF

Distinctly Average wrote:

John Sheehy wrote:

Messier Object wrote:

BirdShooter7 wrote:

I see a lot of 7d mk2’s but also a lot of D500’s and d850’s and an occasional 5d mk4

Are you using FF for wildlife as well as APS-C ?

I suppose that many FF users look at APS-C users in the field and assume that we can’t afford to upgrade to Full Frame, and that it’s not a deliberate choice we make.

There is a lot of elitism in the field; more in the past than recently, I think. There are a lot of personality types that just go for the "bigger and more expensive is just better always" that seems to be linked to ego with people who don't understand the real technical issues of digital imaging, despite often being very good at getting out there and getting the shots, just from putting their time in. When I first started bird photography, there were a few people with the big tripods, the biggest lenses, and the 1D bodies who seemed like gods of bird photography, and after I started to understand things for myself, I realized that they didn't understand the issue of scale at all, and were fixated on how 100% pixel views looked on their monitors. One told me that his 4MP 1D was much more crop-able than the 1D3 he was currently using. Another told me how much more crop-able his 3.43MP Sigma SD9 was than his 1D3. These two guys just got completely deflated in my esteem of their knowledge when they told me these things. They had no understanding of scale.

Shortly after the specs for the 7D2 were out and some leaked RAWs to measure noise, I mentioned to one fellow who used a 5D3 that the 7D2 had lower high-ISO noise in focal length-limited situations than any other Canons except the 1Dx, and he protested that this wasn't true, and said that the 5D3 had less noise. When I suggested that he was talking about pixel-level views, and that they are irrelevant in focal-length-limited photography, he said that no, the pixel noise is *THE* noise of the camera, because it happens at the source. This from a college professor!

My worry is that Canon is thinking the same way and is wrongly believing that we APS-C users are longing to make the upgrade to FF, and that we use the 7D2 but wish we had a 1DXII

I can buy a case of 1DxII bodies without a loan or on credit. Still I don't have one, even though I would prefer one, perhaps, when I shoot larger stuff, but the smaller stuff is where quality of resolution matters most.

There lies an illusion: when a person has both a 1DxII and a 7D2, they may find that their best shots on the 1DxII are better than the best shots on the 7D2 at the same ISO. There is no surprise there, but it was the situation and optics, not the sensor, that let them fill the larger frame well and give lower noise, more analog sharpness from the lens, and greater background separation. This has zero generic value, however, when focal-length-limited with an f/8 lens + TC with a subject that the 7D2 can focus on at f/8.

Elitism? I always find that a very odd thing. From the eyes of the beholder it suggest a certain level of insecurity, or a willingness to be a victim of either marketing or the bullies with the overpriced kit.

I know a young autistic lad, 15. He had a very beaten up 7D the he bought for £80 on fleabay after saving his pocket money for a long time. That is coupled with an old 400mm 5.6 also purchased from the bay of fleas by his parents as a birthday present. I first met him when surrounded by a group of photo snobs photographing a local rarity. Some of those togs were moaning that a child was there, unhappy he was closer than them. Numerous comments were made and to say it got my heckles up would be an understatement. But the young lad let it go straight over his head and concentrated on the task in hand. The bird was totally at ease with the young lad as he knew exactly how to observe and read the subject. Said young lad won two National photographic competitions with shots from that day. I would love to rub that in the faces of the snobs with their £15000 of kit each, but boring photos from what I could see. To me it on not about the kit, the technical abilities of the sensor or any other such garbage. It is about making the most of what you own, learning what it can and cannot do.

you are right on the mark, i have been saying this like forever! it is not the gear but rather the vision and grasp of how to frame and compose and how the end result would look like!


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You miss 100 percent of the shots you didn't take!!! "Wayne Gretzky"

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