Will S3 go 4/3rd's

sej1001 · Sep 10, 2003

I have mixed feelings about this. But, I keep hearing a lot of speculation about the possibilities. It will be interesting to see. This could generate more 4/3rd's lenses.

I sure would like to know what their thinking. I really like the s2, but want to know Fuji's furture before investing in lenses. If, they switch to 4/3rds now it will be....well...interesting!

I imaging some fuji followers with lenses will be....ahhh....not happy!

Steve J.

R. C. Johnson · Sep 10, 2003

corporation, to make money, period. If they produce a follow up to the S2 they will want to sell it to as many people as they can including current owners of the S1 & S2. There would be little profit to be had in alienating their current users. With the new price point set by the Canon rebel, my guess is any Four Thirds production by Fuji will be aimed at consumer level cameras, and not toward the pro level. If the full frame CCD is cost prohibitive at this time, I think the Nikon DX lens designs may fair well for the time being. To me, the Olympus E1 offers no compelling reason to buy at its stated price. My $100.00 is on a F mount S3.
--
R. C. Johnson

Charles Bandes · Sep 10, 2003

I think Fuji is smart enough to realise that they have a large and loyal customer base with Nikon-mount lenses.

That said, I wouldn't be too surprised to see two pro-level bodies from Fuji in the next generation - a Nikon mount and a 4/3 mount.

Fuji already supports multiple mount systems - they have their own lens system for Hasselblad Xpan, Hasselblad H1, Fuji GX680... (Was that last one recently discontinued?) If their film lines were discontinued recently with the exception of the Hasselblad bodies, perhaps they plan on focusing that effort on digital bodies. If so, it would make a lot of sense to see them with a deep product line, perhaps a 4/3, a "DX" and a 35mm size or MF-size digital. (What I wouldn't give for a digital version of their GX645 rangefinder (swoon))

Fuji makes great lenses - it would be great to have a fantastic Fuji body paired with fantastic lenses. But I sure as heck don't want to lose my Nikon glass in the process, and I think Fuji knows that. (But we'll see.)

Uh, needless to say, I have no idea what they are actually going to do

Just speculating, 'cause it's fun to speculate.

sej1001 said:
I have mixed feelings about this. But, I keep hearing a lot of
speculation about the possibilities. It will be interesting to see.
This could generate more 4/3rd's lenses.

I sure would like to know what their thinking. I really like the
s2, but want to know Fuji's furture before investing in lenses. If,
they switch to 4/3rds now it will be....well...interesting!

I imaging some fuji followers with lenses will be....ahhh....not
happy!

Steve J.

--
Charles Bandes
http://www.bandesphoto.com

hmac · Sep 10, 2003

R. C. Johnson said:
corporation, to make money, period. If they produce a follow up to
the S2 they will want to sell it to as many people as they can
including current owners of the S1 & S2. There would be little
profit to be had in alienating their current users. With the new
price point set by the Canon rebel, my guess is any Four Thirds
production by Fuji will be aimed at consumer level cameras, and not
toward the pro level. If the full frame CCD is cost prohibitive at
this time, I think the Nikon DX lens designs may fair well for the
time being. To me, the Olympus E1 offers no compelling reason to
buy at its stated price. My $100.00 is on a F mount S3.
--
R. C. Johnson

I wouldn't be surprised to see Fuji come out with a 4/3 camera, and soon, but I'd be surprised to see it as a replacement for the S2. Lots of rumors, but the most consistent seem to be F100-based body. Full frame sensor, greater-than-10 megapixels. I wonder what it will cost -- priced at the 14N, maybe?
--
H McCollister

sej1001 · Sep 10, 2003

Your right R.C. the more I think about what your saying it makes sense, and fuji / nikon have had a relationship for a while in consumer cameras making parts for each other. I think it's the best bet.

Thanks for your input

Steve J.

R. C. Johnson said:
corporation, to make money, period. If they produce a follow up to
the S2 they will want to sell it to as many people as they can
including current owners of the S1 & S2. There would be little
profit to be had in alienating their current users. With the new
price point set by the Canon rebel, my guess is any Four Thirds
production by Fuji will be aimed at consumer level cameras, and not
toward the pro level. If the full frame CCD is cost prohibitive at
this time, I think the Nikon DX lens designs may fair well for the
time being. To me, the Olympus E1 offers no compelling reason to
buy at its stated price. My $100.00 is on a F mount S3.
--
R. C. Johnson

sej1001 · Sep 10, 2003

Yes, it is fun to speculate. I just can't wait to see what they actually do. Exciting times in digital photography.

Steve J.

Charles Bandes said:
That said, I wouldn't be too surprised to see two pro-level bodies
from Fuji in the next generation - a Nikon mount and a 4/3 mount.

Fuji already supports multiple mount systems - they have their own
lens system for Hasselblad Xpan, Hasselblad H1, Fuji GX680... (Was
that last one recently discontinued?) If their film lines were
discontinued recently with the exception of the Hasselblad bodies,
perhaps they plan on focusing that effort on digital bodies. If so,
it would make a lot of sense to see them with a deep product line,
perhaps a 4/3, a "DX" and a 35mm size or MF-size digital. (What I
wouldn't give for a digital version of their GX645 rangefinder
(swoon))

Fuji makes great lenses - it would be great to have a fantastic
Fuji body paired with fantastic lenses. But I sure as heck don't
want to lose my Nikon glass in the process, and I think Fuji knows
that. (But we'll see.)

Uh, needless to say, I have no idea what they are actually
going to do Just speculating, 'cause it's fun to speculate.

sej1001 said:

I have mixed feelings about this. But, I keep hearing a lot of
speculation about the possibilities. It will be interesting to see.
This could generate more 4/3rd's lenses.

I sure would like to know what their thinking. I really like the
s2, but want to know Fuji's furture before investing in lenses. If,
they switch to 4/3rds now it will be....well...interesting!

I imaging some fuji followers with lenses will be....ahhh....not
happy!

Steve J.

Click to expand...

--
Charles Bandes
http://www.bandesphoto.com

David Phipps · Sep 10, 2003

I doubt very much this will happen with Fuji. Kodak built a digi from the ground up and had to use N80 metering and AF ( story I heard is that was best nikon would sell them) but metering and AF of the F100 with a Fuji CCD would be a pretty unbeatable system (esp if full frame) I'm so confident it won't be F100 based that I'll state right here if it happens I'll go buy myself 2 (kind of a win win for me) : )

hmac said:
R. C. Johnson said:

corporation, to make money, period. If they produce a follow up to
the S2 they will want to sell it to as many people as they can
including current owners of the S1 & S2. There would be little
profit to be had in alienating their current users. With the new
price point set by the Canon rebel, my guess is any Four Thirds
production by Fuji will be aimed at consumer level cameras, and not
toward the pro level. If the full frame CCD is cost prohibitive at
this time, I think the Nikon DX lens designs may fair well for the
time being. To me, the Olympus E1 offers no compelling reason to
buy at its stated price. My $100.00 is on a F mount S3.
--
R. C. Johnson

Click to expand...

I wouldn't be surprised to see Fuji come out with a 4/3 camera, and
soon, but I'd be surprised to see it as a replacement for the S2.
Lots of rumors, but the most consistent seem to be F100-based body.
Full frame sensor, greater-than-10 megapixels. I wonder what it
will cost -- priced at the 14N, maybe?
--
H McCollister

--
David Phipps

Jan Willem Mars · Sep 11, 2003

David Phipps wrote:
I'm so confident it won't be F100 based that

David Phipps said:
I'll state right here if it happens I'll go buy myself 2 (kind of a
win win for me) : )

except for your wallet...;-)

jw
--
my canon s45 portfolio can be seen at http://www.xs4all.nl/~jwmars at
my 'recent archives' there. Reactions appreciated.

Peter Fuxen · Sep 11, 2003

Don't look from Fuji's point of view...take a look at the point of view from Nikon Corp...

Why should Nikon give Fuji another body? Now Nikon is in the dslr market and trying to beat canon's leadership. I am sure there will be no S3 ever...

Regards
Peter

R. C. Johnson · Sep 11, 2003

Peter Fuxen said:
Don't look from Fuji's point of view...take a look at the point of
view from Nikon Corp...

Why should Nikon give Fuji another body? Now Nikon is in the dslr
market and trying to beat canon's leadership. I am sure there will
be no S3 ever...

Regards
Peter

It's just smart business for Nikon to continue with this association. They take profit from the direct sale/licensing deal with Fuji, plus sell a number of their lenses to Fuji owners, plus expand the pool of future Nikon SLR purchasers. When someone buys and commits to Canon it's a complete loss to Nikon. When someone buys an F mount Fuji, it's more money in Nikon's pockets.
--
R. C. Johnson

Peter Fuxen · Sep 11, 2003

R. C. Johnson said:
It's just smart business for Nikon to continue with this
association.

No it won't be smart...

R. C. Johnson said:
They take profit from the direct sale/licensing deal
with Fuji, plus sell a number of their lenses to Fuji owners,

They would sell the same amount to them if they have to use Nikon DSLR...

R. C. Johnson said:
expand the pool of future Nikon SLR purchasers. When someone buys
and commits to Canon it's a complete loss to Nikon.

This ist true, but remember how many people use third party lenses...so the only thing on the camera is by Nikon would be the f-mount...

I really don't believe that Nikon will go ahead with this relationship - now they don't need a partner in digital market - the situation today is completly different to the begining.

Regards
Peter

Amilcar Guimarães · Sep 11, 2003

R. C. Johnson said:
Peter Fuxen said:

Don't look from Fuji's point of view...take a look at the point of
view from Nikon Corp...

Why should Nikon give Fuji another body? Now Nikon is in the dslr
market and trying to beat canon's leadership. I am sure there will
be no S3 ever...

Regards
Peter

Click to expand...

It's just smart business for Nikon to continue with this
association. They take profit from the direct sale/licensing deal
with Fuji, plus sell a number of their lenses to Fuji owners, plus
expand the pool of future Nikon SLR purchasers. When someone buys
and commits to Canon it's a complete loss to Nikon. When someone
buys an F mount Fuji, it's more money in Nikon's pockets.
--
R. C. Johnson

I can´t agree more.
--
Amilcar

Bernie Ess · Sep 11, 2003

Peter Fuxen said:
Why should Nikon give Fuji another body?

Because no company lives on digital camera bodies, they live on the lenses that people need to make good photos, and every Fuji S1,2 or 3 body means one or several Nikon lens being sold. Its like printers: Epson doesn't make money with inkjet printers, but with consumables: inks and paper.

Or like restaurants: They are meant for eating, but the money is made on drinks. Old story.

Peter Fuxen said:
Now Nikon is in the dslr
market and trying to beat canon's leadership.

Oh really, do they? I can't see the slightest signs that they seriously try to do so. In the opposite: The had a clear leadership with the D1 series of cameras, that took Canon 2-3 years to catch up, and Nikon - specially since 2003 - seems to truly loose ground in this competition. One could almost think that they want to leave the field to Canon.

Peter Fuxen said:
I am sure there will
be no S3 ever...

I am no insider, but I bet you're wrong.

regards Bernhard (Berlin)

Peter Fuxen · Sep 11, 2003

Bernie Ess said:
Because no company lives on digital camera bodies, they live on the
lenses that people need to make good photos, and every Fuji S1,2 or
3 body means one or several Nikon lens being sold. Its like
printers: Epson doesn't make money with inkjet printers, but with
consumables: inks and paper.

Ok, let me ask you: Where do S2 user go, if there is no S3 in the future?

Bernie Ess said:
Or like restaurants: They are meant for eating, but the money is
made on drinks. Old story.

ACK. Same is going on with Canon. But what if their customers buy third party lenses :-o

Bernie Ess said:
Oh really, do they? I can't see the slightest signs that they
seriously try to do so.

Watch out for the new D2H...

Bernie Ess said:
in this competition. One could almost think that they want to
leave the field to Canon.

May be their customers are really different from eg Canon...

Bernie Ess said:
Bernie Ess said:

I am sure there will
be no S3 ever...

Click to expand...

I am no insider, but I bet you're wrong.

Believe it or not - i hope you are right. BTW: what body do you think they would use? A totally new one, or some of Nikons old bodys?

Regards
Peter

Bernie Ess · Sep 11, 2003

Peter Fuxen said:
Ok, let me ask you: Where do S2 user go, if there is no S3 in the
future?

Many will switch to Canon and sell their glass, many of the S2 users went F mount because this is the mount that Fuji chose, but would not go Nikon really. I never particulary liked Nikon, its irrational, but nevertheless real

Peter Fuxen said:
May be their customers are really different from eg Canon...

Well thats the optimistic version. I tend more to think that they are no longer competitive enough and have not enough cash to develop as fast as the would have to to catch up with Canon (I never had a Canon SLR either). To pump out new and better models every 9 months like babies requires huge financial substance and a tough and tight management oriented towards R&D. In choosing to produce their own sensors Canon took the right direction 3 or 4 years ago.

Peter Fuxen said:
Believe it or not - i hope you are right. BTW: what body do you
think they would use? A totally new one, or some of Nikons old
bodys?

Peter, I can only guess, I am no insider as I told. But I wouldn't be surprised to see the same F80 body, slightly upgraded, put around a new full frame camera at a very competitive price, i.e. cheaper than the Kodak 14n. Hopefully(!!!!) with a good viewfinder, the S2 one is rather tiny and not too bright... But FF alone means it will be double as large...

However I wouldn't mind an F100 based S3. It would lead to a considerably higher price however.

BTW, another possible version is also - and it is a rumour that is cursing since quite a while - that soon Nikon will be a subdivision of Fuji, then they just pick out the "Nikon" body they like most

))

I any case I dont see why Fuji would give up their pro customers and stay with their digital compact cameras which are not too good anyway. But all this should not happen too early, I first have to save some pennies after purchasing my first DSLR and my first F mount lenses this summer.

regards Bernie

Bernie Ess · Sep 11, 2003

Peter Fuxen said:
This ist true, but remember how many people use third party
lenses...so the only thing on the camera is by Nikon would be the
f-mount...

I actually own 4 F-mount lenses: 2 primes and 2 Zooms - the primes and the 80-200 are Nikon lenses, the other Zoom - the only excellent 3rd party general useage Zoom I could find - is the new Tamron 28-75/2,8.

And if I feel I will stick with F mount, I will probably get a Tele Zoom with VR in the future. 70-200 or 80-400.

regards Bernie

ross den otter · Sep 11, 2003

The Nikon D2h uses a new af module, Cam 2000. I suspect that this same module will wind up in a new F6 if people are still shooting film. (I don't know many anymore, and those that do are still using F2s or F3s) I think the Cam 1300 from the F100 could trickle down to the lesser quality cameras Nikon will make in the future. They may manufacture for other companies as the R and D is done and covered already.

Ross
http://www.ppinkmonkeystudios.com

Sean Keegan · Sep 11, 2003

Sorry but you are wrong Peter.... there are lots of people who would not have bought the D100 at all, but because there was the S2 they now own Nikon lenses. Lots of people have switched from Canon to the S2, who wouldn't have switched if there were just the D100 to choose from. Many people own 3rd party lensees, true, but there are still PLENTY of people who buy the Nikon lenses who wouldn't have if it were not for the S2. It is definitely a win situation for Nikon to get people commited to the Nikon lens mount. Look at how PCs have flourished VS the Mac in spite of the positves of the Mac. I switched from Mac to PC for this exact reason. I still wish I used a Mac because it is a great platform, but the software I need to use is not on the Mac. Now I could probably never go back even if I wanted to... I have too much invested in PC equiptment. I am not saying Nikon is a PC and Canon is like the Mac...just that it makes sense to get people using the Nikon lens mount any way they can. Having 3 choices in DSLRs (Kodak, Nikon, and Fuji) make the whole system more valuable. 3 BIG players I might add. This is good for Nikon and good for us the consumer.

Regards,
Sean

Peter Fuxen said:
Peter Fuxen said:

It's just smart business for Nikon to continue with this
association.

Click to expand...

No it won't be smart...

Peter Fuxen said:

They take profit from the direct sale/licensing deal
with Fuji, plus sell a number of their lenses to Fuji owners,

Click to expand...

They would sell the same amount to them if they have to use Nikon
DSLR...

Peter Fuxen said:

expand the pool of future Nikon SLR purchasers. When someone buys
and commits to Canon it's a complete loss to Nikon.

Click to expand...

This ist true, but remember how many people use third party
lenses...so the only thing on the camera is by Nikon would be the
f-mount...

I really don't believe that Nikon will go ahead with this
relationship - now they don't need a partner in digital market -
the situation today is completly different to the begining.

Regards
Peter

Sean Keegan · Sep 11, 2003

Everyone said that before the S2 came out too... "why would Nikon let the S2 come out and cannibolize their own market in the D100?", or "Fuji is crazy making the S2 because it is based on the N80 just like the D100... why would anyone buy from Fuji at all?".

The S1 and S2 have been hugely succesful for both Nikon and Fuji. I, for one have bought 3 nikon lenses in the last year that I would not have if the S2 had not come along.

Regards,
Sean

Amilcar Guimarães said:
R. C. Johnson said:

Peter Fuxen said:

Don't look from Fuji's point of view...take a look at the point of
view from Nikon Corp...

Why should Nikon give Fuji another body? Now Nikon is in the dslr
market and trying to beat canon's leadership. I am sure there will
be no S3 ever...

Regards
Peter

Click to expand...

It's just smart business for Nikon to continue with this
association. They take profit from the direct sale/licensing deal
with Fuji, plus sell a number of their lenses to Fuji owners, plus
expand the pool of future Nikon SLR purchasers. When someone buys
and commits to Canon it's a complete loss to Nikon. When someone
buys an F mount Fuji, it's more money in Nikon's pockets.
--
R. C. Johnson

Click to expand...

I can´t agree more.
--
Amilcar

John Pham · Sep 11, 2003

sej1001 said:
I have mixed feelings about this. But, I keep hearing a lot of
speculation about the possibilities. It will be interesting to see.
This could generate more 4/3rd's lenses.

More likely the S3 or S2+ will be the same body as the S2 but with Fuji new super CCD SR similar to the finepix 700.

Will S3 go 4/3rd's

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