Just starting out and a few basics to understand

Woody709 said:

I just recently wanted to try (on a hobbyist level) some macro shots. I've bought an old Minolta Bellows for SR/MC mount since I've had a couple of those lenses from the seventies with nothing to do.

I will need to adapt the MC bellows to Sony E mount (for both crop sensor and FF cameras), and browsed through this forum for guides and information. Many have touched on ideas I was not aware of for this particular type of photography.

The adaptor I became interested in is a Fotodiox DLX Stretch with helicoid focus adjustment and drop in ND filters. It seemed (from some posts here on this forum) that keeping the lens itself set at the subject and moving the camera body (and focal plane) was a preferred method. Is that correct?

Another question is about aperture. Other options for different adapters between the bellows and the camera offer aperture blades in the adapter body, moving them closer to the focal plane. If aperture needs to be adjusted, is there any advantage to using that set instead of the set built into the lens?

I would say that my intentions would be still lifes and miniatures subjects, and possibly some video trialed with a bit of practice over time.

Steve

Click to expand...

I'm guessing the Stretch adapter you've seen is similar to the helicoid adapter I have. The helicoid can be used to focus but this makes a big difference to the magnification. Fine tuning focus is easiest by simply rocking the camera (and lens) backwards & forwards taking the photo when the optimum focus is reached. A technique that works well with all macro solutions.

A bellows set up is slightly different in that it has two standards one for the lens & another for the body so the lens can be fixed with the body moving (not practical with a helicoid unless the lens has a tripod mount) IMO moving the entire bellows set up is better than just moving the camera body but many bellows don't have the added slider required for that.

I can't for the life of me think why you'd want drop in ND filters. Getting enough light for reasonable shutter speeds is the usual problem with macro. DOF is usually very much on the short side too, so apertures need to be closed down somewhat.

The adapters with built in apertures are intended for lenses with electronic aperture control there's no advantage in using them. Lenses from the 70's will have an aperture ring so you can control aperture correctly without adding a second iris in what is optically the wrong place.

I do appreciate the lessons in bellows use and the subtleties of macro shots. I really had no known need for the drop in ND filters, except for thinking forward and possibly replacing them with a polarized counterpart. There might be some value to that use I am not aware of now. Part of that experimenting and exploring photography that can open my eyes to something different or new.

I also don't want to misstep with excess or mostly useless equipment accumulation. The old Minolta lenses I have from the SRT-101 days are not the top shelf stuff, so I have other means available to accomplish similar results with modern offerings, if I wish to delve deeper in this facet of the hobby. As I stated, it was a way to utilize some lenses that no longer have a use sitting on a shelf.

So thanks for pointers in an aspect I have little knowledge and no experience in. Any info is of great value to me!

Steve

Woody709 said:

I just recently wanted to try (on a hobbyist level) some macro shots. I've bought an old Minolta Bellows for SR/MC mount since I've had a couple of those lenses from the seventies with nothing to do.

I will need to adapt the MC bellows to Sony E mount (for both crop sensor and FF cameras), and browsed through this forum for guides and information. Many have touched on ideas I was not aware of for this particular type of photography.

The adaptor I became interested in is a Fotodiox DLX Stretch with helicoid focus adjustment and drop in ND filters. It seemed (from some posts here on this forum) that keeping the lens itself set at the subject and moving the camera body (and focal plane) was a preferred method. Is that correct?

Another question is about aperture. Other options for different adapters between the bellows and the camera offer aperture blades in the adapter body, moving them closer to the focal plane. If aperture needs to be adjusted, is there any advantage to using that set instead of the set built into the lens?

I would say that my intentions would be still lifes and miniatures subjects, and possibly some video trialed with a bit of practice over time.

Steve

Click to expand...

If you're just getting started and have the typical 28mm and 50mm slr primes, the helicoid type adapter might be all you ever need to do "still life". In some ways it's much better than extension tubes.

Sorry for the break in time since I first inquired about equipment choices to make. It's been a hectic few weeks.

Anyway, I went with a simple straight MC/MD to E adaptor for now. I did find an old Minolta 58/1.4 PF I had wanted in the very early days (1970), and am using it for the experiments.

Next up will be a means to photostack. I don't use PS. I'll see if I can decipher Capture One's abilities to perform that task, or look for a stand alone alternative.

A shot from today, a sunny day after rain yesterday, and lots of fresh growth. As delivered from the A7sII.

Steve

Woody709 said:

Sorry for the break in time since I first inquired about equipment choices to make. It's been a hectic few weeks.

Anyway, I went with a simple straight MC/MD to E adaptor for now. I did find an old Minolta 58/1.4 PF I had wanted in the very early days (1970), and am using it for the experiments.

Next up will be a means to photostack. I don't use PS. I'll see if I can decipher Capture One's abilities to perform that task, or look for a stand alone alternative.

Click to expand...

Steve,

I think you made the correct choice with the straight MC/MD to E adapter for the bellows to camera. The old Minolta lenses can certainly hold their own with modern glass, particularly the 50mm Macro Rokkor-X 1:1 and the 100mm macro Rokkor for bellows. Both these lenses can be obtained reasonably on e-bay.


The 50 mm Macro Rokkor-X with it's 1:1 extension tube on Minolta auto bellows II On bellows, magnifications up to approx 3:1 are possible. This lens will also mount directly to the adapter on camera for up to 1:1




The 100 mm macro Rokkor for Bellows shown on the Minolta Auto Bellows II, mounted on its focusing rail, fitted with the slide copying attachment.

A focusing rail as shown here will prove invaluable for magnifications higher than 1:1 and for focus stacking. If you cannot locate the Minolta rail for your bellows, several other makes are readily available.

Feel free to ask for more information and have fun with your new found interest.

--
Robin H

There are several ways of stacking photos several of which can useful for macro.

If you want to try focus stacking (increasing DOF) Combine ZP is pretty good & free. It was written for microscopy but also works for mere macro magnifications.

For panoramic stitching (increasing FOV) Microsoft ICE works well & is also free. When using my budget digital microscope this has come into it's own. The sensor is only ~3MP but with a little stitching images suitable for printing large can be produced.

I've never seen the need for HDR (increasing dynamic range) or noise reducing stacking (used in astronomy), but I suppose they could be used too.

I read some of the reviews and user reports for 3 paid and a few free programs. I didn't come across a similar program plug in for Capture One (yet). I would like to build more apparent DoF, as the slice of the focal plane is miniscule, as is my experience with manipulating the rig for better results.

One thing I was having a problem with was determining just how much focus adjustment to make on the object. Most of the multiple images I tried yesterday show almost no change of in-focus plane. I suppose once I start image stacking a few times, it should become something I will get the feel for.

Steve

I should consider your advice about the rails. My early (MC) version does not have the lower rails, just the bellows adjustment platform and inscribed scale. The fact that I don't see the Minolta name on the unit suggests to me that it, in fact, may be a third party part. It just has a adjustment cover plug identifying it as "for Minolta" and "Japan" in their (Minolta's) distinctive font.

Steve

Woody709 said:

I read some of the reviews and user reports for 3 paid and a few free programs. I didn't come across a similar program plug in for Capture One (yet). I would like to build more apparent DoF, as the slice of the focal plane is miniscule, as is my experience with manipulating the rig for better results.

One thing I was having a problem with was determining just how much focus adjustment to make on the object. Most of the multiple images I tried yesterday show almost no change of in-focus plane. I suppose once I start image stacking a few times, it should become something I will get the feel for.

Steve

Click to expand...

For best results you typically want loads of images. Some people use hundreds for insects. With my microscope I just tend to use the smallest increments I can manage going from out of focus one side to out of focus the other. I think I only managed half a dozen or so when shooting a flies ankle at highest magnification (100x objective), and this proved far from adequate.
Moving out to the medium power objective gave much better results

Woody709 said:

I should consider your advice about the rails. My early (MC) version does not have the lower rails, just the bellows adjustment platform and inscribed scale. The fact that I don't see the Minolta name on the unit suggests to me that it, in fact, may be a third party part. It just has a adjustment cover plug identifying it as "for Minolta" and "Japan" in their (Minolta's) distinctive font.

Steve

Click to expand...

I think you are correct, a third party bellows. No matter, my Minolta Auto bellows II , shown in the first photo, came without the lower focus rail, even thought it can be exchanged with the bellows shown in the second photo, I prefer to mount it on one of several other focusing rails that I own.