Will Nikon or Canon offer full frame mirrorless cameras soon?

Started Aug 5, 2016 | Discussions thread
dgumshu
dgumshu Senior Member • Posts: 3,551
Re: Will Nikon or Canon offer full frame mirrorless cameras soon?

Shockwave wrote:

dgumshu wrote:

Shockwave wrote:

dgumshu wrote:

Shockwave wrote:

dgumshu wrote:

Shockwave wrote:

Dennis wrote:

Shockwave wrote:

They have a 24-70 pro equivalent (18-55) - That's fine

Even that lens is dated, lacks IS and doesn't go to 16mm, like some competing options (Fuji & m43 alternatives ... Sony has a 16-50/2.8 for A mount, too). I don't know whether this is holding the D500 back or not - Sigma has a stabilized alternative and I suspect a lot of buyers would be fine with the new 16-80/2.8-4.

The D500 is the only pro grade APSC body that Nikon provides. With this in mind, if you were a pro shooter looking to use APSC, the lens trifecta is an issue. Essentially you are forced by Nikon to adopt full frame to achieve the trifecta with decent quality glass.

I've seen a number of wedding shooters shift to Fuji because they can still get the trifecta, they have lighter lenses and bodies to carry around for a day, and any loss of IQ is acceptable because it's essentially 1 stop of light (which you can often work around) and minimal loss of IQ unless you pixel peep or print very large.

A pro shooter wouldn't be using an APS-C with those expectations. He/She would likely be using a full frame and lens combo

Ah, the good old "all pro shooters use full frame" argument that keeps coming up. It's was a legitimate argument...back in 2005...

No, I was referring to your comment about the lens trifecta (or lack of) on APS-C. If you want the trifecta you're referring to, then FF is the obvious choice... and that's what a pro would likely use.

Full frame is not an obvious choice. The obvious choice is to switch to another brand has that has an APSC trifecta if you don't need full frame. That is exactly the problem that I was highlighting. If you want pro glass, Canikon force you into full frame with limited glass available for APSC. Yes, you can use full frame glass on APSC, but in some cases, the focal lengths are incorrect, like the zooms, and you are lugging around large glass that you may not want. Nikon is offering a pro grade APSC body in the form of the D500, but there are no trifecta zooms to match it, this is exactly the problem that Thom has highlighted.

APSC is quite capable of handling pro work, many pro photographers already use it. Have a look at photographers like Bill Gekas, Ted Vieira etc. They all use APSC for pro work without any problems.

So in short, the limitation is not APSC, the limitation is Canikon in this case.

I see what you're trying to say, but switching to another brand isn't all that simple. Most pros I know have both formats. It's just as easy to use a FF. Especially the 5DRS and 5D4 with great cropping ability due to the high MP. If I understand your trifecta correctly, it's for landscapes and portraits... what about everything else?

You're forgetting about the long end glass... 400-800mm. That trifecta may be good from wide to, what... 200mm? What about the long glass most commonly used with the Nikon and Canon APSC? Is long glass available in Fuji? It all depends on what you shoot and your personal preferences.

Switching to another system is actually surprisingly easy, I made the switch from the D750 along with full frame pro glass and it didn't cost me a cent. The sale of my used full frame yeah it was enough to buy me a brand-new Fuji gear and I went from having 2 and 4 year old gear that wasn't under warranty to having new stuff in warranty.

On the glass front, only sports and wildlife shooters need long glass. Wedding, portrait, landscape, street, etc don't require it. I also don't think cropping is an issue. You don't shoot to crop, you frame right and if you're framing so badly you need 36-50mp, full frame is the least of your concern, composition is.

Easy switching systems? Oh, I wish it was. If it were that easy, I'd have multiple systems.

When you have a lot of gear, especially glass, (lenses and bodies) it's not easy at all unless you don't mind taking a bath in financial loss. That's like tossing it all away. With one body and a few lenses, it's a no brainer.

On the glass end, that's precisely my point. The Fuji system, while very excellent, only lends itself to those shooting styles that you mentioned. For sports and wildlife, it's not a fit as the proper long glass is very limited... so why switch to a system that is limited to only a certain type/venue/style of photography?

While that system may work for you, It won't work for others. With a fast FF and long glass you get the best of both worlds. I can use an ultra wide to 800mm + extenders on a 5D4. While not as fast as my 1DX, it's very capable.

The 5D4 is also becoming a popular wildlife camera and many are selling off their 7D2's as it is so capable.

Re cropping:

Landscape, portrait and wedding photographers have the opportunity to frame the shot correctly by setting up and composing properly. That's not the case with sports and especially wildlife. Far from it. You take what you can get while you can get it, so cropping plays a major part as time for proper composition is rarely available for sudden quick action shots... I wish it were.

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