Thom Hogan hints 50mp for upcoming D820/D850

Started Mar 19, 2017 | Discussions thread
havoc315 Veteran Member • Posts: 4,213
Re: Thom Hogan hints 50mp for upcoming D820/D850
2

Glen78 wrote:

havoc315 wrote:

Glen78 wrote:

Matsu wrote:

Glen78 wrote:

havoc315 wrote:

michaeladawson wrote:

Glen78 wrote:

In this same discussion thread Thom also mentions "I believe Nikon has one really big surprise coming, sensor-wise". 50mp does not really sound like a big surprise to me so he must be referring to something else.

I wouldn't only look at MP count in terms of the surprise. A big surprise could be who makes the sensor. It could be on-sensor phase detect AF. Any number of things could be a big surprise besides MP count.

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Mike Dawson

Good on-sensor phase detect would indeed be "big" and is necessary to compete. Nikon and Pentax are the only camera makers that still don't have a decent live view.

This morning Thom posted that OSPDAF is not what he is referring to (nor is it a multi-layered CFA). He seems to think that OSPDAF does not make sense for F-mount for technical reasons which is consistent with what I have heard elsewhere.

Link please? Thom and I have corresponded in this topic in the past, and back then he seemed to think F mount was just fine. I'd like to read his exact words on it.

Disqus is not working right now so I cannot go back to the original quote but when it is working if you click on his name in a comment it will show you all his posts. Unless Nikon is really trying to go after video users though I am not sure where OSPDAF makes sense anyway. The problem as I understand it is with Nikon's separate PDAF module currently the camera can tell the lens both the direction and the magnitude of adjustment that needs to be made to achieve focus. This is why the lenses can zip right into focus vs. the experience in live view with contrast based focus where the camera can only tell the lens that focus is off and the lens just keeps hunting to find focus (and sometimes initially in the wrong direction). OSPDAF helps somewhat by being able to indicate the direction of the missed focus (Canon's dual pixel is especially good at this) but still not the magnitude. The problem as I understand it is all the protocols for f-mount are written based on sending direction and magnitude information to achieve focus and trying to use OSPDAF or CDAF is sub-optimal with f-mount.

It works just fine with single point OSPDAF on Nikon 1 and FT-1 adapter. There is no conceivable reason why it couldn't be upscaled to work on a larger sensor with more points. It may take far more processing power, it may therefore increase the cost of the camera, it may only be practical on cameras with a lot of processing power. But logically, it should be technologically possible.

I think some people who have actually used a Nikon 1 and FT-1 would dispute that it works just fine (I have not personally so I cannot say but it is definitely not like using a lens on a native f-mount with a PDAF sensor).

I have used it, so I can say. When in half-decent light, It is just like using a native F-mount with center point AF, whether AF-S or AF-C.

Now, even if it isn't 100% as good as pure native F-mount, even if it is only 90% as good -- Then it would still be a huge improvement over the current Nikon live view system.

I don't doubt that there is a way to make f-mount work with OSPDAF but it is not optimized for it then they will always be competing at a disadvantage.

Not talking about mirrorless now. Just talking about using it in a dSLR live view. So the question is simply whether it would be better than the current CDAF on Nikon dSLRs. And the answer is almost certainly yes.

Take a look here:

https://photographylife.com/capturing-birds-flight-nikon-1-v2-ft-1-adapter/

How well can you do birds-in-flight with the current Nikon dSLR CDAF system?

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