This thread has become another example of a "stolen thread" where the majority of the postings have nothing to do with the OP's original question, and have occurred after a post that he declared answered his question.
No, it's not just the subscription model. Also how they treated me in the past as a loyal paying customer. No pirated version.Shareholders are happy about profits. In order to have profit, you have to have a user base that will continue to use your product and add new users as well. In other words... happy customers.
I think you are mainly rankled at Adobe's Subscription Model. Personally, I think the Adobe Photography Subscription product is the best deal in photography today.
Based on Adobe's profits there are clearly more of me than there are of you.
I can't blame Adobe for going this route as their software has been hacked and pirated more than any company I know.
Back in the day, I'd say 2/3 of the people I knew using PS were using a pirated copy.
You mentioned earlier that you didn't like the way Adobe locks you in. My Nikon Raw files are not converted to some proprietary file format that only Adobe can read.. and ironically Adobe's DNG is an open file format too is it not?
Adobe offers a free trial..... any new user should be able to determine if the software is for them before getting a 1 year subscription. If they don't... then thats on them. If not, 1 year later (or sooner if they want) they can take their files elsewhere and move on.
Ohhhh well..... Not to worry ! There are always some guy(s) who are going to discuss until death, just to impose their opinion, because they are convinced that there's only ONE truth: theirs !
You keep throwing 7 million users at me. It doesn't say anything if not in relation to the amount of subscribers with perpetual license before CC subscription. So, how many users they had before CC subscription and how many they have now. Without those facts your number doesn't say anything. You are aware that most companies bump up figures to make their business look good.
It seems for some people it is. I just move on to the next best thing that gets my work done fast and easy. Wheater it's Adobe or another developer.
I guess I have to specifically copy and paste the text for you to understand this! I don’t know if you are purposely trying not to understand this, or if you are really struggling with it, maybe bold text will draw your attention to the facts about the subscription model adoption:
What it proves is what I wrote** that you can't grasp: Adobe's subscription plan is successful to Adobe, customers are buying it up, and Adobe's stock reflects this.
Oh, and there's this:
Where's my Illustrator, Photoshop and Indesign bundle? Yes, Greedy.I guess I have to specifically copy and paste the text for you to understand this! I don’t know if you are purposely trying not to understand this, or if you are really struggling with it, maybe bold text will draw your attention to the facts about the subscription model adoption:
Adobe’s Creative Cloud has been available for over three years now and continues to gain strong adoption in the marketplace, the latest published figures show.
Lately the rate of paid memberships has approached almost 1 million per quarter – adding 798,000 new subscribers in the past quarter alone (or 57,000 new customers each week) – which means that total number of subscribers has now reached 7 million since the CC product linereplaced Creative Suite in June 2013.
Highlights in our recent quarter include accelerating adoption of Creative Cloud, driven by strong net new CC subscription additions. Across all routes to market, we continue to see solid demand for Creative Cloud, with large portions of our legacy perpetual customers moving to a subscription model. In addition, we are now migrating significant numbers of hobbyist customers who previously used Photoshop Elements and Lightroom on a perpetual basis to the Creative Cloud Photography offering. And we are seeing on Adobe.com that the vast, vast majority of people who are buying Acrobat DC are buying the subscription option.
Undrestand?
Need a picture to help?
What it proves is what I wrote** that you can't grasp: Adobe's subscription plan is successful to Adobe, customers are buying it up, and Adobe's stock reflects this.
Oh, and there's this:
http://www.cnet.com/news/how-greedy-is-adobes-creative-cloud-subscription-not-very/
--
Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net
I understand YOU (and perhaps others) would like unique subscription bundles. Really I do. What I was hoping you'd understand is, Adobe has produced a unique set of two bundles and it's working out very well for them and further, millions of other customers! The data backs that up; adoption rate is growing since subscriptions started. That's a fact.Where's my Illustrator, Photoshop and Indesign bundle? Yes, Greedy.I guess I have to specifically copy and paste the text for you to understand this! I don’t know if you are purposely trying not to understand this, or if you are really struggling with it, maybe bold text will draw your attention to the facts about the subscription model adoption:
Adobe’s Creative Cloud has been available for over three years now and continues to gain strong adoption in the marketplace, the latest published figures show.
Lately the rate of paid memberships has approached almost 1 million per quarter – adding 798,000 new subscribers in the past quarter alone (or 57,000 new customers each week) – which means that total number of subscribers has now reached 7 million since the CC product linereplaced Creative Suite in June 2013.
Highlights in our recent quarter include accelerating adoption of Creative Cloud, driven by strong net new CC subscription additions. Across all routes to market, we continue to see solid demand for Creative Cloud, with large portions of our legacy perpetual customers moving to a subscription model. In addition, we are now migrating significant numbers of hobbyist customers who previously used Photoshop Elements and Lightroom on a perpetual basis to the Creative Cloud Photography offering. And we are seeing on Adobe.com that the vast, vast majority of people who are buying Acrobat DC are buying the subscription option.
Undrestand?
Need a picture to help?
What it proves is what I wrote** that you can't grasp: Adobe's subscription plan is successful to Adobe, customers are buying it up, and Adobe's stock reflects this.
Oh, and there's this:
http://www.cnet.com/news/how-greedy-is-adobes-creative-cloud-subscription-not-very/
--
Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net
I do understand why they won't do it, it's extra money.I understand YOU (and perhaps others) would like unique subscription bundles. Really I do. What I was hoping you'd understand is, Adobe has produced a unique set of two bundles and it's working out very well for them and further, millions of other customers! The data backs that up; adoption rate is growing since subscriptions started. That's a fact.Where's my Illustrator, Photoshop and Indesign bundle? Yes, Greedy.I guess I have to specifically copy and paste the text for you to understand this! I don’t know if you are purposely trying not to understand this, or if you are really struggling with it, maybe bold text will draw your attention to the facts about the subscription model adoption:
Adobe’s Creative Cloud has been available for over three years now and continues to gain strong adoption in the marketplace, the latest published figures show.
Lately the rate of paid memberships has approached almost 1 million per quarter – adding 798,000 new subscribers in the past quarter alone (or 57,000 new customers each week) – which means that total number of subscribers has now reached 7 million since the CC product linereplaced Creative Suite in June 2013.
Highlights in our recent quarter include accelerating adoption of Creative Cloud, driven by strong net new CC subscription additions. Across all routes to market, we continue to see solid demand for Creative Cloud, with large portions of our legacy perpetual customers moving to a subscription model. In addition, we are now migrating significant numbers of hobbyist customers who previously used Photoshop Elements and Lightroom on a perpetual basis to the Creative Cloud Photography offering. And we are seeing on Adobe.com that the vast, vast majority of people who are buying Acrobat DC are buying the subscription option.
Undrestand?
Need a picture to help?
What it proves is what I wrote** that you can't grasp: Adobe's subscription plan is successful to Adobe, customers are buying it up, and Adobe's stock reflects this.
Oh, and there's this:
http://www.cnet.com/news/how-greedy-is-adobes-creative-cloud-subscription-not-very/
--
Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net
I don't like brussels sprouts. Millions of other's do. I don't buy brussels sprouts and that's my right. It doesn't negatively affect the brussels spout market as other's love em. I'm OK with that. The same is true for Adobe and any other company that produces a product or service. If the price to benefit ratio is such it's not worth buying, don't buy! Is this a new concept for folks around these parts?
You're probably not going to get an Illustrator, PS and ID bundle at a lower price than the full subscription! IF the price for the entire suite is too high for you and you're OK going elsewhere, do so. IF NOT, pay for the subscription. I never use Illustrator. I have access to it as I'm a subscriber of the full suite. I'm OK with that and you know why? The price for the few products that are included are well worth the price for the few I use. It's as simple at that.
--
Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net
Yes! And the money is either worth the cost to your or it's not.
We know they asked. What we don't know is the responses from all who answered. Why speculate? I know what I'd ask for and you know what you'd ask for. That's about it.
Did they stop listening to all customers, most, or just you? It's useful to speak for yourself and only others when you have actual facts to back up what they might have said.
They may and probably do have some of both customers. But the facts are shown in the graph of increase subscriptions from 2012 to 2016!
Trust but verify. It's very possible the figures are baked. But then they have supplied those figures in their annual report too so if baked, they could get into a boatload of trouble; prove the values are baked.
Yes we will.
Agreed. And while you think we're arguing, one of us provided some actual outside facts as to the subscription rates and a figure that clearly isn't baked; their stock prices. My original comment (that you apparently needed to argue about) was simple: Adobe isn't losing money or customers due to CC; just the opposite. The graph I provided shows more subscribers year after year! IF you have outside facts to state otherwise, I'd of course examine them.
That graph is a fact? It doesn't say how many came from perpetual license. Perpetual people switching to CC subscription is NOT growth! Your link DID say at 2013 they had 8.4 million cs perpetual licenses. But now they have only 7 million CC subscriptions. So, where did those 1.4 million go?
No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Maybe you're not a professional (fill in the blank) and do not purchase professional quality equipment. Or a serious amateur photographer where $5K of cameras and lenses are not out of line. Again, since there's zero transparency about you here, I have no idea what you do. One might suspect that whatever business you're in, you might have to purchase equipment.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
Can you make those decisions to do so in less than 30 days?I buy cars, I don't lease them. I buy software, lenses, cameras, shoes.. I don't lease them.No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Maybe you're not a professional (fill in the blank) and do not purchase professional quality equipment. Or a serious amateur photographer where $5K of cameras and lenses are not out of line. Again, since there's zero transparency about you here, I have no idea what you do. One might suspect that whatever business you're in, you might have to purchase equipment.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
--
Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net
Fine with me.
Well I feel a bit sorry for you not being able to make up your mind on pulling the trigger on a software product when given 30 days, 730 odd hours, to make a decision. You say you don't know anyone else who can either, so I have to wonder if you get out often :-O
No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Maybe you're not a professional (fill in the blank) and do not purchase professional quality equipment. Or a serious amateur photographer where $5K of cameras and lenses are not out of line. Again, since there's zero transparency about you here, I have no idea what you do. One might suspect that whatever business you're in, you might have to purchase equipment.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Maybe you're not a professional (fill in the blank) and do not purchase professional quality equipment. Or a serious amateur photographer where $5K of cameras and lenses are not out of line. Again, since there's zero transparency about you here, I have no idea what you do. One might suspect that whatever business you're in, you might have to purchase equipment.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
No worries.
And yet you did
You've missed the point. I can afford it because it's a tool that's necessary in my business. Such purchases are supposed to pay for themselves many times over. In my case, it's that product and when I shot professionally, it was expensive strobes, lens, etc.
Maybe you're not a professional (fill in the blank) and do not purchase professional quality equipment. Or a serious amateur photographer where $5K of cameras and lenses are not out of line. Again, since there's zero transparency about you here, I have no idea what you do. One might suspect that whatever business you're in, you might have to purchase equipment.
Thanks for your tax advise; I already do. Are you an accountant?
Yes, of course.
And of course, when I asked you how you were able to purchase (as one example) a car without having the ability to test drive it for 30 days, as you say you need to evaluate a CC subscription, you didn't reply for obvious reasons; it would kind of poke holes in your idea that for others, it's just too difficult to make a buying decision with 'only' a 30 day trial**. Forgive me for not buying that.
Really, seriously?
