Mass Exodus to 10d ?

tony gilmour · Jun 7, 2003

I don't get to post much but I have noticed that quite a few Sony owners are looking seriously at changing to the Canon 10D.

I'll bet most of these people are former SLR owners and not newbies to photography.

Is this giving a strong message to Sony and other manufacturers to what most of the serious photographers amongst us want in our cameras ?
--
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You only live once ,and always suck the lemon.

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Skippy · Jun 7, 2003

Hi Eric,
Yes I too have been watching the exodus from Sony to Canon.

My Sony F707 is the first and only Digital Camera I have ever owned, and I have been very pleased with it's performance, but I also have a wish list

I think your right the more familiar we are becoming with the equipment the more we want to move onwards, however we are at this point in time restricted most by the $$$$$$$. Anyone even thinking about moving to a Canon 10D knows the cost of the lenses are beyond most peoples reach.

Digital Cameras are still very much in their infancy, and I am sure we will see it quickly move in leaps and bounds............at this point in time I am happy to continue learning all I can about my F707, before moving onto anything else.....Skippy (Australia)

--

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Gerrit Pang · Jun 7, 2003

It's not a rush to doors. Most admit to keeping their 717's and still use them because of convenience. The 10d kit is a lot of weight and obvious when you use it.

Bud/B · Jun 7, 2003

I don't know about mass exodus but there is a signigicant incremental improvement in DSLR functionality over Sony's flagship 7*7 line. Those who have reached the limits of their existing camera and are subsequently feeling creatively limited will naturally look to equipment that will allow their creative growth. For those in that position using the F717 the only option is to buy a different brand.

I don't think you can characterize those who are switching to DSLRs based on their former experience with film based cameras. Some 35mm veterans have stated in this forum they would never go back to SLR systems because they don't want to deal with the weight of lenses. Some relative "newbies" have found a creative outlet in digital photography that film based systems couldn't provide. Their migration to DSLR is not necessarily a step "back" in form factor.

As far as Sony is concerned I doubt they really care what serious photographers want. That contingent of the photographic community is obviously not their market.

--
Bud
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Greg Gebhardt · Jun 7, 2003

--There is a big difference in price and weight to be carried. I find my D1 and D1x don't get out as often as my 717 and V1. To those hwo do go DSLR, DON'T sell you 717! You will find you will still use it.

Greg Gebhardt Nikon D1 & D1x. Sony 717, V1! , Epson 2200 & PS7
Jacksonville, Florida

Harry Behret · Jun 7, 2003

I was reading a digital photography mag recently (don't remember which one) but a poll of its readership indicated that 51% intended to move up to a DSLR in the future.

I think its kind of a natural progression. You have some who want the newest toy and others who want a "better" camera as their skills improve. I hope to "upgrade" by the beginning of next year. if I do I'll keep the 717 because I don't see myself being likely to tote a DSLR everywhere I go like I do now with the 717.

Harry

http://www.pbase.com/hpb

Shutter. · Jun 7, 2003

Hi Eric,

Well, there does seem to be quite a few 7x7 owners getting or thinking about getting a DSLR. I'm not sure, however, that you hou can infer much about their past camera history. I, for one, have never really had an SLR (I did have one in college but only used it on full auto, so it was basically a p&s).

The reasons are probably many, ranging from "The Joneses" factor to the desire to get better/different photos. In my case, it wasn't so much about getting better prints as much as it was that I could get prints that I couldn't get before. I am so pleased with the prints I get from 707 that that wasn't a driving factor. But, what I did want was the ability to go high with clean ISO's so I could pursue different kinds of photography (more night street stuff, low light, certain types of weddings, etc...). I also can get shots I couldn't get before because there is virturally no shutter lag.

Right now I'm shooting 100% with the 10D, but beginning this morning I'll be bringing my 707 along with some intent to try and demonstrate what kind of real difference there is between the image quality for landscapes. I expect to find that although the 10D photos will be cleaner, they will be much harder to obtain, making the 707 much more valuable in those cases.

Now to Sony's cameras. I think I would be a little concerned with the exodus. Fortunately for them it's not in the middle of their product line. Sony users are typically pretty loyal, but if there is no option, there is no choice. I would imagine if Sony came out with some unconventional looking DSLR that I'd be first in line. I'd much rather shoot Sony than Canon. There's just something about it I like. But at the same time I wasn't about to restrict myself just to be loyal.

So, I guess the question would be - If all the Sony 7x7 users jumped ship to a DSLR, and Sony has no intentions of going to a DSLR, would they care? Nope, because they've already bought there flagship top-of-the-line camera. Now, if users started going from a lower megapixel Sony camera to a Nikon DSLR, then there'd probably be more concern, but generally the DSLR is the next step in a progression.

All this, of course, is based on this extremely small sampling of individuals from this crazy place we call STF. What normal people do, I have no idea.

Enjoy your Saturday. Now, about that walk......

--
Jim Fuglestad

Skill in photography is acquired by practice and not by purchase. -Percy W. Harris
Our existence is determined by the truths we tell.
Why simply live and let live? Live and help live.
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Ulysses · Jun 7, 2003

Hardly a mass exodus, where hundreds or tens of thousands are crossing over to the other side.

Photography is rather like the bell curve we learn about: You have the few who have little interest and consequently take bad pictures; You have the mass majority who are enthused and take okay pictures (this is Sony's market, as well as that of most camera manufacturers); And you have the few who have been with cameras for a while and are ready to move on to more advanced cameras and push their images to a different level.

That's always been the case. It's just that you've only recently noticed it with a few of your peers. But there is nothing particularly significant about the few that you've seen move over to a dSLR. The core market remains intact.

And in fact, Sony HAS improved the feature set of their core cameras. Try comparing a feature list of the old P1 to the current P10. Even their P&S cameras have improved, as have their higher end.

--

Ulysses

Khanh Vo · Jun 7, 2003

I have been using the S75 for about 2 years now. Wanted to upgrade to something a little faster. I bought the F717 at sears and and was very happy with it until I had chance to play with the 10D from our local Fry's store. I went back the same day to return the F717. As a Sony camera user I think Sony biggest mistake is the Memory stick. I just can't believe that the memory stick price cost 3x to 4x as a compact flash in large capacity.

Khanh

Roberta F. · Jun 7, 2003

For me, one of the biggest reasons is shutter lag. Second reason is the ability to accurately and precisely focus manually on the 10D...nice for macro. Up until digital, all of my experience has been with a manual SLR. My Nikon FM still works flawlessly and it's 25 years old. The focusing ring on the lens glides like butter.

I'm keeping my 717 which can't be beat for IR. Haven't tried IR with the 10D yet but I've been reading up on it. My IR filters from my Sony fit on the 100mm f2.8 macro so I'm thrilled to be able to try IR on the 10D without spending more $ on new filters.

Roberta
http://www.pbase.com/roberta
Canon 10D, Sony 717, Olympus C-3000, Nikon FM

austex · Jun 7, 2003

If your seriously devoted to a hobby, at some point you will start looking to "take it to the next level" so to speak (I hate that phrase, but in this case it applies).

Think of it as somebody doing plastic models. They move from the non-painted, non-glue needed "snap" models, to the painted, non-glue "snap" models, to the painted, glued models and on up.

Or perhaps a flower enthusiast (such as my wife) who starts out with a few flowers and simple pots, and soon wants a greenhouse so they can add a lot of variety, lol.

austex · Jun 7, 2003

Wanted to say also:

Many hobbies, you can reach the pinnacle quit fast, in terms of equipment, materials, and skill level.

Digital Photography on the other hand, is a hobby that allows you a lot more freedom than many other hobbies.

Even if you stop upgrading cameras, you still have the ability to do incredible things, and you still have the ability to keep learning.

It's also a hobby suitable for almost any age.

austex · Jun 7, 2003

This is why my next camera purchase is probably going to CF. I posted elsewhere about it, but I am having to take a lot of photos for work and to be able to share them in the field while lugging the bare minimum around. Plus, the amount of memory I have decided I need (about 3G) costs more if I go MemStick than buying a DSLR with CF.

It was going to be a G5, but I may try and pull off a 10D after seeing so many Sony users thrilled with it.

Rodger Cooley · Jun 7, 2003

This is correct in my case. I have been shooting vintage minolta srt 101 since 1972. A systems aproach. The sony was my first digital and I love it. No going back to film now. I do miss many things about the slr however. Interchangeable lens, no shutter lag, and most of all real focus ability.

The 10d offers these benefits and many more. Its just a serious step up from the 7x7 and at a price point that many of us can sell our wives on. Yep, its true the wives are always a major issue in any hobby.

So sooner or later its a dslr for me. For now that looks like a 10d, but if nikon gets serious about this price point before I have completed the saving plan they might get my money.

Hurry up Sony if you have any plans to go dslr!

--
Rodger
f707, tcon14b, mcon 35, s9000

Fremiet161702 · Jun 7, 2003

fwiw the 1D has come down a lot in price, and although stlll priced well above the 10D was well worth the difference to me for its versatility.

Fremiet

--
Aesthetics is for the Artist as Ornithology is for the Birds. Barnett Newman

Canon Elan IIe, Sony DSC F717, Canon 1D, Mamiya RB67
Canon 50mm 1.4, 100mm macro, 70-200L, 17-40mmL, Sigma 50-500 and an instamatic

KennyG · Jun 7, 2003

I am one of those who have already made the change. My last SLR was back in 1990 (Canon A1) and I don't think that influenced me. I was very early into the digital scene (I always seem to be at the bleeding edge of technology) and I have/had no intention of ever going back to film.

My reasons to move - I need a much bigger reach (750mm+) than the F717 can give. True TTL flash. The ability to adjust the image at a lower level (RAW). Wider choice of lenses. Oh heck, I could go on.

Will I part with the F717 - No, I use it for IR (10D is useless in this area), night shots and as a general purpose camera. It makes a reasonable back-up to the 10D and sits alongside it in my Lowepro backpack.

The 10D has shaken the cages of all the digital camera manufacturers with high-end models. I would not have made the move to DSLR if it hadn't come along at the right price and I am sure others feel the same.

I am enjoying my 10D - Oh yes!!!!

--
Kenny

DSC-F717 - WA TC F1000
EOS-10D - A lot of glass - now penniless

Lisa Young74699 · Jun 7, 2003

I'm not a former SLR owner and got into digital photography fall 2000 and only had little point and shoot 35mm cameras before digital photography. Sony's cameras being so user friendly helped me learn a lot before I was ready to buy my 10D.

Lisa

--
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Fremiet161702 · Jun 7, 2003

.....that is a thing of wonder....

Fremiet

--
Aesthetics is for the Artist as Ornithology is for the Birds. Barnett Newman

Canon Elan IIe, Sony DSC F717, Canon 1D, Mamiya RB67
Canon 50mm 1.4, 100mm macro, 70-200L, 17-40mmL, Sigma 50-500 and an instamatic

RichO · Jun 7, 2003

I have the 10D and the Sony 717. I use them for different reasons.

--
RichO

San Antonio, TX
http://www.equipu.com
Can You Meet The Challenge?
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'Life is a dance, Love is the music.'

GeoffB · Jun 7, 2003

The 5MP 7x7 series is almost two years old ... we are probably just a few months from a major upgrade. We'll have to see what they come up with.

Improved performance, features and a potential 8MP sensor could make many consumers rethink buying a DSLR.

I'm more concerned for the STF than for Sony ... we may need a whole new generation of serious amateurs to keep us learning.

It's also interesting that I've seen many more 7x7 cameras in the last month than before ... the price reductions may be selling more cameras.

Geoff

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http://www.pbase.com/geoffb

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