Sony RX10 is interesting for m4/3 users Locked

Started Oct 17, 2013 | Discussions thread
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marike6 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,088
Re: Why should the RX10 be interesting...

jim stirling wrote:

marike6 wrote:

Why should the RX10 be interesting to specifically to m43 users (or interesting at all)?

  • It has a fixed lens 24-200 f/7.6 FF equivalent in DOF (not at all equivalent to the 12-35 2.8 and 35-100 2.8 m43 lenses as the OP implies. Deep DOF, flat images. Kind of like shooting with a 14-42 kit on m43. Worse actually.

You forgot to mention that the same equivalence rules apply to mFT .The 12-35mm and 35-100mm have an effective FF aperture as a FF F/5.6 while costing £1750. F/2.8 on the RX10 has the same DOF control as F/3.78 ,meaning we need a mFT lens that covers 12-100mm at a constant F/3.78.

The 14-42 you mention is fractionally faster at the wide end though the wide end is 28mm FF equiv AOV as opposed to the 24mm FF equiv AOV of the RX10. At its long end which isn't really very long compared to the RX10 it is more than a stop slower even with equivalence taken into the equation.

Almost the exact same arguments can be made by Nikon/Sony/Pentax APS shooters though their sensors actually have a more significant advantage over mFT's best regarding DR and colour depth then mFT has over the Sony.|0/%28brand%29/Sony/%28appareil2%29/865|0/%28brand2%29/Nikon/%28appareil3%29/793|0/%28brand3%29/Olympus

  • It's not at all "Micro", in fact it's larger than the Panasonic G6, and close to double the weight (more on size and weight later)

The G6 does not nave a metal construction nor is it weather sealed and you neglected to include the 12-100mm F/3.7 lens/lenses

  • It is more expensive than any m43 camera except the EM-1

Again you forgot about the lens

  • Not a m43 system camera, so all your m43 flashes, lenses, remote releases are useless with it, and vice versa.
  • Price of $1300 is the price of the Panasonic 35-100 f/2.8, a lens that will work with ALL your m43 current and future m43 cameras (a far better investment long term, and quicker way to improve your images than messing around with a pricey bridge camera).

The cheapest weather sealed camera with built in EVF is the E-M5 covering the lens range with lenses at least as equivalently fast is not going to be that cheap or compact. Are you sure that a lens that is less than a stop faster in equivalent terms will be that huge an advantage

  • Weight - the RX10 weighs 813 g (1.76 lbs) almost as much as my D800, but without the IQ or the ability mount a proper 24-70 f/2.8 or 70-200 f/2.8 lens (or any other lens). The RX10's weight is also approaching double the weight of an APS-C DSLR like the D5300, again without the IQ, low-light / high ISO ability, and no option to mount large aperture primes or long telephoto lenses. For years people here have been talking about "boat anchor DSLRs", now all of the sudden the OP is making the case for an extremely expensive "fixed lens boat anchor", but with kind of uninteresting DOF control?

Once again you are forgetting the lenses .While enthusiasts such as folk like us who post on camera forums will indeed make use of a wider selection of lenses than most casual photographers. Looking through my photos I would have to say that a very large percentage of them are taken within a 24-200mm effective FF AOV though I do have lenses as wide as my Nikon 14-24mm and as long as my 100-300mm Panasonic .A look through any of the large photo hosting sites such as Flickr will very quickly show you just how high a percentage of most peoples shooting is done well within this range

  • I've own the RX100 and it's an excellent compact but part of what makes it great is its small size. But even with the RX100's f/1.8 max aperture you need to be quite close to your subject to get good subject/background separation. Same with the 18.5 f/1.8 lens on the Nikon V1. With the 2.7X crop factor of the 1" sensor, even a large aperture f/1.8 lens (the DOF equivalent of f/4.9 in FF terms) is not all that thrilling. An f2.8 lens on a 1" sensor camera is not something that would make me rush to pre-order, but I suppose everybody has different needs.

The same can be said for mFT when compared to larger formats the much loved 75mm F/1.8 becomes an effective F/3.6 hardly an inspiring portrait lens on FF. I nearly never shoot at high ISO and on the few occasions when I need it I would use my FF gear. Same with regards to shallow DOF

For a lot of my shooting between 24-200mm, under 800 ISO in reasonable light I think the RX10 is a very attractive proposition. Obviously it is not a system camera and what you get is what you will be stuck with. However compared to what has come before it is a definite step up in image quality. It is not compact compared to the likes of the RX100 but it offers so much more.

  • Larger than the Panasonic G6 (See link below for a size comparison).

Panasonic G6 vs Sony RX10 size comparison

Price aside I can sort of see how some might be interested the RX10, but I have no idea how it relates at all to m43 (the 12-35 2.8 and 35-100 2.8 analogy is tenuous at best).

For me mFT was bought initially as a small lightweight companion to my FF DSLR though GAS has gradually taken over and I have bought into the system far more than I probably intended .I must admit this camera is quite tempting to me not as a direct replacement for mFT by any stretch .Though I am seriously considering getting rid of my mFT zooms and just keeping the primes 17mm F1.8, 25mm F1.4, 45mmf1.8, 60mm macro and the 75mm F1.8.

I agree with much of what you've written.  But my whole point is that the RX10 is no more interesting to the typical m43 user than to any other system camera user (in fact because of the larger DSLR form factor, size and weight of the RX10, it seems like it would be LESS interesting).  Personally, large aperture primes like the 20 f1.7, 25 f/1.4, 45 f/1.8 and 75 f/1.8 and small fast focusing bodies (some like the GH2 and GH3 with superb still AND video quality) are the main draw of m43.  For applications where large aperture telephoto lenses and robust AF tracking are a requirement, I think other systems are more appropriate, but there are plenty of variable aperture lenses in m43 that can cover longer focal lengths (much longer than 200mm) on a budget.

I do not see the comparison between the 24-200mm RX10 lens and the Panasonic pair as all that tenuous , A 12-35mm F/3.7 and a 35-100mm F/3.7 constant aperture pairing would still not be a bad set up on mFT

"Tenuous" as in weak, the connection that the OP is trying to make between m43 and the RX10 because of the $1300 Panasonic 35-100 f/2.8 is weak at best.  He's saying that because the Panasonic 35-100 f/2.8 is an expensive lens, m43 users can run out an buy any equally expensive RX10 to cover 200mm, and use a m43 body with primes for the shorter focal lengths.  I cannot think of a worse plan than that, not because I think the Sony RX10 is a bad camera or because of the price, but because it makes no sense to carry two totally unrelated bodies from two different manufactures.  As I said, Panasonic is going to release a budget version of the 35-100 f/2.8, and Olympus will likely begin to release more fast zooms in the coming months.  But it doesn't make much sense to buy into an expensive CSC system, and add another expensive camera with a smaller sensor to fill some perceived deficiency in lenses.

 marike6's gear list:marike6's gear list
Nikon Coolpix P330 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GH2 Nikon D800 Fujifilm X-E1 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH +7 more
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