GH3 low light indoor acrobatic show

Started Sep 1, 2013 | Discussions thread
Kim Letkeman
Kim Letkeman Forum Pro • Posts: 33,428
Re: GH3 low light indoor acrobatic show

Pete Berry wrote:

Kim Letkeman wrote:

Pete Berry wrote:

Kim Letkeman wrote:

Strange to get flack for ignoring your post for 5 hours in the middle of a long weekend

Anyway, I find these to be rather over exposed. I shoot a lot of concerts stealthily and handling the extreme dynamic range of hot lights on some parts of the stage and no light on others is really tricky.

I have come up with a method that seems to work really well for any camera that has manual control -- even the tiniest of sensors ... as documented here:

Scroll down to the section marked "shooting concerts" ...

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Strange, I find these images about as well exposed as possible under the terrible circus lighting conditions - certainly not overall overexposed. Well done, HiFi!

We're each more or less sensitive to exposure issues. I do not like burnt highlights. If you don't mind them then by all means shoot that way.

I would not sacrifice significant shadow detail in subjects to avoid blown random specular or spot highlights in stage lighting. You obviously choose otherwise.

Rather condescending of you to assume that I am merely complaining about specular highlights at light sources. No one is that dumb ... but you are definitely that arrogant.

But I do find your blog stage shots all significantly underexposed, except for the last, particularly the three "portraits" with plugged, noisy shadows. And none of your examples show the stage lighting challenges the OP faced except for overall intensity.

Are you using a calibrated monitor? Because I am, and it sounds like you have a terrifically incorrect white point. These images probably look fine to you, although you should check the areas of detail-free grey as those are detail free white on my monitors

You seem confused about white point, which governs monitor tint, but not the white saturation level you are referring to - a totally separate deal that is the luminance input point at which your monitor saturates to white.

I was referring to the combination of contrast, brightness and gamma settings that decide how pure white (255) is displayed on your monitor ... that part of the histogram is called the white point in Photoshop et al.

You are referring to the occasional reference to white point for a monitor that means "color temperature" as in the appearance of white. That you characterize me as confused is more that very appealing arrogance you are displaying.

If you are referencing the performer in the white shirt in images #1 and 2 and you are seeing the shirt as detail-free white (I see it as greyish with some variation and detail)

Exactly. It is white, as it is blown out by the lights. There is no detail in huge patches, and that is what determines that it is blown out, despite his software's manipulation of the actual white point in the image (reducing blown out areas to light grey does not hide the blow out, just so you know.)

then you have a serious problem with monitor reaching white saturation in the 230-40 range rather that at 255/255/255.

No, I can see the difference between 254 and 255 on Lagom. But 255 is a bright white, wheras you can see the differences, but they are dull on your monitor, apparently.

Measuring the shirt color numbers in PS6 with a point sample never gets out of the mid 230's - very light grey. In fact, it's hard to find truly blown highlights to any degree by measurement in any of the OP's images.

It is a trivial thing to dial the image's white point down in Lightroom, for example, by sliding the "whites" slider to the left. While this takes the edge off, the image still retains the detail-free blown out look, for anyone who is able to see such things and understand what they are looking at.

You might find the Lagom monitor white saturation test very revealing:

As I mention above, I check my calibration on that site.

From you comments, I suspect you will see only white in most of the checkerboards.

I see all the details ... you see it all too, but it is grey. I see white to grey.

Which would make you very sensitive to highlights!

I am sensitive to BS and arrogance. Oh yeah, and detail free areas that are excessively white.

I see the grey all the way down to level 254, as it should be. My black sat. is not quite as good, separating down to a still pretty good level 3. And yes, my monitor is meticulously calibrated for printing with an excellent print/monitor match - including highlight and shadow detail - under my 4700K Solux viewing light...

Well, perhaps your initial conditions are incorrect then. Consider adjusting your brightness and contrast to get a better looking "white" ...

Perhaps he might have some tips for you?

Snotty comment acknowledged. You are very clever, at least according to you.

Clever enough to see the probable motivation for your dismissive post,

It was not dismissive at all. It was instructive. And it remains correct.

On the other hand, your arrogance shines through, but you are clearly describing your monitor's brightness and contrast issues and your own inability to understand how detail free grey only masks blow outs.

which was to bathe him in the brilliance of your blog when it's obvious to me, and probably others, that he has handled the complexities of stage lighting better than most of your much less demanding, but technically poorer examples show.

Yawn. Take your shots. I'm sure it makes you happy, so have at it.

Get your monitors calibrated as there is no point having this discussion if you are seeing what you say you are seeing ...


Calibration is not just about running the tools ... the initial conditions matter just as much. Think about it ... even try it.

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