Win8 vs Win7

Started Jun 10, 2013 | Discussions thread
theswede Veteran Member • Posts: 4,009
Re: stick with Win 7 if possible...

Windows Key + C, click on search. Or Windows key to get to the Start Screen, move mouse to right to bring up Charms, and select search. You will see this:

I. Do. Not. Know. The. Name.

And I never will.

Plus, I have no Windows key. And I will not drag around a spare keyboard just to have one.

With exception to it being left to right instead of top to bottom, it is in the same hierarchy you would see in 7.

Except there is no dig down hierarchy, with the company providing the gadget I an looking for the control software for first, and the second level being the task the software is intended to be used for, and the third the cryptic named software and its documentation, usually maybe 5-6 links. For about a dozen companies, each with a varying number of tasks.

Dumping these links in the start screen and expecting me to remember what the actual unituitively named applications (and documents) simply does not work.

The computer is excellent at organizing and remembering. Why is it dumping that task on me? I have better things to keep my mind on. That cognitive load does not help me in the least. I'm fully occupied with working, having to deal with a petulant start screen provides me with no benefits, no extra pay, and loses me time instead of saves it.

If the application installation creates a Start folder, it will be under that "group" name, just like 7. The difference is that with 7 you have to view into those folders via highlighting or clicking and here it is already expanded.

And that expansion makes it in practice impossible to navigate properly. A huge slab of icons. What good does that do me?

Is that too hard? See, it isn't lost. The hierarchy is still there.

Yes, that is definitely too hard. It wastes cognitive effort and time, and shows me hundreds of applications I am not interested in when I am looking for those from only one equipment provider. And the hierarchy is not prominent, it is FLAT.

Not to mention, the Windows key? Really?

You can and be more organized, or you can do what I showed you above and use the older layout Microsoft used.

Except I can't, since it's a full screen, flat organization which takes over from what I am doing and does not let me focus on what I am working on.

You just have more options now. While you prefer to organize by manufacturer, I prefer to organize by what they do.

I have more options which do not do what I want at the expense of the option of doing what I want. Yeah, that's better.

Sounds like then you have a problem. If you don't know what they are named, then how do you know what you are looking for.

Yes, I have a problem. That is the entire point I am making. And you have not helped solve it in the slightest.

I know what I'm looking for because I know the manufacturer of the equipment I am connecting to and the task I am going to perform on it. I dive into that in the start menu while keeping the document on what I will do open to guide me, and I click the correct program.

Dead simple. And requires me to see the document while navigating the start menu to the correct hierarchical position. Which Windows 8 provides me with precisely zero options on how to do.

You mean just like in Windows 7? Wow!

Wow! Sarcasm, there's a feature I have never seen before.

Shows me how well you know Windows.

Good for a browser and Outlook. Not so good for engineering software.

Huh? So are you assuming that your apps will be full screen only in Windows 8?

What does that have to do with pinning programs to the task bar?

So I take it your book shelves organize themselves too as well as everything in your house?

I use ebooks. Organize once and it's done. Besides, my books are my hobby, not something I get paid by the hour to do.

Or do you not have time for that either?

Non sequitur. You propose I waste my paid time, lowering my productivity, to perform tasks my computer previously performed for me. Will Microsoft pay me for those lost hours?

By dragging tiles around you can group them into columns.

I work with dozens of new computers every year. I have no time to sit and play lego with them. And I routinely get new versions of equipment management software. Often I need multiple versions installed at the same time.

Now all that arranges automatically. You're actually, seriously, proposing I waste my customer's time sitting manually playing around with icons every time I install something new? What does that gain my customer? Or me?

So the applications don't have names? They only have their executable filename to go by?

Sometimes. And sometimes not. And I will not sit down to memorize that as it provides me with zero benefit, especially considering the applications often come in new versions and change.

Sounds like a quality control issue, but easy enough to turn on. That's not Microsoft's fault, nor is it Windows 8's.

Regardless, it's been on about 50/50. And what was discuseed was how often safe boot is switched on.

Nope. How does someone know that swiping down on iOS brings up the notification bar

Because of the little notifications you're grabbing and sliding down when you do that. That's how I learned it; I was like "what is that?", grabbed and pulled it down, and there were my notifications. Visual cues at work.

or when two or when a hold hand is used you can switch between apps, etc.?

What does that even mean?

Those aren't natural ideas, but ones that people had to learn or stumble upon.

The point is that it's either a natural idea or has visual cues. Windows 8 eschews both.

iOS and Android are just as confounding to close apps on.

They both have a close button. Which does not move. It's physical.

iOS you have to double tap the home button then press and hold an app icon in the bottom.

Or just press the close button.

Android you have to go into the menus a few layers deep to kill anything.

Or press the close button.

Windows keeps it resident in the background and will close it automatically if not used and the memory needs to be freed up.

Or press the ... oh wait, there isn't one!

That is exactly how they are confusing.

Really?!? You do realize it is only the Metro apps that do this, not everything. And those apps are tailored to work fine in full screen.

And when I normally do not use them, dealing with one which pops up in the way of my work is frustrating as it lacks cues on how to handle it.

Provided you have one. My keyboard doesn't. I have no use for one.

I guess your SOL then.


Again, that's your problem that shouldn't be extended upon others.

It's a feature, not a bug. A Windows key is a wasted key. And it's hardly unique to me. Next time you're taking a stroll through a production line, look at the PC's there. See how many have a windows key.

Every new Windows PC out there has a Windows Key and they have had Windows Keys on keyboards since the early 90's.

You really need to look at more keyboards. Especially industrial and point of sale models. Good luck finding a Windows key there.

And yet you think that the older Windows were this natural?

I think no computer system at all is "natural".

Really? Try again, it was more likely due to years of using it that you became familiar with where everything is at and how it functions and not because it had visual cues or skeumorphic expectations.

Of course familiarity comes from long time use. But getting started was easy, because there were obvious menus, icons, close buttons and such.

When those are gone there are no cues on how to handle the software. That means I have to keep non obvious gestures memorized. That is cognitive load - the very thing computers are intended to reduce - providing zero benefit.

The older Windows were NOT that obvious on how to get the most out of them.

Moving the goal posts are we? The point is doing BASIC TASKS, like closing a window. If you consider that "getting the most out of them" I have to wonder what you spend most of your days doing. Organizing start screens?

Which is good, but hardly anything most people get much out of.

I beg to differ. I have found it extremely useful.

Which makes you not most people. Point remains.


 theswede's gear list:theswede's gear list
Konica Minolta Maxxum 5D Sony SLT-A37 Sony Alpha NEX-6 Sony a7 Sony a5000 +7 more
Post (hide subjects) Posted by
Keyboard shortcuts:
FForum PPrevious NNext WNext unread UUpvote SSubscribe RReply QQuote BBookmark MMy threads
Color scheme? Blue / Yellow