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Canon eating into NEX's share with the new 100D?

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What an odd entry from Canon. Its obvious they don't really know how to compete in the mirrorless camera market - their EOS M is feeble at best. So their second best idea is "to do what we do only smaller?" I have to seriously wonder about the ergonomics here. Will a smaller SLR form factor "work" scaled down? Are people's hand shrinking? I have my doubts.

If you already own a bunch of Canon glass that might be a reason to get one of these little fellers, but why? Because you are sick and tired of being able to access camera features from buttons on the camera body? Because you can't wait to peer through an even smaller pentamirror display? Finally, this camera may be smaller in height and width but not depth as it uses existing Canon lenses and so must maintain the proper register distance.

On the other hand if it wakes SONY up to the fact they need to produce some higher quality glass, I'm all for it. Dear Sony - we got enough camera bodies now - how about some really decent lenses?

--
Phil
www.PhilCorlis.com
www.FindingBritain.com
 
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The only question will be: by how much?

I think that this small camera will eat more from Canons own DSLRs than from the Nex range. And it might be harder for the DSLR lookalike mirrorless cameras, as they are allready larger then the Nex cameras.

In the end you will have mirrorless cameras dominating over DSLRs and only the high end cameras wll be mainly DSLRs

But it will take some years before it will happen.
 
For telephoto lenses, sensor size and F-number drives lens size. But for wide lenses, flange distance drives lens size and Hogan seems to ignore this fact IMO. So I would argue Sony still has a strong size argument against this Canon (which will always be stuck with large wide-angle lenses.

Also, given the AF performance of the N1, I'd say eventually mirror design will be a liability for focus speed--not an asset.

However I agree with his criticism of Sony's priorities. Their effort in creating a FF NEX is a stupid waste of time IMO. They need to be pouring cash into developing good zoom lenses (not just new ranges like 16-85, 18-135, 100-400, etc..), but also version II of existing zooms with better optics.

If they can make their zooms in the 100-200mm range with the same center sharpness as m43 lenses of the same F/L, then they can even eliminate the size advantage of m43 using higher resolution sensors and crop mode.

Bart
 
I can't see it affecting mirrorless. Even though its the smallest DSLR it is still too big.

Nikon D3200 is pretty small as well and I don't see that coming up as an alternative to Nex and Fuji, Oly in threads.

Greg.
 
Some people who think that traditional DSLRs are too big, will find the Canon 100D/SL1 to be "small enough".

Zillion's of Canon DSLR lenses are available. No adapter required.

Some people prefer an Optical View Finder.

Since it's a DSLR, it should have very good autofocus performance.

DPR's review states that the Canon T4i/650D has "a touchscreen interface that is intuitive and efficient". The same should be true of the 100D / SL1

If it's a close decision, the Canon brand name is likely to win.

Why buy a Sony, when you can get a Real Canon DSLR in a fairly compact package. :-)
 
"Why buy a Sony, when you can get a Real Canon DSLR in a fairly compact package."

Take a closer look at the depth of the camera, as well as size. It's as compact as a cantaloupe.

What is the camera market today? Basically, it's overwhelmingly an iPhone market. The majority of people simply don't want to carry a big camera.

The beauty of the NEX line is that is puts an APS-C sensor into a darn near pocketable camera. For the majority of buyers, the kit lens does 90% of what they could want. Add the 55-200mm, and it's as complete as they want. The quality of images is the jump over iPhone images they want, in a profile compatible with the iPhone.

Will Sony hang onto its lead once Canon and Nikon decide they must compete? My guess is, Sony just might, only if it steps up its R&D. Its sensors are in many DSLRs, as is its firmware. Remember Sony's relationship with Zeiss in the early 2000s - the f2-2.2 zoom on my DSC-F717 was and is spectacular, as was its images, even if its EVF was crude by today's standards.

The Canon advantage is that it will be in Costco and Sam's Club and BJ's, and able to generate impressive sales there - from those who still want to carry a cantaloupe size camera. If Sony gets similar distribution, it will compete.

What Sony ***REALLY*** needs is Apple's advertising agency. Simply presented, to the iPhone audience, Sony will put Canon and Nikon in the camera world where HP and Dell are today in the computer world.
 
justmeMN said:
justmeMN wrote:

Some people who think that traditional DSLRs are too big, will find the Canon 100D/SL1 to be "small enough".

Zillion's of Canon DSLR lenses are available. No adapter required.

Some people prefer an Optical View Finder.

Since it's a DSLR, it should have very good autofocus performance.

DPR's review states that the Canon T4i/650D has "a touchscreen interface that is intuitive and efficient". The same should be true of the 100D / SL1

If it's a close decision, the Canon brand name is likely to win.

Why buy a Sony, when you can get a Real Canon DSLR in a fairly compact package. :-)
Click to expand...
Articulating screens and large, bright, 100% coverage viewfinders are so yesterday, eh? I'm glad Canon is taking a stand on such nonsense features in an $800 camera.... :)
 
SQLGuy said:
SQLGuy wrote:
SQLGuy said:
Kings1 wrote:

Canon has never had a Nex type camera and they will have to play catch up to get one.
Click to expand...
Why isn't the EOS-M a "Nex-type" camera?

--
Nex-7 with kit lenses, Contax G 35, and a number of legacy lenses (mostly Canon FD)
Click to expand...
It isn't a Nex camera because it's a DSLR plain and simple. Canon has made no move to get into the Nex type camera like Samsung or Nikon.
 
Tom2572 said:
Tom2572 wrote:
Tom2572 said:
Kings1 wrote:
Tom2572 said:
SQLGuy wrote:
Tom2572 said:
Kings1 wrote:

Canon has never had a Nex type camera and they will have to play catch up to get one.
Click to expand...
Why isn't the EOS-M a "Nex-type" camera?

--
Nex-7 with kit lenses, Contax G 35, and a number of legacy lenses (mostly Canon FD)
Click to expand...
It isn't a Nex camera because it's a DSLR plain and simple. Canon has made no move to get into the Nex type camera like Samsung or Nikon.
Click to expand...
You know what the "R" in DSLR stands for don't you? Or do you? Maybe you should look it up first and get back to us... :)
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I don't worry about the R at all, as my big camera is a SLT, or Single Lens Translucent. lol

My little camera is my Nex has no mirror, so mirrorless compact camera system. Yep I know those pesty little meanings... :)
 
justmeMN said:
justmeMN wrote:

Since it's a DSLR, it should have very good autofocus performance.
Click to expand...
That's only the current state of technology. I believe the sensor-based PDAF will not take long to eliminate that gap or at least narrow it to irrelevance. The Nikon 1 system is already there.

Bart
 
I think that it's wrong to assume that this is a direct frontal assault by Canon against mirrorless cameras. It's been said plenty of times already: this thing is no competition for (most) MILCs on the size front. It seems instead that it's more of a way to nudge people sitting on the fence between mirrorless and SLR over to Canon's side.

If anything, it's Canon's attempt to do what Pentax tried with the K-01 - almost a bridge between mirrorless and SLR. In fact, the SL1 is very similar in size...only a centimeter taller, negligibly thicker (if you look on camerasize.com it's obvious that the rear viewfinder outcrop accounts for much of the thickness difference), and actually noticeably less wide and substantially lighter than the K-01. Plus it's got SLR-level AF, a viewfinder, and isn't hideous! Obviously it doesn't hold a lot of appeal for most folks on here (myself included), but it's definitely not without its merits.

Also, if Canon were to release an SLR version of their 22mm pancake, this would start to look much more attractive...
 
justmeMN said:
justmeMN wrote:

Some people who think that traditional DSLRs are too big, will find the Canon 100D/SL1 to be "small enough".

Zillion's of Canon DSLR lenses are available. No adapter required.

Some people prefer an Optical View Finder.

Since it's a DSLR, it should have very good autofocus performance.

DPR's review states that the Canon T4i/650D has "a touchscreen interface that is intuitive and efficient". The same should be true of the 100D / SL1

If it's a close decision, the Canon brand name is likely to win.

Why buy a Sony, when you can get a Real Canon DSLR in a fairly compact package. :-)
Click to expand...
It is still a big package when you add those lenses. I doubt that an optical VF can be made much smaller because if the mirror/mirror box gets smaller, the image gets too dull. I'd be reasonably sure that Canon tries to get the mirror as small as possible and this is on the limit. If you want an optical vf you want them as big as possible. Without having looked through the VF it is difficult to know but (and I still like optical vf) I suspect that I wouldn't be happy with the one on this camera. Spoilt by the A900.

For those of us who have experienced the advantages of tilting screens, the lack on this camera would be a deal breaker.-

I think this canon may sell to newbie photographers. It is unlikey to appeal to those who have already used a Nex and Sony is well enough established with the Nex to have a solid base that the Canon wont threaten. But I don't regards the Nex range as suitable for newbie photographers anyway so if the Canon appeals to nebies I wouldn't see it as a problem for Sony It might also appeal to existing Canon users who have a collection of Canon glass and want a smaller body, but again, given the existing lenses, the size gain just doesn't seem to offer enough. And this group of Canon users would probably want a more sophisticated model anyway.

Overall it smacks more of an indication that Canon is getting worried about smaller cameras and id nervous about their potential to their traditional lens users, so they have tried for a compromise and are keeping their fingers crossed.-


Mike Fewster
Adelaide Australia
 
Is this allowed? Part of my post on the same subject in the m43 forum:

"Tom Hogan fails to really discuss the real news; the imminent explosion of FF compact cameras in the marketplace. And some of these new cameras will retain the the ability to offer dual-lens solutions. Sony FF+ e-mount hybrid. That was scheduled to be announced last week but wasn't for some unknown reason. Canon's had it since 2003 with EF/EFS hybrid cameras (the Digital Rebel 300D...they only needed to miniaturize. (Tom does mention the new EOS B.) The forthcoming Olympus 4/3 + m43 hybrid camera. The Panasonic m43/FF hybrid."

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I fail to see how this will have any impact at all on NEX, given the existence of the Sony A3x line that Sony are apparently discontinuing, presumably because it was struggling with the explosion in mirrorless. The upgrade crowd don't need OVFs (indeed this makes the learning curve steeper), and DSLR live view is horrible to work with for most people used to point-and-shoot simplicity. Mirrorless gets these things down right. If anything, Canon are actually shooting themselves in the foot as this was a waste of money that crowds out the direction they should have been going in, which is the EVF-RF-style mirrorless. I can't see how these two cameras can sit within the Canon ecosystem in a way that will complement each other and/or or won't be a huge waste of their own resources to develop both lines.

Dead on arrival is my prediction
 
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