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Is anyone really happy with glossy/luster on 2200?

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John Harrison82293

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This is not meant to be a flame etc. I am just trying to get information before I purchase a printer this week. After reading all the wonderful reports about the 2200 I was ready to rush out and purchase one. **** Thomas was kind enough to print several of my images on different papers and send them to me. I have been printing on an 890 using HWM or Premium Glossy for a year and a half and other epson photo printers for a long time.

I had heard about the bronzing issues with the glossy/luster papers but didn't really know how it affected the image until I saw it.

I was wanting a printer that I could print 12x18 on for sale. I have been having them done by a local professional lab and they are excellent.

My observations from the prints I received from **** left me with the impressions that the 2200 excells with matte papers.

The glossy prints were a different story. There is no way I could sell prints on these papers. The bronzing was somewhat of an issue in the lighter areas but also the way light reflected off the print was extremely bothersome. When I look at my dye prints or any of my ilfachrome or film prints the reflected light was pretty much the color of the source light. On the 2200 glossy prints the light changes color depending on what colored area it hits the print. I may try to frame the one sent to me on glossy film and see how it performs under real world conditions.
Any help or constructive suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
John R.
 
John Harrison said:
This is not meant to be a flame etc. I am just trying to get
information before I purchase a printer this week. After reading
all the wonderful reports about the 2200 I was ready to rush out
and purchase one. **** Thomas was kind enough to print several of
my images on different papers and send them to me. I have been
printing on an 890 using HWM or Premium Glossy for a year and a
half and other epson photo printers for a long time.
I had heard about the bronzing issues with the glossy/luster papers
but didn't really know how it affected the image until I saw it.
I was wanting a printer that I could print 12x18 on for sale. I
have been having them done by a local professional lab and they are
excellent.
My observations from the prints I received from **** left me with
the impressions that the 2200 excells with matte papers.
The glossy prints were a different story. There is no way I could
sell prints on these papers. The bronzing was somewhat of an issue
in the lighter areas but also the way light reflected off the print
was extremely bothersome. When I look at my dye prints or any of my
ilfachrome or film prints the reflected light was pretty much the
color of the source light. On the 2200 glossy prints the light
changes color depending on what colored area it hits the print. I
may try to frame the one sent to me on glossy film and see how it
performs under real world conditions.
Any help or constructive suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
John R.
Click to expand...
Metamarism is a problem ( color changes in different light), no question, but with good profiling it is minimized. The key is to print for the displayed light source or someplace kind of neutral.

Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl just about eliminates bronzing ( overlayed ink and dead areas of raw paper left with raized partitioning between ink layers or ink and paper.) The smooth Pearl prints slightly softer than Epsons Semigloss, and slightly warmer, but both metamarism and bronzing are less. With slight slider correction you can get very close to a neutral print right from the standard paper settings in the printer driver for Epson Premium Semigloss ( I find +5 contrast and -3 magenta makes for a real nice print). Sharpening Smooth Pearl up a bit and I wouldn't hesitate to sell these.

Still, in the end pigment has always been about matte papers of some sort and about fine art printing. I don't really, truely see this as a general all purpose photo printer that will work with ease. Yes, you can futs some pretty goo Luster and even some good glossy prints from it, but dye will always lay flatter. Dye is not an option for me, so that means work with this to the best I can get, or use matte, or send out to a lab.

Others here can suggest more papers that respond well to the 2200 regarding bronzing, and they can suggest profiles as well. Unfortunately, only you can determine for yourself if any of this is acceptable for you or your clients.

I'm considering luster coating personally for my Semigloss and Luster prints, though that Smooth Pearl is mighty nice. Also Epson Luster can be pretty nice too, sharper for sure, more metamarism correction required, but no real bronzing except for blown highlights where bare paper shows.

Just as I see this thus far, I'm fairly new to the printer, only into it for a couple of months now.
David
 
David Grabowski said:
John Harrison said:
This is not meant to be a flame etc. I am just trying to get
information before I purchase a printer this week. After reading
all the wonderful reports about the 2200 I was ready to rush out
and purchase one. **** Thomas was kind enough to print several of
my images on different papers and send them to me. I have been
printing on an 890 using HWM or Premium Glossy for a year and a
half and other epson photo printers for a long time.
I had heard about the bronzing issues with the glossy/luster papers
but didn't really know how it affected the image until I saw it.
I was wanting a printer that I could print 12x18 on for sale. I
have been having them done by a local professional lab and they are
excellent.
My observations from the prints I received from **** left me with
the impressions that the 2200 excells with matte papers.
The glossy prints were a different story. There is no way I could
sell prints on these papers. The bronzing was somewhat of an issue
in the lighter areas but also the way light reflected off the print
was extremely bothersome. When I look at my dye prints or any of my
ilfachrome or film prints the reflected light was pretty much the
color of the source light. On the 2200 glossy prints the light
changes color depending on what colored area it hits the print. I
may try to frame the one sent to me on glossy film and see how it
performs under real world conditions.
Any help or constructive suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
John R.
Click to expand...
Metamarism is a problem ( color changes in different light), no
question, but with good profiling it is minimized. The key is to
print for the displayed light source or someplace kind of neutral.

Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl just about eliminates bronzing (
overlayed ink and dead areas of raw paper left with raized
partitioning between ink layers or ink and paper.) The smooth
Pearl prints slightly softer than Epsons Semigloss, and slightly
warmer, but both metamarism and bronzing are less. With slight
slider correction you can get very close to a neutral print right
from the standard paper settings in the printer driver for Epson
Premium Semigloss ( I find +5 contrast and -3 magenta makes for a
real nice print). Sharpening Smooth Pearl up a bit and I wouldn't
hesitate to sell these.

Still, in the end pigment has always been about matte papers of
some sort and about fine art printing. I don't really, truely see
this as a general all purpose photo printer that will work with
ease. Yes, you can futs some pretty goo Luster and even some good
glossy prints from it, but dye will always lay flatter. Dye is not
an option for me, so that means work with this to the best I can
get, or use matte, or send out to a lab.

Others here can suggest more papers that respond well to the 2200
regarding bronzing, and they can suggest profiles as well.
Unfortunately, only you can determine for yourself if any of this
is acceptable for you or your clients.

I'm considering luster coating personally for my Semigloss and
Luster prints, though that Smooth Pearl is mighty nice. Also Epson
Luster can be pretty nice too, sharper for sure, more metamarism
correction required, but no real bronzing except for blown
highlights where bare paper shows.

Just as I see this thus far, I'm fairly new to the printer, only
into it for a couple of months now.
David
Click to expand...
 
John:

What you describe can be totally eliminated by spraying the prints with a good spray such as Lyson's PrintGuard.

I usually give a print three light coats at 90 degree angle each time to get an even coverage.

Not only does this cover the 3D effect and bronzing, it actually deepens the blacks slightly, giving the prints a little extra punch.

I really prefer Epson Velvet Fine Art for large prints, but if I need the extra black density, the above is my preferred method on Epson Luster (or SemiGlossy).

Bob Snow
 
Bob Harneit said:
Bob Harneit said:
where do you acquire your large size epson velvet?i can't locate it > anywhere.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
First, John: I only spray the luster and/or semiglossy papers. I tried it on matte type papers and could not see any benefit. This was some time ago, though, on 1270 prints...don't know about the 2200 inks.

Bob, As for the 13x19 Velvet, I have gotten several packages directly from Epson. When I needed it, I just started checking their site daily until they had it, and ordered. You can also have them notify you by e-mail.

They are MSRP, but the shipping is minimal, so it isn't too bad a price really.

bob snow
 
on Michael Reichmanns review of the 2200. He noticed the same thing I did about the red river papers with a lot of heavy black in the image. There is a sheen to the black(especailly at angles). I noticed this on the waterfall image that was printed for me on this paper.
John R.
 
John Harrison said:
Since it is keeping air away from the prints by sealing it.
John R.
Click to expand...
Yes John, the spray coatings add life to dye based ink prints for resistance to gas fade. I had been printing to a certain matte paper from a 1200 printer, left open these would fade badly in 6 mo. time. With spray coating ( Krylon Matte), I have one on display that thus far has lasted 18 mo. It stayed out the 6 mo. in open air, then I put it in one of these slip in plastic display frames ( 5x7) and it's still nice.

So on that matte paper I was using the spray Matte Finish coating solely for longevity factors, since then I've found the same coating works to seal out bronzing and other pigment artifacts on resin paper. I would like to try a true luster finish spray, but think I may have to settle on acrylic or high gloss. I've tied the acrylic , not bad, still rather dull though.

Since printing that photo I went with the 1280 and now the 2200, both superior to the 1200 I was using.

David
 
Hi John (and Martin),

If it sheens around the blacks, it usually means that the paper cannot accept those particular colours. I've noticed certain pigment mixes will not dry at all on some inkjet papers, especially indigo.

If that's the case, try Konica QP Premium Photo Gloss/Silk with Photo Black. Its the best gloss/semi-matt papers we've yet tested to date on the 2100/2200. You get very little bronzing with this paper and combined with a custom profile, it should eliminate the problem altogether.

Hope that helps.

best regards,

Jason Chau
Sales Manager
Paperandinks.com
John Harrison said:
on Michael Reichmanns review of the 2200. He noticed the same thing
I did about the red river papers with a lot of heavy black in the
image. There is a sheen to the black(especailly at angles). I
noticed this on the waterfall image that was printed for me on this
paper.
John R.
Click to expand...
 
A dealer in NYC told me that ILFORD GALERIE Classic Pearl is not compatible with the 2200, is this true?
David Grabowski said:
John Harrison said:
This is not meant to be a flame etc. I am just trying to get
information before I purchase a printer this week. After reading
all the wonderful reports about the 2200 I was ready to rush out
and purchase one. **** Thomas was kind enough to print several of
my images on different papers and send them to me. I have been
printing on an 890 using HWM or Premium Glossy for a year and a
half and other epson photo printers for a long time.
I had heard about the bronzing issues with the glossy/luster papers
but didn't really know how it affected the image until I saw it.
I was wanting a printer that I could print 12x18 on for sale. I
have been having them done by a local professional lab and they are
excellent.
My observations from the prints I received from **** left me with
the impressions that the 2200 excells with matte papers.
The glossy prints were a different story. There is no way I could
sell prints on these papers. The bronzing was somewhat of an issue
in the lighter areas but also the way light reflected off the print
was extremely bothersome. When I look at my dye prints or any of my
ilfachrome or film prints the reflected light was pretty much the
color of the source light. On the 2200 glossy prints the light
changes color depending on what colored area it hits the print. I
may try to frame the one sent to me on glossy film and see how it
performs under real world conditions.
Any help or constructive suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
John R.
Click to expand...
Metamarism is a problem ( color changes in different light), no
question, but with good profiling it is minimized. The key is to
print for the displayed light source or someplace kind of neutral.

Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl just about eliminates bronzing (
overlayed ink and dead areas of raw paper left with raized
partitioning between ink layers or ink and paper.) The smooth
Pearl prints slightly softer than Epsons Semigloss, and slightly
warmer, but both metamarism and bronzing are less. With slight
slider correction you can get very close to a neutral print right
from the standard paper settings in the printer driver for Epson
Premium Semigloss ( I find +5 contrast and -3 magenta makes for a
real nice print). Sharpening Smooth Pearl up a bit and I wouldn't
hesitate to sell these.

Still, in the end pigment has always been about matte papers of
some sort and about fine art printing. I don't really, truely see
this as a general all purpose photo printer that will work with
ease. Yes, you can futs some pretty goo Luster and even some good
glossy prints from it, but dye will always lay flatter. Dye is not
an option for me, so that means work with this to the best I can
get, or use matte, or send out to a lab.

Others here can suggest more papers that respond well to the 2200
regarding bronzing, and they can suggest profiles as well.
Unfortunately, only you can determine for yourself if any of this
is acceptable for you or your clients.

I'm considering luster coating personally for my Semigloss and
Luster prints, though that Smooth Pearl is mighty nice. Also Epson
Luster can be pretty nice too, sharper for sure, more metamarism
correction required, but no real bronzing except for blown
highlights where bare paper shows.

Just as I see this thus far, I'm fairly new to the printer, only
into it for a couple of months now.
David
Click to expand...
 
John Harrison said:
Since it is keeping air away from the prints by sealing it.
John R.
Click to expand...
John:

When I first got the 1270 (same inks as 1280/90, there was much ado about cyan ink fading...ultimately, it was determined that ozone and "other pollutants" was the culprit. This was usually called the dreaded orange fade.

Anyway, I do not live in an area that causes this in a few days as some others, but I did a couple of fade tests to confirm what others were saying. I tested, among others, Epson Premium Glossy, Semiglossy, and Luster with and without a protective spray.

For my environment, spraying prints with two of the leading sprays did not extend their life to any great extent with these dye based inks. Again, I do not live in an ozone rich area, so to me this only proved what I had already read from various sources: that spraying the dye based prints did not extend fade protection to any degree. What it did do was to protect the surfaces from handling.

To be fair, I have read a few reports of postive tests, but most agree with my findings.

A good site to research this, if it is still up, is: http://www.meyerweb.net/epson

bob snow
 
Lita Puyat said:
A dealer in NYC told me that ILFORD GALERIE Classic Pearl is not
compatible with the 2200, is this true?
Click to expand...
Correct, you need to buy the Ilford Galerie Smooth Pearl, not the Classic. The classic is not compatible with pigmented inks in general, not just the 2200.
David
 
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