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Fading prints

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Jim McGill

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prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was Epson Photo paper (glossy).

Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the wall about a year.

There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board. The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light but not what I consider extra bright light.

Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a good way to display pictures outside of an album.

Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
 
All Printers using dyes will fade there prints.
Some papers can absorbe UV Light fore some amount.

Going behind Glas is one more methode to eliminate fading for some while if the glas you use can absorbe UV Light.

If you what protected prints use a printer with pigmented Incs. Pigments can handle light (and UV) for a very long period before they will suffer. Prints dont need specal paper.

Go for a Epson 2200 (or 2100 in Europe)

By
Ralph
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
 
Another option is to outfit your 1280 with CIS and use pigment inks. You'll have much greater fade resistance and pay about 1/10 as much for ink. Downside is the need for a custom profile but once that's done you'll get great results.

Regards, Ken

p.s. a place to start with researching this is http://www.mediastreet.com
Ralph McIntosh said:
If you what protected prints use a printer with pigmented Incs.
Pigments can handle light (and UV) for a very long period before
they will suffer. Prints dont need specal paper.

Go for a Epson 2200 (or 2100 in Europe)

By
Ralph
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
I have prints made with a 1270 that have not only faded within a year, but on non-Epson paper, have faded within six months. Only the Matte Heavyweight seems to hold the ink. This is the primary reason I used inkjets only for proofing. (The exception to this is an 1160 setup with archival pigmented quadtone inks specifically for large BW prints.)

In contast to the Epson, I have several "naked" 8x10 prints on the office wall made with a simple HP Photoprinter THREE YEARS ago that still look as vibrant as I recall them emerging from the printer. (I used MIS inks to refills the expensive carts.) Wish I'd kept that thing!

M
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
 
Hi Jim,

Stephen Livick has done a lot of fade testing. Look here:
http://www.livick.com/method/inkjet/pg1.htm

Also search the printing forum for his name. Hope this helps, it's a complicated issue.

Don
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
 
Jim,

I had exactly the same experience. Inkjets are not light-fast, even with the best inks, paper and technique.

For my customers I upload the images and have them printed on Fuji or Kodak machines, producing real silver-halide photographs. No customer complaints about fading.

--
Daniel Payne
Canon D60
http://danieljpayne.com/
 
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
UV is only one consideration in the fading process. There are all kinds of environmental agents that will cause accelerated fading which is why Epson gives their estimates based on a "sealed" print. Under glass and sealed from the back.
 
especially the 20x30' type sizes using the silver-halide process. I use PhotoAccess for everything up to 12x18 - they use a CRTImager/silver halide process and is quite good, but I have been getting ink jet enlargementts for my 18x24 and larger prints and would rather use the same process as PhotoAccess. PhotoAccess is outsourcing their large prints and aren't as good as their smaller inhouse. Thanks
Daniel Payne said:
Jim,

I had exactly the same experience. Inkjets are not light-fast, even
with the best inks, paper and technique.

For my customers I upload the images and have them printed on Fuji
or Kodak machines, producing real silver-halide photographs. No
customer complaints about fading.

--
Daniel Payne
Canon D60
http://danieljpayne.com/
Click to expand...
--
Regards,
JoeMA
http://www.pbase.com/joema/
 
Thanks for all of your help. I now have a better understanding.
Jim
David Goerndt said:
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
UV is only one consideration in the fading process. There are all
kinds of environmental agents that will cause accelerated fading
which is why Epson gives their estimates based on a "sealed" print.
Under glass and sealed from the back.
Click to expand...
 
I'm still using an Epson 1200. I tried coating my prints with a Krylon clear spray with UV protection. I use 2 light coats, and have had several prints hanging without glass over them for over a year, with no apparent fading.

They are never in direct sunlight. Art stores have other sprays that may work even better.

In the meantime, I'm saving for the Epson 2200.
--
Walter K
 
I've read that the reason the Epson's fade is not so much due to UV, but primarily due to exposure to Ozone and other gases in the air that react with their inks. That's why they last longer under glass - less exposure to these gases.
Jim McGill said:
David Goerndt said:
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
UV is only one consideration in the fading process. There are all
kinds of environmental agents that will cause accelerated fading
which is why Epson gives their estimates based on a "sealed" print.
Under glass and sealed from the back.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
some will tell you they use Epson inks with PGPP under glass and they all have faded in two months. And some will tell you that they use Epson ink and PGPP and have 8x10's all over their walls with push pins, and some have been there for three years, and they look identical to when they were printed.

I am in the latter, but I can tell you that they are all right. That's the reason this has been so confusing for so many years. To the largest degree, it depend on your location and the environment in that location.

Bottom line, some fade, some don't.
Jim McGill said:
prints were made on an Epson 1280 with Epson ink carts. Paper was
Epson Photo paper (glossy).
Since printer was purchased on 6/19/01, pictures have been on the
wall about a year.
There are ten 8x10 and ten 4x6 attached to a 40x30 foam core board.
The board is about 15 feet from a glass door so it is in the light
but not what I consider extra bright light.
Epson says a 25 year life needs Color Life paper under glass. They
did not know whether laminate would suffice. I dislike glass over
prints since it glares. Also, it would be difficult to place glass
over this kind of a display. I have a number of foam core boards
around the house with montages of pictures. It, in my opinion is a
good way to display pictures outside of an album.
Naturally, I shall reprint them but, given the 1280 printer, do not
think they should have faded this quickly.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Click to expand...
 
Joe,

Costco.com (Kodak) prints up to 16x20, and it's beautiful with an image from a 6 mega-pixel camera.

ofoto.com (Kodak) prints up to 20x30, and are OK with an image from a 3.25 mega-pixel camera. Should be beautiful with a 6 mega-pixel camera.

--
Daniel Payne
Canon D60
http://danieljpayne.com/
 
Wow, is this ever discouraging. Am I to understand that buying a 2200 wouldn't solve the fading problem? Do all brands of printers have this much problem?

Thank you,
--
Bob
D60, CP5700, CP4500
 
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