100mm Macro - much easier than rings

Hi Don,

Member said:

Not only technically excellent, but artfully composed. Actually,
you got a fairly decent DOF in these shots, I assume because of the
very small apertures you used.

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I appreciate the kind words. The really tight bug shots were generally taken at f/22 to maximize the depth of field. I used 1/200 to minimize camera and subject movement. I wanted to use ISO 100 to minimize noise, and even on a sunny day, with 58 mm of extension, there's just not enough light to do this. That was the reason for supplementing with the 550EX flash.

The only thing I'd do differently now would be to try using the same setup mounted on my monopod. I'd still have enough maneuverability, but that extra stability would really help with more precise focus and motion.

Best regards,

Don
http://www.dlcphotography.net

Member said:

• DL

DonCohen said:

I agree completely - the 100 macro is an awesome lens. And I do
have a small gallery of macro shots using the 100 with extension
tubes, shooting bugs and critters around my backyard. It's
definitely difficult to get decent focus, and hard not to spook the
bugs, but you can get some neat shots with it:

http://www.dlcphotography.net/Macro/MacroFrameSet.htm

So I wasn't implying the Canon 100 with 1:1 mag wasn't a good
thing; just pointing out that people need to be aware of the
working distance issue.

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Don Lashier said:

Dave Lewis said:

I find it difficult to get excited about the globs of grandure you
are able to capture with the longer macro lenses. I have both the
50mm and a 100 mm macro lenses and find even the 50mm lacking in
sufficient depth of field to get an item much smaller than a thumb
in good focus. You need a really small lens to get sufficient depth
of field for really close stuff. I'm wondering if you wouldn't be
much better off with a good sharp wide angle lens and some tubes. I
have been used to my Nikon 950 for macro stuff and am really
spoiled as a result.

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I also was spoiled by the 950
http://www.newportnet.com/demo/macro.htm and while looking forward
to trying macro with my 1D, have been concerned about DOF issues
and which setup will serve the best in this regard. I'm still
pretty fuzzy on the theory of DOF, but my understanding is that for
the same subject size, DOF is going to be about the same, so I'm
not sure a shorter FL lens will help. Perhaps this generalization
doesn't apply for macro work?

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DOF will depend on magnification and aperture only. If you achieve 1:1 magnification, it won't matter whether it comes from using a shorter focal length lens or a longer one. Perspective will be different, but DOF will be identical. This is covered in detail here:

http://www.reasonableexpectations.com/myths/more_depth_of_field.htm

The much smaller sensor of point and shoot digicams seems to increase DOF; but see the following site for clarification of this sometimes confusing subject:

http://www.reasonableexpectations.com/myths/ccdvs35mm/digital_dof_01.htm

So if you want high magnification, you'll have to use a small aperture. Changing focal length will have no effect whatsoever. This makes for challenges in shooting and having enough light, but that's half the fun, right??

For some excellent information on this subject, see Tom Webster's site, Reasonable Expectations:

http://www.reasonableexpectations.com/

Don
http://www.dlcphotography.net

Mike,

I'm starting to become interested in stacking a 50mm to my 100mm macro. How did you attach the lenses?

thanks

Mark

Mike Salzlechner said:

Matt

the macro lens is certainly awesome. Even better macro lens with
extension rings.

We just made a little test.

The 100 Macro plus 2 sets of kenko extension tubes plus a reversed
50 mm 1.4 allows you to take an almost full frame image of one of
the little golden lens contacts which is about 4 times
magnification.

--
Michael Salzlechner
StarZen Digital Imaging
http://www.starzen.com/imaging

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likewise I have the 50 1.8 and the kenko rings.

how DO you get them all hooked up?

m

Bob Jarman said:

Walter, an excellent review on Phils site. Here's the link

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Thanks for the link, Bob. The 1-5X lens sounds interesting but not for the kind of shooting I do. I wouldn't want to invest $800 just to have a lens that is a challenge to find uses for. For the time being I'll continue exploring the combinations I have until I decide whether the 100 macro would work.

--
Walter K

So far i just hand held the 50mm lens reversed in front of the macro but it is certainly not something you want to keep doing.

I am thinking about taking my old 50mm canon FD lens and permanently glue a reversed filter on it with the glass taken out. Could also take two filters and glue them together.

I am sure there are some reversing rings available tho

--
Michael Salzlechner
StarZen Digital Imaging
http://www.starzen.com/imaging

mattfrederick said:

I have to disagree.

Coming from an art background, I'm fascinated by short DOF. Getting
the image to fall off right where you like it is a challenge, and
can add an artistic edge to an otherwise stock image. IMHO of
course. Art is subjective after all.

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That's fair but in all honestly, how many macro pictures do you see of parts of out of focus insects and the centers of flowers and watch parts. Trite is as trite does. Art is a long shot here in my mind.
--
Dave Lewis

Don Lashier said:

• DL

mattfrederick said:

I have to disagree.

Coming from an art background, I'm fascinated by short DOF. Getting
the image to fall off right where you like it is a challenge, and
can add an artistic edge to an otherwise stock image. IMHO of
course. Art is subjective after all.

Click to expand...

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But you see my point was that with a very wide lens and some tubes you can greatly extend the depth of focus. You really should try a Nikon 9xx series of cameras and see just what a tiny lens and a tiny ccd can do with macro. It will astound you. I contend you can come up with something similar with the D30-60 if you use a really short lens.
--
Dave Lewis

"Art is a long shot here in my mind."

Its a difference of perception.

For me, Art is everywhere: whether or not its blurry, sharp, narrow, wide... Not only is it about the composition, but also the content.

The "Tritenes" you speak of is inherenet in all learning processes. I'm positive that you would find it in your own early work if you looked honestly. Its in my early paintings, drawings, sculptures, design and now in my photography. Only with experience do we begin to recognize the cliches. Right now, with my photography, I'm doing some of the cliche images in order to learn more and to see how things are done.

Art is everywhere. It just takes open eyes and mind.

M

--
Be Good Humans.

http://www.theMirrorpool.com
http://www.digart209.org
http://www.mattfrederickdesign.com

Mike Salzlechner said:

So far i just hand held the 50mm lens reversed in front of the
macro but it is certainly not something you want to keep doing.

I am thinking about taking my old 50mm canon FD lens and
permanently glue a reversed filter on it with the glass taken out.
Could also take two filters and glue them together.

I am sure there are some reversing rings available tho

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Reversing rings are available. Alternatively a couple of Cokin type filter holder rings glued together with epoxy resin do the job just as well.

KRs
Chris

But I -have- used a 950 for macro work. I've taken thousands of macros with it ( http://www.newportnet.com/demo/macro.htm ).

But I don't think a WA and tubes is going to get you any greater DOF. You'll just be smack dab up against whatever you're shooting. The reason the Nikon has a greater DOF is because of the smaller sensor size not because of the focal length. The Nikon actually shoots at a relative tele setting, somewhere around 70mm (35mm equiv.) iirc.

Don Cohen's shots show DOF similar to what I got with the 950. I suspect this is because he shot at f22 to f32 while the Nikon tops out around f10.

• DL

Dave Lewis said:

But you see my point was that with a very wide lens and some tubes
you can greatly extend the depth of focus. You really should try a
Nikon 9xx series of cameras and see just what a tiny lens and a
tiny ccd can do with macro. It will astound you. I contend you can
come up with something similar with the D30-60 if you use a really
short lens.
--
Dave Lewis

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Kirk sells the rings for $13 each. You can find them cheaper on ebay if they have the one you are looking for

--
Michael Salzlechner
StarZen Digital Imaging
http://www.starzen.com/imaging