55-250 IS locking up camera on low battery?

Okay, I just got a new 55-250IS and it has locked up my 400D about 4 or 5 times now Each time it locks up after just a couple of pictures. I take a picture and it gets immediately after taking a picture. The display screen goes blank, no response to any buttons including powering off or changing lenses. The only thing that revives it is pulling the battery. Tried different conditions, no problems with other lenses. The battery level had one bar left. Swapped out to a fresh battery and ran off about 50 pictures without a lockup.

Is it just that this lens is harder on power or is this a lens. Bought it from Adorama and not looking forward to having to ship it back.

Thanks,
Tim

It's normal for the camera to stop functioning when the battery is depleted, and one bar means it's pretty well finished. Lithium ion batteries do not provide accurate indication of their charge state as they discharge, it's just the way the chemistry works with them. In addition, these batteries do have a finite life, their performance decreases with time.

Since replacing the battery with one that is fully charged restores normal operation, and you can take multiple photos, it sounds like the issue might be with the battery. Concerning the battery that delivered short performance, was it fully charged? How does it compare with your other battery/batteries?

Lenses that incorporate stabilization will use a little more power than those that do not, as there are 2 motors that are physically moving an optical group. In my experience with Canon lenses there does not seem to be a big difference, and the benefits of stabilization far outweigh a little shorter battery life.

I don't have any experience with the lens you mention, so I don't know what you should expect. However, if mechanically and optically the lens is performing well, what you are experiencing might be normal.

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I experienced this same exact behavior with my 55-250 IS on my xti. It only happened once and I had to pull the battery to get all the lights to go out.

The Battery meter did show 1 bar and a fresh battery fixed the problem.

--
viper_1942

Interesting. Have you run the battery down since then without a problem? How long have you had the lens? Any idea on how many pictures you've taken with it since then?

I'm hoping to avoid sending it back.

I thought maybe it was a 3rd party battery issue but it was a Canon battery rather than one of my spares. May need to go wild with picture taking this weekend to see if I can replicate the problem.

What you just described also happened to me. I just popped the battery out and put it back in and it worked fine. I have also had times where it says I have a low battery, even though I just charged it. Once again, popping out the battery and putting it back in solved the problem. I just bought it a couple weeks ago, do you think it should be returned?

No, I have not let the battery get down that low since.

I got the lens the beginning of March.

--
viper_1942

Have the same lens/Camera and i never experienced this, if it only does it with your 55-250 IS and works fine with other lenses i think you should get it repaired.

One thing is for sure, its NOT normal behaviour unless the battery is so flat that it wont power up the camera after a reset.

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Mdj71 said:

Have the same lens/Camera and i never experienced this, if it only
does it with your 55-250 IS and works fine with other lenses i think
you should get it repaired.

Click to expand...

I've never had it happen with another lens despite having used the Xti on say 6 lenses and about 5000 pictures-pretty much rules out the camera.

Have used the battery on the camera and probably all those lenses for thousands of pictures-pretty much rules out the battery unless it is just getting worn out.

I took another 500 pictures without a problem on a different, fully charged battery but haven't used up the battery to find out if I have a problem again.

The 7 day return period for the online vendor has expired so I might need to deal with Canon or ask if the vendor will make an exception. Makes me wish that I had bought it locally...

Mdj71 said:

One thing is for sure, its NOT normal behaviour unless the battery is
so flat that it wont power up the camera after a reset.

Click to expand...

The battery could still power up the camera and show one bar. It acts as if it has taken the picture but doesn't get started on writing to the card.

Too many people have never had the problem for it to be standard behavior on this lens but this is the one that seems to exhibit this behavior so there might be something systematic in terms of pushing the tolerances.

Would be curious to hear if anyone has seen this problem on other bodies such as the 350 or 450.

Could it be another, much less significant and frequent lens problem than 24-105 or 70-300 issues?

You haven't seen the problem with another battery - this rules out the camera, lens and the other battery.

The specific battery you experience this with is probably near the end of its useful life. It could be the charger not reading its charge state and charging it correctly, although the charger apparently works with the other battery.

It's probably a bad battery, they have a finite life.

--
Best regards,
Doug
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http://thescambaiter.com
Fighting scammers WW for fun & justice

I had 1 or 2 "lock-ups" as well, once it was with the 55-250 IS,
when I put that on the camera, once it could have been the sigma 17-70.

In my cases this was when the battery was low.

Different lenses draw different amounts of current.

If I have the 10-22 on the camera, it probably draws a lot less with
it's fast USM moter, than the 55-250 IS with IS and micromotor.

So, while the camera worked still fine with the 10-22,
when I put the 55-250 IS, it suddenly "died".
Turning off, switching batteries, everything worked again.

I have seen similar things with other electronic equipment:
A Psion PDA would run out of batteries, I would take out the extra compact flash

card, and it would continue to work for a while. The CF card was just draining some of the battery capacity.

While I don't have exact data on the 55-250 IS, I do have the feeling that I
can take fewer shots with this lens than with the other lenses I have.
It might indeed be the IS.

So, if you are on your last legs with the battery, turn off IS,
turn off the screen, use manual focus.
You just might get that extra shot. (though it may be blurred )

In the OP's stated situation, there is a problem when a particular battery is used, and there appears to not be a problem with a different battery. If the problem is repeatable with the suspect battery, and not others, the suspect battery should be replaced.

--
Best regards,
Doug
http://pbase.com/dougj

http://thescambaiter.com
Fighting scammers WW for fun & justice

I have a XTi (forget which number that is). I also have the new 55-250. I've experienced my camera locking up in the fashion described since it was new.

I received the camera in the fall of 07. I got it with the kit lens without IS. Then I upgraded to the IS 18-55 . Just a week ago I got the 55-250 IS. I have two batteries. One from canon and a cheapie.

I've experienced all three lenses with the lockup. So I would rule that out. I also experience the lockup with either battery. Just when they are nearly empty.

So my moral of the story is keep a charged battery handy. I spec'd the dates in case there is a known bad run of these cameras.

ProfessorA said:

The battery could still power up the camera and show one bar. It
acts as if it has taken the picture but doesn't get started on
writing to the card.

Click to expand...

Well, as I wrote in my previous post, I had a PDA, accessing the extra compact flash in that PDA, especailly when writing, would result in a low battery warning. Taking the CF out, I could still use the PDA fine.

A compact flash, especially when writing to it will also draw current.
The bigger the card, the more current it might draw.
Here is a note I found on one card:

During continuous acquisition, it uses just 50 mA and in an idle state, it uses less than 2 mA.
So, writing to the card will increase power consumption. If
your battery is just on the edge, the camera will stop of course.
With one bar left, you have little room to go, just a few pics in my case,
depending what else is running, (IS, screen, autofocus... etc.)

I think this is normal behaviour under the circumstances.

I posted about mine locking up a bit ago....

photonius brings a good point and one I failed to mention. Each time the camera locked up, it was between the time that I released the shutter, and the time it was writing to the card.

I would hear it click, the mirror would raise, then nothing. The image was not on the card, yet the card access light was ON. The only way to get the camera back was to remove the battery.

I bought a card like this: SanDisk Extreme III 4GB

Now I wonder if I should look at a lower power card.....

daguz said:

I posted about mine locking up a bit ago....

photonius brings a good point and one I failed to mention. Each time
the camera locked up, it was between the time that I released the
shutter, and the time it was writing to the card.

I would hear it click, the mirror would raise, then nothing. The
image was not on the card, yet the card access light was ON. The
only way to get the camera back was to remove the battery.

Click to expand...

Ok, I guess I was fortunate that I got the warnings in between pictures,
not during writing.

daguz said:

I bought a card like this: SanDisk Extreme III 4GB

Now I wonder if I should look at a lower power card.....

Click to expand...

I have exactly the same card, SanDisk Exteme III 4GB.

Finding out values for cards seems rather hopeless.
http://www.synchrotech.com/products/compact-flash_01.html
lists just one value 55mA writing, 40mA reading, 0.6 mA idle for
ALL Sandisk cards. I have my doubts a bit about this, but anyways,
these are discontinued cards.
On this page: http://www.synchrotech.com/products/compact-flash_04.html
they specify for compact flash cards:
Power Consumption
Sleep: 0.6mA
Read: 65mA max.
Write: 36 - 125 mA max,
And for the Ultra II they specify:
http://www.synchrotech.com/products/compact-flash_05.html
Power Consumption 3.3 Volts ± 10%
Sleep: 600 µA (Not Busy state for static CMOS)
Reading: 40 mA RMS
Writing: 55 mA RMS
Power Consumption 5 Volts ± 10%
Sleep: 700 uA (Not Busy state for static CMOS)
Reading: 45 mA RMS
Writing: 60 mA RMS

On Sandisks web site you don't find much, except the Ultra II are labelled

as low power consumption (but is that compared to older cards, or to the new Extreme III and IV cards). Nevertheless, I guess very fast cards use more power,
though I just saw teh Extremem IV also advertized as Low power consumption,
whatever that means.

So, you have little choice as customer to control that aspect.

Also, a possibility, is your card from a reputable seller? There are fakes circulating,
and they could have worse performance ratings.

This has become a very interesting and productive thread in trying to understand the problem. Discussions like this are what make enthusiast web sites so helpful.

Just for a clarification, I haven't drained the second battery enough to trigger the potential failure mode and rule out battery dependency. (I'll try to take more shortly to test it out.)

It would be useful if someone that has never observed this failure mode could test it on their 55-250IS. Does it fail smoothly in telling you the battery is discharged or does it lock up?

The current draws look relatively similar for both read and write on many cards compared to their idle states so I wouldn't be surprised if it is memory card dependent. perhaps it is at the point of first accessing the card to check for space (a read operation) rather than a write operation.

In summary, it sounds like I have some experiments to test:

a) Finish running down 2nd battery to see if it fails with original memory card.

b) Test other memory cards on the low battery to see if it fails. (I'll report card names when I have results.)
c) Turn off IS, does it still happen?
d) Turn off autofocus, does it still happen?

Perhaps someone with another body and anyone with multiple cards can see if it is only certain cards.

Interesting that a few posters report it on a couple of other lenses.

Fortunately, the failure mode never seems to corrupt the cards since it happens prior to any write operation. Otherwise, this would be a BIG issue.

Tim

When i am low on battery the battery indicator blinks 3 times before shutting off the camera, then i just have to click the on/off button to off, and back to on again, then it comes back to life.

But usually when my camera shuts itself off, the battery is so low that it will only stay on for maybe 20-30 seconds, due to no power,
after i turn it back on.
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ProfessorA said:

This has become a very interesting and productive thread in trying to
understand the problem. Discussions like this are what make
enthusiast web sites so helpful.

Just for a clarification, I haven't drained the second battery enough
to trigger the potential failure mode and rule out battery
dependency. (I'll try to take more shortly to test it out.)

It would be useful if someone that has never observed this failure
mode could test it on their 55-250IS. Does it fail smoothly in
telling you the battery is discharged or does it lock up?

Click to expand...

I have a 400D, firmware 1.1.0,
this might also be important information.

ProfessorA said:

The current draws look relatively similar for both read and write on
many cards compared to their idle states so I wouldn't be surprised
if it is memory card dependent. perhaps it is at the point of first
accessing the card to check for space (a read operation) rather than
a write operation.

Click to expand...

actually, access times are very different between jpg and RAW. I think battery life has to be shorter when shooting RAW.
Just something else to consider.

ProfessorA said:

In summary, it sounds like I have some experiments to test:
a) Finish running down 2nd battery to see if it fails with original
memory card.
b) Test other memory cards on the low battery to see if it fails.
(I'll report card names when I have results.)
c) Turn off IS, does it still happen?
d) Turn off autofocus, does it still happen?

Click to expand...

c & d should not lock up the camera, I hope, just reduce battery life.
well, normally the camera should shut off gracefully anyway,
but I am not sure a foolproof method can be implemented on the software side.

ProfessorA said:

Perhaps someone with another body and anyone with multiple cards can
see if it is only certain cards.

Interesting that a few posters report it on a couple of other lenses.

Fortunately, the failure mode never seems to corrupt the cards since
it happens prior to any write operation. Otherwise, this would be a
BIG issue.

Tim

Click to expand...

Described lock up happens on my 400D with both 55-250IS and 18-55IS, with 2 different batteries, and with 2 different CF cards. So, seems to be a body thing more than anything else. Have had it happen with 2 bars left on the battery meter as well as 1 bar.

Is this a fault or is it normal behaviour?

surf1959 said:

Described lock up happens on my 400D with both 55-250IS and 18-55IS,
with 2 different batteries, and with 2 different CF cards. So, seems
to be a body thing more than anything else. Have had it happen with 2
bars left on the battery meter as well as 1 bar.

Is this a fault or is it normal behaviour?

Click to expand...

Yes, it could be body related, more specifically might also depend on the firmware (i.e. the software in the camera). A firmware update might fix it, or cause it, or it might not make a difference at all.
Which version is yours?.

As mentioned, think about the problem. The camera is supposed to detect how much power is left in the battery, it's not that precise a measurement. The 400D in particular has a relatively "weak" battery, you may have noticed that Canon put a much stronger battery in the 450D. Also, compared to older cameras, the 400D has a stronger processor than the 350D, so it probably uses more power.

Now, the battery warning will kick in when the power reaches a certain low limit.

If it so happens that - also a question of battery age and how well it still holds charge - that you have a rather big power load - e.g., you just took a picture, IS still running, processor is processing the jpg in the internal memory, perhaps flash recharging, then it could be that the battery won't cope with the load, and
the camera sort of just stop anywhere in its program.

Normally the low power warning trigger point should be high enough that you still can shut down properly, but I am not sure that one can consider every circumstance when programming the firmware, and uncontrolled power-downs might happen.

It has to be a balance with the battery capacity, you could set the shut down level quite high, but then you could perhaps only shoot half the number of pictures, certainly not something desired.
If you run out of batteries, and the the camera looks up, but
everything is back to normal when you change the battery, there

is really nothing much to complain about, since you have to change the battery anyway - though perhaps you lost a shot that you have to retake - if you can.

Trying to eek out the last picture from the battery is not a good idea anyway,
the LiIon batteries are better not run down completely - unlike NiMH -
and it's better to recharge them after every use, even if they are not empty.

In case of the PDA that I mentioned in previous posts, when it shut down because of low battery, I usually could take out the batteries and reuse them still in electronic clocks for a long time. The PDA dropped the voltage of the battery from 1.5 to 1.25, so there was still plenty of charge left in the battery. It's just that the PDA set a relatively high point for shutting down to be on the save side.