Konica Hexanon AR 135mm F2.5

aludal · Feb 12, 2008

A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does SA bayonet protrudes?

2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes? Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

Brian Mosley · Feb 13, 2008

Hello aludal,

I use a whole range of Hexanon lenses with my Olympus 4/3rd cameras, The 135mm f3.2 is sharper, less prone to flare and easier to find... also, why not pick up a Hexanon 40mm pancake lens to work on first? they are much cheaper and easier to find also.

My gallery of Hexanon lenses, used with my Olympus E-400 (about the size of the DP1, but takes all 4/3rd lenses) can be found here :
http://www.pbase.com/bmosley/root&page=2

I will be very interested to see if you are successful with your project, good luck with it!

Kind Regards

Brian

aludal said:
A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

--
E-3 Impressions by real users in the field...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3ult.html

Our latest event in York...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3york.html

Please e-mail me via my profile to join us for future UK Photo Safari's :
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/email_poster.asp?poster=hjigidiuhv

DaSonyGuy · Feb 13, 2008

aludal said:
A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

If your ademant that you want to convert it then your going to need to mount the lens in a lathe and machine the 3mm or so difference off the lenses mounting boss (the bit the Konica mounting plate screws onto), but only if sufficient material is available and the lens design allows it of course.

I had to machine 2mm off the mounting boss of my Canon FL 55mm f1.2 so it would focus to infinty on my SD14.
--
DSG
--

--
http://sigmasd10.fotopic.net/

aludal · Feb 13, 2008

Brian Mosley said:
Hello aludal,

I use a whole range of Hexanon lenses with my Olympus 4/3rd cameras,
The 135mm f3.2 is sharper, less prone to flare and easier to find...
also, why not pick up a Hexanon 40mm pancake lens to work on first?
they are much cheaper and easier to find also.

I might be wrong, but Hexanon "pancakes" might have their back lenses protruding too far (or even almost over bayonet face, as in my Hexanon 28mm) for the mod to succeed for SD14. So my Hex 28mm stays put (or I could think of swapping it for an old Sigma SA mount lens).

Whereas the Hexanon 135mm F2.5 has it back lens 20 mm or so deep in the barrel, even at infinity.

As for Hex 135mm f3.5, its sharpness while open is not significantly better than Hex 135mm f2.5 stopped at the same f.3.5, or better 4.0. A good, deep screw-in hood should eliminate localized flaring. It's residial overall very light flare I'd call "air" at f2.5 and a relatively small DOF I'm looking for in portraiture off this marvelous 650 grammes of prime glass.

Brian Mosley said:
My gallery of Hexanon lenses, used with my Olympus E-400 (about the
size of the DP1, but takes all 4/3rd lenses) can be found here :
http://www.pbase.com/bmosley/root&page=2

Thank you for the link, I studied all you have there with 135mm. But with 4/3 system and its RD=38.67 your experience with Hexanons is from the other side of barricade: you're shimming where I need to shave.

Brian Mosley said:
I will be very interested to see if you are successful with your
project, good luck with it!

Thanks! Keep in mind though that my mod project seems to me like irreversible, so it's useless if you decide to go back to 4/3 Oly

Brian Mosley said:
Kind Regards

Brian

aludal said:

A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

Click to expand...

--
E-3 Impressions by real users in the field...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3ult.html

Our latest event in York...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3york.html

Please e-mail me via my profile to join us for future UK Photo
Safari's :
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/email_poster.asp?poster=hjigidiuhv

aludal · Feb 13, 2008

DaSigmaGuy said:
aludal said:

A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

Click to expand...

If your ademant that you want to convert it then your going to need
to mount the lens in a lathe and machine the 3mm or so difference off
the lenses mounting boss (the bit the Konica mounting plate screws
onto), but only if sufficient material is available and the lens
design allows it of course.

This is exactly what I wanted to know before disassembling the lens: how thick/deep is the boss in Hex 135.

Or, can the SA bayonet part be countersunk relative to its flange, at the needed 3.3 mm depth relative to the flange?

Then again, if nothing of this guerilla machining actually working, what is your learned estimate of how far to the infinity I could focuss without shaving off the 3.3 mm difference?

DaSonyGuy said:
I had to machine 2mm off the mounting boss of my Canon FL 55mm f1.2
so it would focus to infinty on my SD14.

must felt like machining your own flesh, cutting such an expensive glass...

My Hex 135mm F2.5 cost me a whooping $11 at the local (San Jose, CA) flea market, but I'm trembling still at the thought I can kill this beauty. It must be a fetish of a sort, but for me the diameter of a front lens, plus the sheer weight of finest Japanese glass (649 grammes vs. almost half of that for a "regular" Hex 135 f3.5) dictates the value.

DaSonyGuy said:
--
DSG
--

--
http://sigmasd10.fotopic.net/

Brian Mosley · Feb 13, 2008

aludal said:
Brian Mosley said:

Hello aludal,

I use a whole range of Hexanon lenses with my Olympus 4/3rd cameras,
The 135mm f3.2 is sharper, less prone to flare and easier to find...
also, why not pick up a Hexanon 40mm pancake lens to work on first?
they are much cheaper and easier to find also.

Click to expand...

I might be wrong, but Hexanon "pancakes" might have their back lenses
protruding too far (or even almost over bayonet face, as in my
Hexanon 28mm) for the mod to succeed for SD14. So my Hex 28mm stays
put (or I could think of swapping it for an old Sigma SA mount lens).
Whereas the Hexanon 135mm F2.5 has it back lens 20 mm or so deep in
the barrel, even at infinity.

Yes you're right... the rear lens protrudes beyond the bayonet face.

aludal said:
As for Hex 135mm f3.5, its sharpness while open is not significantly
better than Hex 135mm f2.5 stopped at the same f.3.5, or better 4.0.

I didn't say the F3.5 - I said the f3.2 - it's the sharpest of the Hexanon 135mm lenses made, and focuses down to 12" too! here's a shot at minimum focusing distance :

It's much sharper than the f2.5 - but I know what you mean about the feel of the f2.5 - it's a lovely chunk of glass.

aludal said:
A good, deep screw-in hood should eliminate localized flaring. It's
residial overall very light flare I'd call "air" at f2.5 and a
relatively small DOF I'm looking for in portraiture off this
marvelous 650 grammes of prime glass.

aludal said:

My gallery of Hexanon lenses, used with my Olympus E-400 (about the
size of the DP1, but takes all 4/3rd lenses) can be found here :
http://www.pbase.com/bmosley/root&page=2

Click to expand...

Thank you for the link, I studied all you have there with 135mm. But
with 4/3 system and its RD=38.67 your experience with Hexanons is
from the other side of barricade: you're shimming where I need to
shave.

You're being much more ambitious with your mod... and as you say, it's a one way trip

Kind Regards

Brian
--
E-3 Impressions by real users in the field...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3ult.html

Our latest event in York...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3york.html

Please e-mail me via my profile to join us for future UK Photo Safari's :
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/email_poster.asp?poster=hjigidiuhv

DaSonyGuy · Feb 13, 2008

aludal said:
DaSigmaGuy said:

aludal said:

A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

Click to expand...

If your ademant that you want to convert it then your going to need
to mount the lens in a lathe and machine the 3mm or so difference off
the lenses mounting boss (the bit the Konica mounting plate screws
onto), but only if sufficient material is available and the lens
design allows it of course.

Click to expand...

aludal said:
This is exactly what I wanted to know before disassembling the lens:
how thick/deep is the boss in Hex 135.
Or, can the SA bayonet part be countersunk relative to its flange, at
the needed 3.3 mm depth relative to the flange?

aludal said:
Then again, if nothing of this guerilla machining actually working,
what is your learned estimate of how far to the infinity I could
focuss without shaving off the 3.3 mm difference?

3.3mm may not sound like a lot but its actually a very big difference in registration distance so expect macro use only.

aludal said:
aludal said:

I had to machine 2mm off the mounting boss of my Canon FL 55mm f1.2
so it would focus to infinty on my SD14.

Click to expand...

must felt like machining your own flesh, cutting such an expensive
glass...

Actually it was'nt expensive at all...It only cost me £39 including postage on ebay.

aludal said:
My Hex 135mm F2.5 cost me a whooping $11 at the local (San Jose, CA)
flea market, but I'm trembling still at the thought I can kill this
beauty.

$11 is only £5.50 so you dont really have that much to lose if things go t!ts up with the machining.

--
DSG
--

--
http://sigmasd10.fotopic.net/

aludal · Feb 13, 2008

Brian Mosley said:
aludal said:

Brian Mosley said:

Hello aludal,

I use a whole range of Hexanon lenses with my Olympus 4/3rd cameras,
The 135mm f3.2 is sharper, less prone to flare and easier to find...
also, why not pick up a Hexanon 40mm pancake lens to work on first?
they are much cheaper and easier to find also.

Click to expand...

I might be wrong, but Hexanon "pancakes" might have their back lenses
protruding too far (or even almost over bayonet face, as in my
Hexanon 28mm) for the mod to succeed for SD14. So my Hex 28mm stays
put (or I could think of swapping it for an old Sigma SA mount lens).
Whereas the Hexanon 135mm F2.5 has it back lens 20 mm or so deep in
the barrel, even at infinity.

Click to expand...

Yes you're right... the rear lens protrudes beyond the bayonet face.

Brian Mosley said:

As for Hex 135mm f3.5, its sharpness while open is not significantly
better than Hex 135mm f2.5 stopped at the same f.3.5, or better 4.0.

Click to expand...

I didn't say the F3.5 - I said the f3.2 - it's the sharpest of the
Hexanon 135mm lenses made, and focuses down to 12" too! here's a shot
at minimum focusing distance :

Brian Mosley said:
It's much sharper than the f2.5 - but I know what you mean about the
feel of the f2.5 - it's a lovely chunk of glass.

Sure. And I'm glad to meet another Hexanon afficionado, almost a nut like me, here -- of all places. I'm Alexander Udalov, a Russian residing in San Jose, CA. Playing with Zeniths and other SLRs since '67.

Brian Mosley said:
Brian Mosley said:

A good, deep screw-in hood should eliminate localized flaring. It's
residial overall very light flare I'd call "air" at f2.5 and a
relatively small DOF I'm looking for in portraiture off this
marvelous 650 grammes of prime glass.

Brian Mosley said:

My gallery of Hexanon lenses, used with my Olympus E-400 (about the
size of the DP1, but takes all 4/3rd lenses) can be found here :
http://www.pbase.com/bmosley/root&page=2

Click to expand...

Thank you for the link, I studied all you have there with 135mm. But
with 4/3 system and its RD=38.67 your experience with Hexanons is
from the other side of barricade: you're shimming where I need to
shave.

Click to expand...

You're being much more ambitious with your mod... and as you say,
it's a one way trip

Well, I don't own Konica, or even Oly, to mourn the greater loss.

Brian Mosley said:
Kind Regards

Brian
--
E-3 Impressions by real users in the field...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3ult.html

Our latest event in York...
http://www.biofos.com/esystem/e_3york.html

Please e-mail me via my profile to join us for future UK Photo
Safari's :
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/email_poster.asp?poster=hjigidiuhv

aludal · Feb 13, 2008

DaSigmaGuy said:
aludal said:

DaSigmaGuy said:

aludal said:

A rare beauty of a lens, a magnificent performer if only flares too
much. But I plan to use some sort of deep screw-in hood and/or shoot
mostly in studio, so it shouldn't be a problem.

The Problem is Hexanon AR has RD=40.7mm whereas SD14 has 44.00, so
the "delta" is 3.3mm, and it's in the "wrong" direction. I plan to
change the Hexanon AR plate for a SA one, the questions are:

1) Konica bayonet sticks out full 5 mm from its flange, how much does
SA bayonet protrudes?
2) The AR flange is sunk about 1mm under f-stop scale ring face, so
could it be like I need to shave off only 2.3mm (plus full 3.3mm from
the f=stop scale ring) from the lens innards/mount set holes?
Provided bayonet's depth is the same, is it?

Thank you
-----------------
"Foveon -- foreveon!"

Click to expand...

If your ademant that you want to convert it then your going to need
to mount the lens in a lathe and machine the 3mm or so difference off
the lenses mounting boss (the bit the Konica mounting plate screws
onto), but only if sufficient material is available and the lens
design allows it of course.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

DaSonyGuy said:

This is exactly what I wanted to know before disassembling the lens:
how thick/deep is the boss in Hex 135.
Or, can the SA bayonet part be countersunk relative to its flange, at
the needed 3.3 mm depth relative to the flange?

Click to expand...

DaSonyGuy said:

Then again, if nothing of this guerilla machining actually working,
what is your learned estimate of how far to the infinity I could
focuss without shaving off the 3.3 mm difference?

Click to expand...

3.3mm may not sound like a lot but its actually a very big difference
in registration distance so expect macro use only.

DaSonyGuy said:

DaSonyGuy said:

I had to machine 2mm off the mounting boss of my Canon FL 55mm f1.2
so it would focus to infinty on my SD14.

Click to expand...

must felt like machining your own flesh, cutting such an expensive
glass...

Click to expand...

Actually it was'nt expensive at all...It only cost me £39 including
postage on ebay.

With dollars steadily going the yen way, it's around $240....$280 here at US eBay

DaSonyGuy said:
DaSonyGuy said:

My Hex 135mm F2.5 cost me a whooping $11 at the local (San Jose, CA)
flea market, but I'm trembling still at the thought I can kill this
beauty.

Click to expand...

$11 is only £5.50 so you dont really have that much to lose if things
go t!ts up with the machining.

I agree: paying in pounds sterling has a very sedative effect on a buyer, lol. Or even better -- with guineas, sovereigns, or some other posh pre-raphaelite tender.

God I miss Great Britain! Things go belly up in US, and much sweeter -- just tits up -- in UK, LOL.

DaSonyGuy said:
--
DSG
--

--
http://sigmasd10.fotopic.net/

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