-
Welcome to the new forums! Please read this first. For known issues we are working to resolve, click here.
Are you KIDDING ME!?....Phil, look at these K10D shots!
- Thread starter DarkFudgeReturns
- Start date
Jeff Kott
Senior Member
I understand we sometimes lose patience with posters who constantly reiterate one point of view. If that's how you feel about Herb's comments, I think it is perfectly ok to say it. If you feel he's dead wrong or biased, it's ok to say that too.
It's Ray's comments that nobody cares about a comparison with comparable Nikon cameras and that such comments don't belong in the Pentax forum that I take issue with. I think the comments are appropriate for the forum whether you agree, disagree or find them irritating. Personally, I have found Herb's many comments to be informative.
I don't personally feel that Herb is negative on Pentax in general. My take on the situation is that Herb loves his Pentax lenses and prefers many of them to whatever Nikon has to offer. He would like to feel that he had a 10 mp camera that he could be happy using the Pentax lenses on. He is disappointed in the K10D after careful testing and comparison with the Nikons which he owns and uses. As a Nikon user who is considering buying a K10D, his insights are valuable to me and I suspect others.
--
Jeff Kott
It's Ray's comments that nobody cares about a comparison with comparable Nikon cameras and that such comments don't belong in the Pentax forum that I take issue with. I think the comments are appropriate for the forum whether you agree, disagree or find them irritating. Personally, I have found Herb's many comments to be informative.
I don't personally feel that Herb is negative on Pentax in general. My take on the situation is that Herb loves his Pentax lenses and prefers many of them to whatever Nikon has to offer. He would like to feel that he had a 10 mp camera that he could be happy using the Pentax lenses on. He is disappointed in the K10D after careful testing and comparison with the Nikons which he owns and uses. As a Nikon user who is considering buying a K10D, his insights are valuable to me and I suspect others.
--
Jeff Kott
thanks for the support Jeff. many people here simply don't know what it is like to use a really high performance body. OTOH, i hope you don't mind if i say that Nikon lenses leave something to be desired when it comes to bokeh and flare resistance.
my benchmark of comparison is my D2X against everything else. when seen in that light, the K10D is below my D200 and above my *istD in all-round performance. the K10D's image quality suffers from the banding noise and shows up in the RAW workflow that i have been using for years, starting with my Coolpix 5000, *istD, Coolpix 8400, D2X, D70s, D200, and the K10D. seven cameras worth of RAW workflow and the K10D is the only one to show banding noise. i exchange the body and it is still there. a bunch of technical analysis by GordonBGood and it is confirmed there in every single K10D.
i do about equal amounts of action wildlife and landscape photography and sell a small number of images into editorial stock and fine art prints. i need it all, resolution, high dynamic range, high performance AF, high FPS, and of course high image quality. i told Pentax "give me a $5K *istD upgrade body using the KAF2 mount and i will buy it". i asked for specs the same as the D200. they didn't and i got the D2X instead because that is what i had to for getting the job done.
the Nikkor top of the line lenses aren't bad, but they don't render as pleasing images. i am sure you know that or you wouldn't be looking at Pentax. i have Pentax lenses capable of doing the job but even the K10D can't do lots of what i demand out of a body. even the D2X falls down some of the time, enough that i am thinking of the D2Hs for even higher AF performance. it's also a lot better at high ISO, but doesn't have the megapixels. in the fine art world, given two identical compositions, the higher megapixels win. if this weren't the case, large format wouldn't still be in use over 35mm film.
Herb...
my benchmark of comparison is my D2X against everything else. when seen in that light, the K10D is below my D200 and above my *istD in all-round performance. the K10D's image quality suffers from the banding noise and shows up in the RAW workflow that i have been using for years, starting with my Coolpix 5000, *istD, Coolpix 8400, D2X, D70s, D200, and the K10D. seven cameras worth of RAW workflow and the K10D is the only one to show banding noise. i exchange the body and it is still there. a bunch of technical analysis by GordonBGood and it is confirmed there in every single K10D.
i do about equal amounts of action wildlife and landscape photography and sell a small number of images into editorial stock and fine art prints. i need it all, resolution, high dynamic range, high performance AF, high FPS, and of course high image quality. i told Pentax "give me a $5K *istD upgrade body using the KAF2 mount and i will buy it". i asked for specs the same as the D200. they didn't and i got the D2X instead because that is what i had to for getting the job done.
the Nikkor top of the line lenses aren't bad, but they don't render as pleasing images. i am sure you know that or you wouldn't be looking at Pentax. i have Pentax lenses capable of doing the job but even the K10D can't do lots of what i demand out of a body. even the D2X falls down some of the time, enough that i am thinking of the D2Hs for even higher AF performance. it's also a lot better at high ISO, but doesn't have the megapixels. in the fine art world, given two identical compositions, the higher megapixels win. if this weren't the case, large format wouldn't still be in use over 35mm film.
Herb...
many of the people here have no concept of what it is like using a D2X day in and day out for more than a year and then using something else. even the D200 is a noticeable step down in all respects.
i planned the K10D for my #3 camera to use my Limiteds (i own every one in every color and have thought about getting more black copies for conversion to Nikon mount) and a select few other Pentax lenses for a certain type of photography. the K10D simply doesn't have the AF or FPS performance to use in the wildlife shooting that i do with the D2X. even the D200 as a backup is adequate at best but i am willing to have one because it is smaller and has a built-in flash for times when those matter. with the K10D noise banding problem, shooting landscapes and working the shadows for wide tonal range isn't doable while i can do it with the D2X and D200, or even my *istD and Coolpix 8400. the K10D should be at least no worse than all of these, but in fact it is provably worse on the two different bodies i have owned. i was counting on no worse than the D80 and much better than the A100, but until that firmware fix comes out, it's useable only for noncritical work.
Herb...
i planned the K10D for my #3 camera to use my Limiteds (i own every one in every color and have thought about getting more black copies for conversion to Nikon mount) and a select few other Pentax lenses for a certain type of photography. the K10D simply doesn't have the AF or FPS performance to use in the wildlife shooting that i do with the D2X. even the D200 as a backup is adequate at best but i am willing to have one because it is smaller and has a built-in flash for times when those matter. with the K10D noise banding problem, shooting landscapes and working the shadows for wide tonal range isn't doable while i can do it with the D2X and D200, or even my *istD and Coolpix 8400. the K10D should be at least no worse than all of these, but in fact it is provably worse on the two different bodies i have owned. i was counting on no worse than the D80 and much better than the A100, but until that firmware fix comes out, it's useable only for noncritical work.
Herb...
DarkFudgeReturns
Forum Enthusiast
Herb, no offense to you my good man, your probablly a great guy and I'd love to sit down and chat with you in downtown Soho. You can elaborate even further on your entire digital workflow over a cup of coffee....but you just proved my point once again with this exhaustive, discussion of how the K10D doesnt fit your needs...once again, mind you. All of these fine Pentax posters that actually came into this thread to view a different discussion entirely.
Your thoughts are informative and probing, ...and even somewhat interesting ( for those of us that don't have to repeatedly hear them again)
But dont you think you should simply centralize all your constructive criticisms and in depth benchmarks against your $30,000 camera in one post somewhere....perhaps called Herb Chong's Corner or something?
--
'Is that a Canon L 300 Lens in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?'
Your thoughts are informative and probing, ...and even somewhat interesting ( for those of us that don't have to repeatedly hear them again)
But dont you think you should simply centralize all your constructive criticisms and in depth benchmarks against your $30,000 camera in one post somewhere....perhaps called Herb Chong's Corner or something?
--
'Is that a Canon L 300 Lens in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?'
nextSibling
Leading Member
We're not worthy.
Yes, his demeanour is quite sad isn't it. We should bow and scrape and cow tail to N*kon and the holy D2X. What an absolute load of cobblers.
--
Lance B
http://www.pbase.com/lance_b
GMT +10hours
Erik37
Veteran Member
A Series 1 70-210/3.5. Unfortunately in the nowadays
less useful Konica AR mount. Nice to hear it's so well regarded.
I like the lens but it's too heavy for hiking IMO.
I don't see what a reduced size image tells us about jpg resolution.
And, I mean, any difference to the competition is slight enough
that you'd need side-by-side 100% crops with very sharp lenses
to see any difference. It wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if
I were looking for a camera in the K10D's weight class.
Just my two oere
Erik from Sweden
less useful Konica AR mount. Nice to hear it's so well regarded.
I like the lens but it's too heavy for hiking IMO.
I don't see what a reduced size image tells us about jpg resolution.
And, I mean, any difference to the competition is slight enough
that you'd need side-by-side 100% crops with very sharp lenses
to see any difference. It wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if
I were looking for a camera in the K10D's weight class.
Just my two oere
Erik from Sweden
DarkFudgeReturns
Forum Enthusiast
Erik....do you have one of those Vivitar Series One lenses?
How do you like it?.....Do you also have the K10D?
What are your thoughts on the camera?
How do you like it?.....Do you also have the K10D?
What are your thoughts on the camera?
Erik37
Veteran Member
Yep, but for my film SLR, a Konica FC-1, MF, S priority. Can't use it
on digital easily.
I mostly printed 10x15cm with film, but I've got an A4 enlargement
of a young owl sitting in a birch that's most likely at 210mm
with tripod, no MLU. No idea of the aperture but the print looks sharp,
no visible aberrations. For larger enlargements, no idea, never did any.
I've been thinking of getting film slide scanner, but haven't done the
research.
The build is nice enough, it's a push-pull design, all metal and too heavy
(for me) to carry around any longer distances.
No, I don't have a DSLR yet. The K10D looks like a very nice camera.
ISO priority and hyper program seems very useful, not to mention SR
which I'm convinced works well beyond 1.2m
. If it were the weight of the DL (I could sacrifice weather seals) I would strongly consider
getting one. But I can't justify two bodies and I want a light one for
hiking.
Just my two oere
Erik from Sweden
The word grainy was used, which is right, I would not purchase this camera when a Canon chip is available and could actually create a sharp picture with less noise and grain. Hey but someone has to buy this camera, glad it wasn't me.
E
ecube
Guest
Ok, Nikon D80. why would he be WRONG?
IMHO, everyone is entitled to his / her own opinion / belief.
You may not agree with him, still he is entitled to his opinion.
Whether I agree with you or Phil is beside the point.
--
ecube -
IMHO, everyone is entitled to his / her own opinion / belief.
You may not agree with him, still he is entitled to his opinion.
Whether I agree with you or Phil is beside the point.
--
ecube -
Matthew Paden
Forum Enthusiast
Hmmm... that wasn't too bright of a move was it? Seeing that you don't even like the camera and all.
--
Matt Paden
http://mpadenphoto.blogspot.com
http://mpaden.zoto.com/
E
ecube
Guest
Have been and still is a Nikon fun since 1959. There is no BUT here either.
Recently bought a D200 and am enjoying it. Also have a Lumix Z50 for everyday utility and using it more than the D200. Knowing a thing or two about sensors, optics, computer/electronics, and electro-mechanical systems, I went to my local photogrraphy dealer and made a down payment (earnest money) for a K10D and hopefully will be one of the first owner of the three DA lenses. I'm waiting for my dealer to call for pick-up of the K10D with the 18~55mm (I think).
Not a pixel peeper, I don't care about the banding, bokeh, and those jargons. More interested in the general composition and the story the photograph captures. Enough has been written and said about sharpness, softness and pros and cons of various camera or system. Thanks to the contributors of this and the other forums. I learn how to overcome the shortcomings or maybe a better way of using my black boxes.
May y'awl have a wonderful day. I'll go out and take some pictures.
--
ecube -
Recently bought a D200 and am enjoying it. Also have a Lumix Z50 for everyday utility and using it more than the D200. Knowing a thing or two about sensors, optics, computer/electronics, and electro-mechanical systems, I went to my local photogrraphy dealer and made a down payment (earnest money) for a K10D and hopefully will be one of the first owner of the three DA lenses. I'm waiting for my dealer to call for pick-up of the K10D with the 18~55mm (I think).
Not a pixel peeper, I don't care about the banding, bokeh, and those jargons. More interested in the general composition and the story the photograph captures. Enough has been written and said about sharpness, softness and pros and cons of various camera or system. Thanks to the contributors of this and the other forums. I learn how to overcome the shortcomings or maybe a better way of using my black boxes.
May y'awl have a wonderful day. I'll go out and take some pictures.
--
ecube -
_ _ _
RustyHinges
Well-known member
Keyboard shortcuts
- f
- Forum