Another Disapointment From Canon! Or maybe this is good news.

I have to admit I'm disappointed with Canon not making more of a splash for the big show. But after thinking about it, this is probably good news.

Here's my reasoning, or rambling depending on your perspective.

First off, I'm disappointed because I have a lot invested in Canon equipment and I like their cameras. There is much debate on this site about the ergonomics of Canon vs Nikon, which is a matter of opinion of course, but I for one prefer the 1 series Canon to any Nikon. (or Pentax or Sony or Fuji) Maybe it's just because I'm so used to that camera. The Nikons just feel awkward in my hand. So if all things are equal, I prefer Canon over Nikon.

With that being said, it's nice to know that the equipment you use and have invested heavily in and that you personally prefer using is really second to none.

However, if Nikon comes out with a superior camera tomorrow, I will have to begin at least thinking of switching. Of course then the decision would have to be based on a number of factors, most importantly being how much better the mythical new Nikon really is. I don't want to start a huge debate here, but I'm sure Nikon folks have been wrestling with this dilemma for quite some time. They like their Nikon cameras, and the difference in IQ isn't significant enough for most of them to switch. Plus of course, Nikon makes some freaking great cameras too. On top of that, we all know that the camera is only a tool anyway and on and on. But if the IQ of Canons moved up in class even more and Nikon didn't match Canon to some extent, it would be a much harder decision for those who just like and prefer Nikon equipment much the same way I prefer Canon over Nikon. Many more of them would switch (reluctantly).

So the bottom line here is that the gap between Canon and their competition is definitely narrowing, and I guess that just makes me less comfortable because it means it is more likely I'll have to face that terrible decision of possibly having to switch to something else someday. And again, I just like Canon cameras. So I would like to see Canon hold and even extend their dominance even further.

BTW I realize that both the 1dsmk2 and 1dmk2 really still have no competition, but again the gap seems to be narrowed a bit, if not with those two cameras, at least with Canon's overall dominance.

So yeah I would have loved to see an improved 1ds or the "3D" or something just to make me feel even more comfortable that the cameras I like and prefer to any other, are also still the very best in their class.

On the flip side, of course competition is always good. But I would still prefer that Canon remains on top, again because I just like the ergonomics of their cameras more. So no, I still would have liked to see Canon stomp the competition with a few more exciting new cameras this show. That way I can go on shooting the cameras I prefer, taking comfort knowing that my "system" is still hands down the best.

So that is my emotional gut reaction to Canon disappointing me with no other new cams. Hope I didn't bore the hell out of everyone or offend to many.

But after thinking about it, maybe this is good news.

For one, the rate at which cameras are being updated and improved is slowing. And I guess that can be considered a good thing. Anyone who plunked down the money on the d60 can relate. Plus our current gear really is amazing when you think about it. Maybe we should all just get used to not having much improved equipment to tempt our wallets every few years, and consider this a very good thing indeed.

Along that same line of thinking, if improvements in digital cameras are slowing now, it is less likely that one company will ever completely dominate the industry. Therefore, I want Nikon and Sony to catch up and drive prices down because I can take comfort in knowing that even if Canon ever gets topped by one of them, the difference will likely never be significant enough to warrant me switching.

So there's my reasoning.

Yeah I'm bummed I guess but this is probably really good news for all photographers in the long run. Prices are sure to come down and big improvements in technology will come much more slowly and we can all get back to focusing on photography.

Yep. That's they way I'm going to look at this. My mood is better already!

Can't wait to see what comes of 2007 though. Opps! there I go again.

Sorry for this pointless post everyone. Just had to get it off my chest.

--
Aaron Thomson

..so if Nikon come out with a better camera than Canon, which you don't think they do at the moment, and if Canon do not release new models which are better than that Nikon, you may at some point consider switching even though you prefer the Canons?
Sleepless night?
--
Regards,
DaveMart

'Just a wildebeast on the plain of life'
Please see profile for equipment

1 public day does not necessarily make a Photokina.

I was sort of hoping to see some revisions in the older lens lines, better build qualities, replacement of older lens AF motor tech, more modern lenses in the 28~135 range, maybe a smaller, lighter, updated 3XX EX flash to replace the older 380EX, not just a 22MP gee whiz thing that I have no use for.

But I'd really like to see a lightweight 1.3 with at least 5 fps that would run on 511 batteries...

But this Photokina certainly may throw the schedule theorists a curve.
--
Joe Sesto

Troy Bakewell said:

--------snip----------

However, if Nikon comes out with a superior camera tomorrow, I will
have to begin at least thinking of switching.

--------snip----------

Click to expand...

I cannot believe how many times over the years I have read about people wanting to jump ship or who have jumped ship everytime one company out does the other. I make a pretty good living and there is no way I could jump ship every year or two. Heck, I don't even have all the lenses and other equipment I want for Canon much less sell everything at a loss to buy the next companies stuff. Does your sensor get foggy as soon as Nikon produces a new camera? If you were happy with your stuff today, why would you be unhappy with it tomorrow when a new Nikon comes out? Just asking.

--
Greg
http://www.pictureroanoke.com

Photography is a journey, not a destination.

Did you read my post? (Actually I don't blame you if you didn't. Pretty drawn out.)

If any manufacturer comes out with a camera that is significantly better than the competition, almost every pro will switch! Competition among photographers is too intense.

If the difference isn't too major such as the 1dsmk2 vs d2x many people will choose based somewhat on their personal preferences.

I can promise you that if Canon would have come out with a 24mp 1ds with even more improved DR and even less noise at high iso with a digic3 at 8fps for $8k, you'd see a mass of Nikon shooters switching, unless there were credible rumors that Nikon had a new camera to match it coming out soon. If they didn't their business would suffer too much to shooters with the awesome new cam.

And hell yes if Nikon came out with an amazing Cam that blew away Canon and it looked like Canon had nothing in the immediate future, tons of Canon shooters, myself included, would be loading up on Nikon gear.

You don't seriously doubt that do you?

Troy Bakewell said:

I have to admit I'm disappointed with Canon not making more of a
splash for the big show. But after thinking about it, this is
probably good news.

Click to expand...

Troy Bakewell said:

Yeah I'm bummed I guess but this is probably really good news for
all photographers in the long run. Prices are sure to come down
and big improvements in technology will come much more slowly and
we can all get back to focusing on photography.

Click to expand...

What a relief. I thought we'd never get back to photographing.

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/rebel%20xti.shtml

Michael Reichman's statement sounds very much like a designated leak from Canon marketing. Clearly one part of it has already proven true. There is a good chance that the second part will too and we will see the new 1Ds model announced in January. If so, the main difference likely will be the excitement at this show. Given the kind of ramp up in availability that we have seen in the past for the 1Ds and the marketing factors that are likely to be driving the announcement schedule, there may be very little difference in the timing for when people can actually expect to get their hands on the new model.
--
David Jacobson
http://www.pbase.com/dnjake

If my competition has a significant enough edge over me with a mythical new cam from another manufacturer, whether it be Nikon, or Sony, or Fuji, I'm going to switch for 100% sure.

They key is how significant is the edge. As I stated, the 1dsmk2 is superior to the d2x I think most people wopuld agree, but it's not significantly superior enough to justify a switch for most.

I guess if your photography business is less dependent on IQ then maybe my statement seems out of line to you. But I can tell you that my business would suffer enough to justify the expense of switching if my competitors were utilizing significantly better equipment.

Maybe you are heads and sholders a better photographer than all of your competition. I'm not! A lot of my competition is really good. Combine that with a significant advantage in IQ and I'd have to be a fool not to invest in better gear.

Just my 0.02 cents.

Personaly I dont see why people in this forum always complain so much about new releases Nobody has anything that really competes with the 1DS 1D or 5D in terms of image quality and noise.The Nikon D2 come close to a 1D but thats about it.Do your cameras all of a sudden start taking worse images because Canon doesnt launch a new model? I for one would love to see Nikon and Sony both get into the FF fight so Canon will have a little competition and prices will start dropping.But really people the sky isnt falling just go out and take great images and have some fun

Just a thought

Troy Bakewell said:

Did you read my post? (Actually I don't blame you if you didn't.
Pretty drawn out.)

If any manufacturer comes out with a camera that is significantly
better than the competition, almost every pro will switch!
Competition among photographers is too intense.

If the difference isn't too major such as the 1dsmk2 vs d2x many
people will choose based somewhat on their personal preferences.

I can promise you that if Canon would have come out with a 24mp 1ds
with even more improved DR and even less noise at high iso with a
digic3 at 8fps for $8k, you'd see a mass of Nikon shooters
switching, unless there were credible rumors that Nikon had a new
camera to match it coming out soon. If they didn't their business
would suffer too much to shooters with the awesome new cam.

And hell yes if Nikon came out with an amazing Cam that blew away
Canon and it looked like Canon had nothing in the immediate future,
tons of Canon shooters, myself included, would be loading up on
Nikon gear.

Click to expand...

Precisely. That is why is seemed a bit strange to me to argue that in such detail.

Troy Bakewell said:

You don't seriously doubt that do you?

Click to expand...

--
Regards,
DaveMart

'Just a wildebeast on the plain of life'
Please see profile for equipment

I hope Canon have learnt their lesson: they did not upgrade the 20D enough when they released the 30D.

They either have to reduce the number of "lines" they are offering, or risk models older than a year being made redundant to their own inovation in cheaper lines, or even worse, those of their competitors.

--
Stu.

More Canon for me then.

--
When I ask which Canon lenses are best,
people tell me to 'go to L.'

Troy Bakewell said:

However, if Nikon comes out with a superior camera tomorrow, I will
have to begin at least thinking of switching.

Click to expand...

Basically: what a load of rot.

So you'll switch your entire system just because you have to wait less than 6 months for Canon to release a new 1-series. I seriously doubt that.

Haven't you got anything better to do with your time... like using the equipment you have NOW rather than posting meaningless dribble on this forum.

Sheesh. Some of you have more money and time than sense.

You should slow down and read and think.

I clearly said I would have to start to consider switching.

Then again maybe I wasn't very clear.

No way I would switch if there was another canon comming 6 months down the line, unless the new nikon was just so much better that I would lose enough business to justify the expense in switching for that six month wait.

Am I missing something here?

Isn't the equipment we choose really more of a business decision?

Troy Bakewell said:

No way I would switch if there was another canon comming 6 months
down the line, unless the new nikon was just so much better that I
would lose enough business to justify the expense in switching for
that six month wait.

Click to expand...

You must be one of the very few photographers here whose success and results are limited by the equipment available from Canon and not by his or her own skills and capabilities ... no offense meant

--
Harald

There is need for a 1Ds3 !!!

It still is hard for me to believe that Canon comes to a bi-annual world-wide technology show with only an entry level camera to show for it.
There is a story there, yet to be told.
Perhaps, they'll come in with a surprise DURING the event
that would wake every one up...

Anyway, for those that desire to:

A. Print 13x19" @ 300dpi, it requires 22.23MP, I need this capability

B. Good performance at ISO 3200 would be Wonderful, for available light, quality high resolution photography.

C. 3" OLED screen would be excellent so we can really see the proof shots during/while on locaiton.

D. Migrate to LiON batteries, use the batts in the 5D, perhaps 2 of them to get the weight down a bit and standardize on the 5D batteries.

E. Convert 580EX to LiOn batts used in the 5D, get some uniformity in the battery systems, and get off the AA's forever, have a magazine capability for the off-road backpackers, hard news hounds, that cannot get to power to charge their batts.

F. Press, Law enforcement, Insurance, Government, Military, world-wide needs GPS in high resolution 1Ds cameras, built-in, writing into EXIF file headders. Canon could build GPS into the main board, or use the Card #2 slot, (change 2nd card slot to CF; SD users can use CF-to-SD adapters) with a small plug/wire for a flash-shoe mounted SMALL horizontal antenna; (so the 580EX could mount onto top) GARMIN has shown they have an excellent very sensititive antenna on their new 60 and 70 series handhelds. Also this GPU unit auto sets clock in Camera.

G. Improved anto focus, and tracking for moving objects, and sports. All I need is bursts of 3 shots, at fast frame rate. The first shots is usually best anyway.

That's my short list for the 1Ds3... of the future,
whenever that is ???

jw

‹(•¿•)›
JimWilson, Boca Raton, FL, USA.
http://www.FAUdigital.com

Disclaimer, I am not a pro.

Troy Bakewell said:

If my competition has a significant enough edge over me with a
mythical new cam from another manufacturer, whether it be Nikon, or
Sony, or Fuji, I'm going to switch for 100% sure.

Click to expand...

But if your camera is producing results now, why wouldn't it when the next camera comes out?

Troy Bakewell said:

They key is how significant is the edge. As I stated, the 1dsmk2
is superior to the d2x I think most people wopuld agree, but it's
not significantly superior enough to justify a switch for most.

Click to expand...

I would think it would require a large difference to justify switching. Personally I think Canon is way ahead of Nikon and I could see them switching. I don't see that changing anytime soon. But since there are a lot of Nikon shooters out there, then I would think that the camera is not as relevant as most people think.

Troy Bakewell said:

I guess if your photography business is less dependent on IQ then
maybe my statement seems out of line to you. But I can tell you
that my business would suffer enough to justify the expense of
switching if my competitors were utilizing significantly better
equipment.

Maybe you are heads and sholders a better photographer than all of
your competition.

Click to expand...

I wish! ;> )

Troy Bakewell said:

I'm not! A lot of my competition is really
good. Combine that with a significant advantage in IQ and I'd have
to be a fool not to invest in better gear.

Just my 0.02 cents.

Click to expand...

--
Greg
http://www.pictureroanoke.com

Photography is a journey, not a destination.

--
1DsMII,5D,G5 D2.0---> Shooting RAW (Ofcourse)
http://homepage.mac.com/ekphotography/2006/

Harald Backes said:

Troy Bakewell said:

No way I would switch if there was another canon comming 6 months
down the line, unless the new nikon was just so much better that I
would lose enough business to justify the expense in switching for
that six month wait.

Click to expand...

You must be one of the very few photographers here whose success
and results are limited by the equipment available from Canon and
not by his or her own skills and capabilities ... no offense meant


--
Harald

Click to expand...

Troy sounds insecure. If he needs the latest gear with the best specs to compete successfully with other pro's, then he should work on his photographic skills, his vision, his artistry. He admits he's only a good photographer, not a great one, so I suggest he try to improve his photography -- he, like anyone else, can do better, with or without using the latest and greatest spec'd camera.

Mr. Steve