I'm not a spec-sheet bigot. I deeply agree with your real world view of the challenge of recommending Canon to someone seeking an upgrade. I faced this very challenge last month; buyer went with Nikon.

I'm so deep in Canon it is hard to extract; fast glass is just so expensive. Worth more than my car these days. :)

Now THIS is an excellent observation. I forgot that difference between flasgship and entry level...

It's like saying "Oh, the Olympus OM-D has more features than the Canon 650D for a similar price".... but the OM-D is practically that type of camera's flagship whilst the 650D is basically the entry level option... with better low light in comparison.

I kinda think that its "only" 11 focus points may work better than Nikons 39, so long as the centre point is amazing as they say it will be.

I cannot WAIT to get my hands on the 6D regardless, SD card is fantastic for me, I never liked CF, and everything else ever in it... I only read these comments because I want to read everything about it, I'm being really impatient for a review to confirm how awesome it is...

"It would`ve been easy for Canon to make an awesome all round semi-professional camera by just adding a FF sensor onto the 7D and calling it the 6D, what do you reckon ?"

It'd have been nice to have such a camera. But taking 8fps to full frame level will cost a lot more. And when you say a 6fps will be enough,.... we have 5Dmkiii :D

I wish they had given a 5Dmkiii with sensor of mkii and some 30 or 40 focus points so that you all would have been happy. Ask yourself. would you be happy??? no you'd still complain.

As for me, i wont ever buy this camera. Not because it is bad. Just because, i dont want it.

"It's like saying "Oh, the Olympus OM-D has more features than the Canon 650D for a similar price".... but the OM-D is practically that type of camera's flagship whilst the 650D is basically the entry level option... with better low light in comparison."

In fact E-M5 has better low light than any Canon APS-C. See DPR comparison widget. Canon's 18 mpix APS-C is not up to modern standards.

Hi David,
I do realise that the specs can't be too high as to damage 5d3 sales. If however they made the body material more like the entry level cameras and maybe tweeked the movie quality so it does not compete too much with the 5d they could have had more of a serious camera to fit in between that 7d and 5d slot. Most pros buy the 5d as it is a robust build quality camera for work and it is aimed at high end movie quality and for it's low light capabilities to name just a few. There are ways of keeping the costs down without completely stripping too much of the specs. This camera as it is is almost at an entry level beginners camera with just a larger sensor.
Cheers,

Touche good sir!

Mind you, full frame is generally good for landscape and portrait work - which don't generally require extreme speed or heaps of focus points.

Full Frame sensors cost quite a lot of money, but I can't really make sense of that when Nikon have their camera out with its slightly better specs.

Oh well, I'm just really excited for this camera as it's got everything I'll ever need for a good few years (hopefully several years). And peoples opinions just make me realise how much they're interested in camera features than the fact that FF at such a price is unbelievably fantastic - it gives a different kind of quality image.

Maybe Canon had their reasons.... if their new 20mp sensor was a large investment for them, and is considerably better quality than Nikons choosing of the Sony sensor, then it's probably why the Canon wont cost much less than the Nikon despite the lack of features.

I still can't help but feel Canon is the Apple brand in the camera world.

Well said JimSab. Be careful of the Nikon Fan Boys and the uneducated. They only get excited about paper spec and very rarely of being an actual photographer. Even when spec for price is great like the D600 and 6D they will find something to complain about... Oh excuse me comment and make an opinion on. True photographers use to complain the SLR's were making everyone a good photographer, now the technology from brands are leaping ahead they will complain there's not enough spec. Gotta love DPR commentators, me included.LOL!!!

you are an idiot

Paulmeister - you make my point for me in your use of the term "Canon shooter". Surely we are all 'photographers', no?

I can understand a degree of brand allegiance, but not to the point where we are defined by the brand. The brand should be on the product, not tattooed behind your ear!

I would be annoyed if I was locked in through my existing arsenal of FF lenses etc, but if not then I would rejoice in the choices available to me.

you are not comparing apples with apples i.e money wise

Its the only EOS camera with WI-FI
why the complains about missing Articulating screen then?

Articulating screen right on the body is much more convenient in the field. Remote controller and remote screen on smartphone or dedicated LCD is good for studio/tripod/video with rigs...

Thanks, this is a Brilliant move by canon, i am sure it will be an accessory to attach the phone to the body

@fd...: If the camera has an articulating screen, I don't need to buy an android phone, is not it? or Is the android phone included in the box? How much a android phone cost?

Anyone in this universe don't have android or Iphone?
Do you use a 40dollar 7 years old phone and you are looking for state of te art 2K dslr body?

So, you think everyone in this universe has a android or iphone? and other phone (non-smart phone) does not exist now, LOL?

If someone want to buy a DSLR, he must have an android phone also? What an assumptions? Probably, you are a gadget lover, not photographer!

Really? My latest movie.
https://vimeo.com/47599146

@AP7 - as of this month, there are currently 1.3 *million* Android activations per *day*! Yes, that's per *day*!!!

http://www.businessinsider.com/chart-of-the-day-android-activations-per-day-2012-9

And obviously, there are millions of iPhones out there, too. If you don't have either an Android or iOS phone, you're living in a cave and probably won't be buying a 6D anyways! LOL. So given the statistics regarding the prevalence of smart phones, yes I think it's a safe *assumption* that a potential 6D (or any other DSLR) buyer probably already has a smart phone, or will have a smart phone very soon.

And yes, a lot of photographers these days are also gadget lovers, too! LOL.

@Katie: Both 60D and 7D have 1/250sec flash sync speed. Does 60D sales hurt 7D sales.

Also, both T3 (1100D) and T4i/T3i/T2i have 1/200sec flash sync speed. Does T3 hurt T4i/T3i sales? The answer is NO, Canon knows it very well.

Canon actually put full frame sensor with rebel hardware and casing with some improvement. They priced it with Nikon 600D to show that 6D is no less. But, after a month you'll see lots of discount to attract customers. For example, T4i is launched at $1000, you can buy it now for $800 or less ($200 discount within two months).

Canon's strategy is to design inferior product than comparable Nikon product so that they can give a huge discount to attract customers. After all consumers always look for best deal and sale!

Well said young man :)

So Canonman21, what do you think it's like to manually focus on a screen that's not designed for manual focus?

You obviously dont get it. If you want all the bells and whistles buy a 5 D3. Just wait and see if the auto focus will work - or not. The Samyang/ Optika lenses are manual focus but are impressive bits of glass for the money. I have mostly EF lenses as the crop factor on the 60D gives us more magnification but when composingin I'll always use the centre focus point anyway.
I dont think it has brought us back to manual focus but you always have that option.Auto focus has just made us lazy. If you cant take a decent picture with you in control than but a compact. And if you dont like the 6D spec's then dont buy it.

There are many lens makers who doesn''t make AF lenses. Not because they can't. Just because they do not want.
But the case of 6D is different. Someone buying an EOS camera will expect to have good AF unless he is goin to use a carl zeiss or something like that on it.

Yes
The king of video. Hope video resolution will be true 1080p

Omission of built-in flash means omission of built-in wireless commander also. This two features are indispensable to any camera for photo.

Sure, you can make your camera unit heavier like 1D X by putting heavy lens and external flash unit, but that is not the design goal of a light weight travel camera. This camera is designed light weight and travel camera in mind.

@AP7 - you're contradicting yourself. On the one hand, you say that "design goal of a light weight travel camera" isn't to have to carry an external flash unit for things like wireless flash, but on the other hand you whine about not having a built-in wireless commander to do wireless flash with an external flash unit! Sounds like you're just grasping at straws looking for things to complain about, as your many posts here clearly show.

If you don't like the camera, just move along.

@T3: If you are too excited, just buy it and shut up. You don't need to influence other people to buy one crap. Everybody will buy with their own money, not yours. So, let others to decide what they want and what they don't want to buy.

You need to see this video to understand the importance of other focus point than center one. See all three part by Rudy Winston from Canon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAx86nblZ2g&feature=plcp

@AP7 - LOLOLOL. Do you realize what a buffoon you sound like? Of course camera manufacturers want to sell you on focus points. They've led people like you to believe that everyone NEEDS gazillion focus points to do any photography! But the reality is that it's not true. Go look at a Leica S2. It has one focus point. Go look at a Hasselblad H4D. One focus point. Go look at a Leica M10. One focus point. True, skilled photographers have, and still do, take great photos with just a single central focus point! Hahahahah.

@T3: LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL, You at last wake up after 16hours of deep sleep. Stop your stupid comparison. Many top quality Leica, Zeiss, etc. lenses are manual focus only, then why Canon produce AF lens. Better learn how to use off-center focus point to improve your photography. Still you have time to do. Nobody is asking for gazillion focus point.

Try to understand photography is pretty subjective. For example, many people know how to use flash, many people don't. Those who can't always say flash produce unnatural looking photos.

@George: Using central AF all the time should results in focus inaccuracy for larger aperture, which is specially true for FF sensor. If you insist of using central AF point, then what is the meaning of putting other points?

@BeanyPic: What a theory on pricing? Somebody should give you a novel prize on economics.

@T3: You are living in dark age in cave. You need to modernize yourself. Just wondering, why do you need to answer every post? Look like, you work in Canon? Don't need your biased opinion any more.

You need to see this video to understand the importance of other focus point than center one. See all three part by Rudy Winston from Canon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAx86nblZ2g&feature=plcp

@AP7 - You need to chill out, dude. Cameras with single central focus points are not "in dark age in cave." Go look at the recently updated Leica S2 medium format DSLR. It has one central focus point. Go look at recently introduced Hassy H5D. Or the Leica M rangefinders. Or go look at a PhaseOne 645DF, which has a whopping 3 focus points! All these very serious, and expensive, cameras have just 1-3 focus points.

True skilled photographers have, and still do, take great photos with a single central focus point. It's just that marketers have brainwashed everyone into thinking that you NEED a gazillion focus points to do any photography! Sure, certain types of photography absolutely benefit from multiple focus points. But there is plenty of other types of photography where it's not needed. Landscape, portrait, and still life photos certainly don't need all those focus points. Clearly, certain cameras are geared towards that type of photography. The 6D is one such camera.

Who said that you had to pick either or? They could've put both into the body.

"Who said that you had to pick either or?"

Well, the same can be said about any features: why don't they just put everything in the camera!?!

The reason is that adding these things add to the cost of the camera. It may not seem like much to the average consumer who thinks that there is no cost associated with anything, but the reality is that all these costs are considered.

You also have to remember that this is only the first 6D. In a year and half, or so, there will be a 6D MKII. Then a 6D MKIII. Then a 6D MKIV, etc. Eventually, a pop-up flash will "pop up" on one of these future models. Consumers always want everything *right now*, but companies need to stretch things out.

monygm get yourself a good flash, don't use low Guide numbers from build in flash. The Speedlight 270EX is a dream :)

I really like the idea of being able to control the camera from my phone. I LOVE built-in flashes.

But, there is no wireless commander also. Buying a flash unit does not solve wireless flash issue.

@AP7 - "Buying a flash unit does not solve wireless flash issue."

Of course it does. Why do you think it doesn't? The recently introduced compact Canon 90EX flash (introduced with the EOS M) has full wireless commander functionality. Plus, it's tiny, is taller than a built-in flash, and is more powerful.

Canon undeniably listened to their customers.

Canon listened to their potential customers continually whining about the lack of an "affordable" full frame.

As for the comment about DX lenses, Canon EF-S lenses are physically incompatible with a full-frame EF mount so there was never any way to give that functionality.

montygm. Have to disagree with all your comments so far. Great that we can on here now and again. I've sold and used cameras for the last 15 years and never and I mean never had I had someone (pro or not) moan about requiring GN9 to GN13 build in flash. It's actually a little running joke about the uselessness of built in flash in Mid range DSLR's.
Just wanted to give you another side to the story :)

@BeanyPic - I think you're right about the lack of a built-in flash. Its absence will not be a deterrent for the vast majority of people that are considering this camera. I'm sure Canon has done the studies to show this. I'm not ruling out a built-in flash showing up on a 6D MKII or MKIII, but for this initial offering, I don't think it's going to be a big deal for most people. Besides, you can always pick up a Canon 90EX, which is tiny, has full flash commander capabilities, is taller than a built-in (for better lens clearance), and is more powerful, too. And it won't draw power from the camera's battery.

EF-S on fullframe has technical issue on canon,
they specified it to make it possible for lenses to get closer to the sensor which means that there exists lenses that would come in contact with the mirror of a fullframe.
Nikon probably analyzed this before they came out with the DX mount.

It'll never be the same issue as the FD unless there is a big technology change like there was with autofocus and camera electronics.

There is no way that this camera will kill off APS-C DSLRs in the way you're predicting. Why would it, the sensors are always going to be more expensive for one, there is around 2.5 times as much material in a FF sensor than an APS-C one so APS-C will always rule the entry-level field.

Abhijith Kannankavil Well said :)

@Abhijith Kannankavil - so Canon expects 6D will be attached to L-series lenses (because non-L inexpensive Canon lenses are old, sluggish and they are incapable to reash 22MP sensor resolution)? And what's the purpose of combo of "cheap" body with expensive pro-grade lenses?

AF accuracy not only depends upon the fact that if the sensor is cross type or not. But also the resolving power of the lens used. So having cross type sensors may not help a lot if you are using a bad lens.
But, using a good lens will help a lot even if there is no cross point available.
And the best would be having cross sensors and a good lens.

For those that do not know what a cross-type AF sensor is, I strongly suggest that you Google it to learn about it. Someone here doesn't seem to get it that cross-type AF sensors increase accuracy. Think of a cross-type AF sensor as one that can see horizontal AND vertical lines. Without a cross-type sensor, that AF point can only see lines in one direction.

@nffeee: Canon got a huge number of complain from the users of 5D Mark III and 1DX because of using 61 point AF that makes photographers life difficult to choose one AF point out of 61.

Canon realizes the fault and design 6D using 11 AF point with only center cross so that photographer can now use 50mm f/1.2 lens and center point AF to focus and recompose and then get a blurry image !.

+1 to 2)
I'd say it's even better than Olympus (for portrait at least) and far better than Nikon (= greenish grey tint with super bright orange.)

i agree tony.. it looks like canon's damage control is creating new id's to or waking up sleeper cell dpr id's. the best part is s/he says "please" to try out canon's.

either way even a used 5D2 outperforms 6D and is probably cheaper now that D600 and D800 are out.

If you're not able to get what you want from a Nikon RAW, your're not able to get it from any other RAW. You should work on your skills.

@Lea5: That's true that I am not a PS wizard but it takes me just 5 minutes to get from a Canon RAW what I want.. it is of course subjective..

@Dan: As far as the Nikon service is concerned, I was in Morocco doing reportage for a newspaper and the grip of the D700 got unsticked. When I came back home, I called Nikon Service to get it repaired and they told me that I should not go in SO HOT places... they would not include it in the guarantee..it is incredibile and really hard to believe but it was like this... trust me!
As far as the glasses are concerned maybe I still miss to like their quality.. subjective..

@tonywong: sorry I just realized now that I did twice!
@Devendra: Of course I am working for Canon Secret Services;-)

Lea5 - why should anyone struggle with Nikon RAWs and processing, "work on skills" while they can get great result straight from the box of Canon or Sony body?

Also - think about all the beginners - they either settle down with Nikon never knowing the beauty of color, or get a better camera from competition.

Plastek-because you get any colour you want out of any camera. You just need to learn about the specifics of camera profiles. Doesn't matter if you use PS, Lightroom, NX, Canon's DPP, Phase One whatever. I had for many years Canon, used Fuji S3 and today I own a D4 and D800E. I can get out any colour I want.

@Lea5: You are almost right, everyone can get a personal white balance on any raw file of every camera. But you know that colours don't mean only white balance but also other things which are difficult to manage (colour gradations and so on). I saw in our website you are doing tons of post-production. You images are great but I have to say that it is not really the kind of photography which need strong chromatic counterpoints. Hope not to hurt you ;-)

I'm not a nikon user. but i think something like custom color profiles in post processing may help. Same in case of printing

Yawn, your boring me now...

Oh yeah.. I hate when I can't 'automate' my creativity.... O.o

Marike6, step back 6 inches, that will bring your VF 100%

Well I am impressed by its size, rigid body and lower price. AF points are normal for my use and am delighted by its innovative WiFi functionality. I don't want anything more.

All I care how it performs .. yet to be seen. I want it to perform better than 5dIII in DR and noise. That's all I care!

The D7000 has 39 AF point with 9 cross type AF sensors. How many does the 6D have? One. Yikes.

Ignore the troll.

My D7000 AF system worked fine, what 'flaw' are you talking about?

Always makes me chuckle every time someone rebuts with 'I haven't seen the problem, obviously doesn't exist'.... Just like with the D800..
It doesn't mater whether 'you' experienced any issues, if the manufacturer acknowledges an 'issue' then it was an issue.
The D7000 had issues with hot pixels and AF, the D800 had issues with AF points.. You can live in denial all you want, you can also go the manufacturers website and see what they did to address the issues..

Kayone, where have you been, it is a well documented problem numerous months after it was released(no bs). Good for you, you have a good copy.

you are a long time nikon user?? haha. that is the biggest joke - probably matching 6D's release

The D600 most likely has a different AF system than the D7000. There's a DX at the end of the name of the D7000's AF system. The D700 had better AF than the D300, so I expect/hope the same to be true for the AF systems of the D600 vs. D7000. But for now, we can only speculate.

Sounds like you didn't understand anything of what I said. I hope you will by both cameras, so you could compare them.

It's not enough my friend because in Europe you will pay 2000€! And why? Oh explain me this! I would pay the equivalent of 2000$ in €, if the camera is really good. For real-life people this is quite an amount; for the others, who dont have any real connection between their work and the money they are earning for it, naturally this doesn't matter. But then I don't really understand why you are looking at so cheapish products as the d600 or 6d; you have the big ones, and then Leica, naturally...