I thought a M11 was a M Mount!

That would depend on the experience of using this hypothetical camera. I can use my Leica M (thanks for noticing Nustfortubes) lenses on my Fujifilm bodies. The images are top notch but the experience is not the same as using them on an M body,

I would love to try the rangefinder style of shooting – but honestly – I don’t want to pay M11 prices – and I don’t want to mess with film. So – I am pretty much stuck.

Wow, that's a outstanding service I did not expect for.

cf782:

And yet, despite your concern about rangefinder cameras, the digital Ms sell well for Leica, have since the release of the the M9 in 2009, and especially since the release of the the M10 in early 2017.

Your Fuji cameras use a very very different system. Except that the bodies sort of look like rangefinders, they really have nothing to do with rangefinders.

Should you want a Leica that is shaped like a rangefinder but uses an EVF, there's the Q2. Its lens has better colour than any Fuji X100 model's lens.

My M9-P is over 9 years old now - bought in Aug 2012. Nice patina with the brass showing in places - and reasonable share of bumps and at least one drop on the sidewalk outside Westminster Abbey. No rangefinder calibration ever required.

King Penguin
This is why many buy a Leica. Folks don't get it.

wcan:

Not all Leica lenses are physically smaller than other full frame digital [close to] equivalents. Some are, eg the two Leica M 50MM f/2.0 lenses, and the M 50mm f/1.4 lens. These Leica M lenses, two of which were completely redone for digital, are also smaller than the 50mm f/1.4 Zeiss Milvus, and, of course, much smaller than the 55MM f/1.4 Zeiss Otus. If you don't know, both Zeisses are manual focus and at least optically more than excellent -- though the Otus has a problem blue tint to its images. (No, you can't remove the blue in post without compromising the image.)

So no, not really, BUT THEN YES plenty of AF Leica SL lenses are big, like other AF full framed lenses of the same focal lengths.

Interesting comparison, one suggesting that Leica's optical engineering wisdom allows for smaller lenses: The Leica M 50MM f/0.95 (an astounding lens) is much smaller than the just very good manual focus Nikon Z of the same focal length and aperture.

@wcan - Leica rangefinder lens size is a product of manual focus, design philosophy, and design intention. Yes, manual focus lenses are generally smaller than AF counterparts. Leica M lenses are always designed with size in mind, attempting to maximize image quality while keeping the lens as small as possible.

Thirdly, Leica M lenses made in the film era have issues stemming from the need for light to hit the sensor at right angles. Lenses designed for film, especially small rangefinder lenses, often have issues with vignetting, smeared corners, red edges or even the Italian flag phenomenon. Lenses designed with digital sensors in mind have less of these issues.

Archiver:

"Leica M lenses are always designed with size in mind, attempting to maximize image quality while keeping the lens as small as possible."

Have you checked out the size of the Leica M 75mm Noctilux?

Wcan - That’s a lot to do with it but they basically design them to be as small as possible but to still have optical excellence…….

Nah, see my comment just above on my experience of using an M mount camera!

Honestly guys, you think the M series is just jewellery? Well, it’s definitely a ‘jewel’ of a camera, ie, no unnecessary gizmos & gimmicks, it’s a camera for people who know what they are doing and don’t need all these unnecessary aids to be able to take a decent picture!😎

I think it is jewelry, to a certain extent. Question; by those "unnecessary gizmos and gimmicks," do you mean things like AF, IBIS, high frame rate, and things like that?

;-)

IBIS = stabilisers on a child’s bicycle
Big sticky out grips on camera bodies = equiv. double handed spouty toddlers cups
AF = honestly, you can’t focus a camera?
High frame rate = spray and pray, where’s the skill in that?

Need I go on? 😎

IBIS allows me to shoot down to 1 second and get nice images. Show me something from the M11 shot handheld at 1 second. AF? Well, my eyes aren't what they used to be, and, well, tracking focus on moving subjects, whether it's an athlete or a bride walking down the aisle is a lot easier with good AF. And you spray and pray only if you want to. the M11 is OK, but severely limited compared to my current cam. And you really don't see the value of a good grip? Then again, if all you want is jewelry hanging around your neck, well...

Need I go on?

Dmanthree - well if you feel you need all those aids and gizmos assistants just to take a decent sharp picture, then good for you.

I don’t…………. as I know how to hold a camera properly and which setting to use!

….and how often do you take or even need to take a one sec hand-held image, that’s an extreme example isn’t it!

That’s like a city dweller justifying driving a massive 4x4 Landcruiser one mile to drop the kids off at school every day……….because the roads occasionally get frosty for a day or two during the winter!

Over the top and unnecessary!

Most jewelry nt so functional.
This is the history of modern photography.
Working pros would say we don't need this or that and then they adopt it rapidly,.
But, really. We do not need eye-focus, or AF. King Penguin gets it.
Does every camera have to be the same.
Would love Cosina to (re-issue) a digital version of Bessa RF cameras.

Gesture:

That was an Epson (which is some part of Mitsubishi) in a Cosina/Bessa rangefinder body.

I second your point that jewelry [usually] ain't so functional.

To your very valid question: "Does every camera have to be the same?", I'd add the question: "Why if you're not going to use/buy some other camera/system do you really care what it does or doesn't do?" And the only somewhat valid answer to my question is that the other system/camera does something you want but [usually] can't acknowledging wanting. Right, there are an number of invalid answers, I'm sure you can guess what some of those are.

@king: Uh....yes....having shot SLRs in the late 60s I learned how to hold a camera properly. I also shot lost of sports/action photos back then. But having those "gimmicks" does indeed help to get better shots. Not just for me, for a LOT of shooters! Tell me how many Leicas you see on the sidelines of any sporting event! So please, lose the snobbery. IBIS, AF, all those things DO help.

Dmanthree - woaw…….loose the heat, it’s only about a gadget!

I’m sure there are certain photographic applications when all those gizmos you seem so fond of may help you increase your ‘hit’ rate.

I don’t do sports photography, so therefore don’t need to carry around a spray and pray gizmo featured plastic high tech marvel with a huge rocket-launcher sized lens to take normal stuff, like most folk photograph, such as portraits, landscape, street, family stuff…………..you don’t actually need auto this and auto that, eye AF, IBIS and 30fps for this kind of photography do you………. 😁

Right. *your* needs are limited, therefore all those features are useless?

LOL...

dmanthree - everything is black and white with you isn’t it, I’m not saying those features are useless, I’m just saying I don’t need them and I appreciate and enjoy owning and using a camera without any of those unnecessary (for me) features…..what’s wrong with that!

@king: Uh...your initial "assessment" of those advanced features indicated as such.

"IBIS = stabilisers on a child’s bicycle
Big sticky out grips on camera bodies = equiv. double handed spouty toddlers cups
AF = honestly, you can’t focus a camera?
High frame rate = spray and pray, where’s the skill in that?"

Done here. Wear your jewelry with pride.

Dmanthree - you started it, calling Leica cameras jewellery then getting miffed when I responded with the reason why folk buy into the Leica M system!

……enjoy your gizmo with all those ‘aids’ to help you ‘nail the shot’, as I don’t need them I’ll just continue using my ‘jewel’ of a camera, the gorgeous M10, toodle pip…….

LOL...

All this from someone who has no photos in his gallery. Enjoy....and bye.

Dmanthree - are you on Flickr………I am and there ain’t many penguins there………happy snapping and may your EVF not run down your batteries too often………(not an issue for me BTW)…….😁

Why do these other brand articles have to turn into a fight? I wouldn’t ever buy this camera, but that doesn’t make it bad. Why not just leave it at that? If it’s still selling it means people place value in it. Therefore it’s worth it (to someone). That’s it.

Nope, not on Flickr. I did shoot a rodeo today and got over 400 shots on 3/4 of a battery. So that's not bad. Bye...again.

And that's why SLRs are morphing into MILCs. No need for a mirror.

@Max I like reading about these megathousand dollar dream cameras just like visting a zoo to watch elephants or gorillas. Then I happily use my A5100 which with its 24M apsc sensor can take (almost) as great pictures as these behemoths.

Oh it's definitely useful in lieu of NDs, I just don't understand why Sony seems to be the only one that doesn't habitually enable the fastest e-shutter possible by the sensor (their own sensors at that), it's an odd decision when everyone else is doing it to an extent. Doesn't get pointed out as a negative much either, I didn't even realize it was capped at 1/8000 on my A7R4 until I'd bought it and was using it.

For instance, other cameras, like Pentax k3iii didn't get coverage not even close, and there are probably more people interested in that camera that in the M11. But we all have priorities, or get them from external agents.

Pentax was never a favorite among DPR reviewers. I wonder how many articles were published about other cameras like the Hasselblad 907x, Zeiss ZX1 or Pixii rangefinder?

Have you seen what a 35mm kit lens cost? :)

Yes….so? 😊

You just need to be patient...wait 5-6 years and buy a used one for half the price. Unless you're rolling in money that's really the only way I could justify buying any Leica gear. I bought my M8, M240 and SL all used, though they all looked brand new.

Well...it's kind of a big deal if Leica is your thing...you don't see a new M camera very often. This isn't Sony with the 20th version of the A7 in 3 years.