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Leica announces Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH wide-angle lens

By dpreview staff on Oct 1, 2013 at 14:07 GMT

Leica has announced the Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH lens for its medium format S system. With an angle of view equivalent to a 35mm lens on full frame, it offers a classic moderate wide-angle field of view. Like several of the other S lenses it'll be available in two versions, either with or without an in-lens 'Central Shutter' (that allows flash sync at shutter speeds up to 1/1000 sec). At the same time, Leica is offering firmware updates for its S, S2 and S2-P cameras to give 'optimum functionality' with the lens. The Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH will be in dealers this month at a price of £4650, or £5500 for the CS model.

Press release:

New: LEICA ELMARIT-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH.

Class-leading standard wide-angle lens for the Leica S-System
 
Solms, Germany, 1 October 2013: Further defining the S-System as the ultimate solution for the most demanding professionals, Leica Camera AG has unveiled a new wide-angle lens, the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. Attaining class-leading critical levels of performance in all measurable areas, the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. sets new standards for wide-angle focal lengths in the medium format category. With this addition, the lens portfolio for the Leica S medium format system is now comprised of nine lenses (six of which are also available in a CS variant) with focal lengths ranging from 24 mm to 180 mm, assuring uncompromising imaging quality in almost all situations. Leica is also offering firmware updates FW 2.3.0.0 for the Leica S and FW 1.3.0.0 for the Leica S2 and S2-P, ensuring the optimum functionality of this new lens.

The equivalent angle of view of the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. corresponds to that of a classic 35 mm lens for 35 mm photography. Its moderate wide-angle with neutral reproduction of perspectives makes this versatile lens not only ideal for landscapes and architectural photography, but also in the studio or on location. At the same time, the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH.’s fast maximum aperture of f/2.8 makes it an optimal tool for available-light photography and the conscious use of selective planes of focus. Thanks to its brilliant colour rendition and outstanding imaging performance from the closest focus to infinity at all apertures, the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. guarantees perfect results in any photographic situation.

The Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. was developed to meet the stringent demands that professional users place on a camera system in their everyday photographic work and guarantees superior image quality. It offers maximum contrast rendition, highest resolution and extremely low distortion, even wide open. This lens also offers excellent control of flare to ensure high-contrast images, even when shooting a backlit subject. This results from its extremely elaborate optical design and construction: A total of twelve lenses are employed to achieve the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH.’s exceptional optical performance. Three lenses made from glass with anomalous partial dispersion minimise chromatic aberrations, and two further lenses are manufactured from glass with particularly low dispersion. An additional lens element with an aspherical surface minimises monochromatic aberrations. Rear-group focusing guarantees consistently outstanding imaging properties from infinity to its closest focusing distance.

As with all Leica S-System products, the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. is rugged and reliable, and designed to offer a particularly long operational lifespan. Ensuring absolute dependability, even under the harshest shooting conditions, the lens features an extremely robust bayonet mount and is fully sealed against dust and spray.

Pricing and availability

The Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH., with and without an integrated central shutter, will be available in the UK from authorised Leica dealers including the Leica Store Mayfair, www.leica-storemayfair.co.uk, tel: 020 7629 1351, starting October 2013. The lens is supplied complete with a rectangular lens hood optimised for the ray paths of light entering the optical system. The suggested retail price for the Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH. without an integrated central shutter is £4,650 including VAT; the SRP for the lens with central shutter is £5,500 including VAT.

Leica Elmarit-S 45 mm f/2.8 ASPH Specifications

Lens type  Fast wide-angle lens with one aspherical element for exceptional imaging performance 
Compatible cameras All Leica S-Models
Angle of view  ~ 62°, 53°, 37° (diagonal, horizontal, vertical),
corresponds to approx. 36 mm in 35 mm format
Optical design Number of lenses/groups: 12/9, aspherical surfaces: 1, position of entrance pupil: 83.95 mm / 83.95 mm (at infinity/closest focusing distance, in light impingement direction in front of the bayonet flange) 
Focusing range  Working range: 0.6 m to ∞, scales: Combined metre/feet scales, smallest image field/largest reproduction ratio: ~ 456 x 304 mm/1:10.1
Iris/aperture settings  Electronically controlled iris, f-stops selectable in half-stop increments with the click wheel on the camera, smallest aperture value f22 
Flash sync speed (CS-vers.)  1/1000 s (1/125 s without central shutter) 
Bayonet  Leica S quick-change bayonet with contact strip for Leica S-Models 
Filter mount  Threaded mount for E82 filters, non-rotating filter mount 
Lens hood  Lens hood with bayonet mount (supplied with the lens) 
Finish  Black anodized 
Dimensions  Length to bayonet flange : ~ 136/163 mm (with/without lens hood), largest diameter ~ 88/132 mm (with/without lens hood) 
Weight  ~ 1030/1110 g (with/without central shutter)

Comments

Total comments: 152
stevesphotoart
By stevesphotoart (6 months ago)

Always wondering how people post comments about products they don't know and don't use. Finally, the price is the only remining argument (ah this ferrari is to expensive to go shopping etc) as the price is the only thing everyone can judge (on his personal budget).

Using the S-System now for more than two years (together with Nikon), I can say that the quality is outstanding, even compared with top notch DSLRs. It's NOT only the quality of the lenses, it's the combination of camera/sensor/focus/lens that make this system so unique. Of course, there are things you can't do with it (sports, low light, Tele), but for everything else the package is unmatched.

3 upvotes
InTheMist
By InTheMist (6 months ago)

Covet, yes!

Buy, no.

1 upvote
starwolfy
By starwolfy (6 months ago)

Seems people are too used to "Made in China" pricing these days, so they don't really have a clue of the real value of things.

That means: paying your skilled employee well, have a lot of social advantages because our society is developed, long and paid holidays, decent working hours, rights, will make your products very good but expensive.

In an other hand, of course you can like in China make your products built by almost unpaid ants, with no social advantages, no holidays, mediocre working condition, mediocre life.

It will much cheaper to make...so usual buyers will be much happier too and they won't complain at anything until they lose their own job because they cannot produce as cheap as those ants so their own company has to move in Asia in order to satisfy their "always cheaper customer's philosophy".

I am into the M system, and I am proud to buy "Made in Europe" because it means something.

8 upvotes
Marty4650
By Marty4650 (6 months ago)

Well... it's your money.

Feel free to spend it however you choose.

1 upvote
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

"Made in Germany" sounds more like "Packaged in Germany."

0 upvotes
pfzt
By pfzt (6 months ago)

"built by almost unpaid ants, with no social advantages, no holidays, bad working conditions…"

What people do not understand is that you need to have a highly developed society to achieve true quality in your products. With the above-mentioned conditions you'll always end up building crap.

Comment edited 52 seconds after posting
3 upvotes
nikos theodosiou
By nikos theodosiou (6 months ago)

Leica's S2 is a great camera I have used done, however as with most things Leica they are about three years behind everyone else!
37.8MP is not that special nowadays with the Phase One IQ backs going up to 80MP and Hasselblad having 60MP.
Probably the best MF camera out there at the moment is the Hasselblad H5D 200MS yes 200MP!
If you compare the files the HD5 takes against the S2 its like Halina compact!
If Leica really want to get pros to use their S2 they need to speed things up hugely! Nice camera but they live in the past!

0 upvotes
Den Sh
By Den Sh (6 months ago)

H5D 200MS doesn't have 200MP. It has only 50 and merges multiple shots in software to get to simulated 200 (called super resolution technique). This can be done with any other camera in post processing with software like PhotoAcute.

2 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

nikos--

Does that Hasselblad take Zeiss lenses? Or is it limited to just those nice, not extraordinary, Fuji lenses?

Then did Fuji reengineer the lenses so the light is perpendicular to the entirety of the sensor plane?

I assume that Den Sh's correction above is valid, but more to the point, what is this obsession with more pixels? Are you doing an eight by two and a half meter print?

0 upvotes
MrSkelter
By MrSkelter (5 months ago)

The Leica was built ground up as a digital camera. Even the newest Sony, Nikon and Canon DSLR's are built to take legacy lenses. That puts Leica ahead of everyone bar m4/3 as a digital native system.

Also pixels aren't the same as resolution and acuity. Look at the Sigma DP cameras for how much you can get out of 15MP without a bayer filter. Similarly the Leica S out-resolves Phase One in many circumstances due to better lenses and integration.

I own Hassy's and I want to buy a Leica. The Leica is better now and - when the resolution improves, those S lenses will remain capable. Simply the best glass available.

0 upvotes
Vitruvius
By Vitruvius (6 months ago)

A 45mm medium format lens is not 35mm equivalent on "full frame". Perhaps the Leica system is not true medium format. Even so there is 6x4.5 or 6x6, or 6x7 etc.

0 upvotes
M Jesper
By M Jesper (6 months ago)

It's the size of the Pentax 645D.
Hasselblad: 54 x 40mm
Leica S: 45 x 30 mm
645D: 44 x 33 mm
FF: 36 x 24 mm
APSC: 24 x 16 mm

0 upvotes
M Jesper
By M Jesper (6 months ago)

Basically 4:3 for Pentax vs 3:2 for Leica. :)

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

in terms of sensor area,
Leica S is about 0.64 stops larger than 35mm full-frame,
while it's 0.76 stops for Pentax 645D.
or about the same difference between APS-C and 4/3".

I think 6x6 can be used as "standard medium format" and
it's 1.86 stops larger than 35mm format.

Comment edited 4 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
ogl
By ogl (6 months ago)

All formats bigger than 24*36 mm and till 70*56 mm are medium formats. It's digital era and the manufacturers are free to produce and use any size for sensors.

3 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

@ogl, of course makers have the rights to make whatever they want. we are not talking about what makers can do or should do but what their products can do.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (6 months ago)

Why would anybody use that system vs say D800 with Sigma 35/1.4?

0 upvotes
nikos theodosiou
By nikos theodosiou (6 months ago)

Errmm.....because its better?!
For a pro or an enthusiast with deep pockets its a great system but its not the cost its the availability that's the issue as you need to be very patent being a Leica owner! As far as quality goes different league to a D800 and Sigma lens!

3 upvotes
brendon1000
By brendon1000 (6 months ago)

If you have to ask then this system is not for you ! A Leica S2 will never outperform a D800 or any DSLR at high ISOs. It simply can't. However in a studio setup where light is under your control its simply better than any DSLR out there.

Most of the better product photographers use medium format cameras. You will never see sports pros using them and few wedding photographers also.

4 upvotes
shigzeo ?
By shigzeo ? (6 months ago)

I'm a product photographer who would very much like to move up to an S in the next few years. D800 is great, but it is just a stop gap vs. a better 'medium' format with larger dynamic range, better flash sync speed, speedier controls and a lot more.

4 upvotes
audijam
By audijam (6 months ago)

If I shoot still pornography S2 system is my choice....details = $$$

Since i shoot wedding I need SPEED....I choose 5DIII

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (6 months ago)

"Errmm.....because its better?!"

Any proof of that?

0 upvotes
Paul Guba
By Paul Guba (6 months ago)

I loved my Leica cameras when I had them M2, M4, M6. At the time they were some of the best cameras functionally, compact, quiet, great although limited lens selection.

I really believe what is left the status and image of years gone by. They still make great lenses however Leica was never a technology company and much of todays cameras are about technology.

I do not doubt that this lens will preform well it better at that price. I am sure the build quality is superb.

The user base remains a small group of well financed enthusiastic amateurs that want what they think is the best and are willing to pay for it. Nothing wrong with that.

3 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

this is definitly overpriced in any sense , Leica S is not real MF , it does not even allow us to swap backs.
the real digital MF is called Phase One , I do not even consider current digital Hassel Blad as real MF system(it is not Fullframe MF).
anyway, this lens should be priced around 3k , think about even the large format or real MF Rodenstock lenses cost only 4 -5k , so people who are not collector or brainwashed Leica name lover never pay this kind of money for just 37.5 mp camera system using gens behind Kodak CCD.
in fact , this camera does not resolve any better than the cheap Nikon D800E, Lloyd proved it, if you do not believe this , go Lu-la or Getdpi MF forums or even better go directly to Lloyd's site, he compared the Zeiss 135mm APO for F vs Leica 125mm f2.5 for the S , and the Zeiss was sharper.

that said , I love my Leica M 9 , and I think I will get the M240 soon with the 50mm f2 APO, the new 50mm f2APO is a great lens , with exquisite modern barrel design.

0 upvotes
mgrum
By mgrum (6 months ago)

The Hasselblad H4D-60 has a 54x40mm sensor, so it's not just phase. The S2 is rather small to be calling itself medium format though.

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

S2 belongs to a category that may be called "APS medium format."

645 is the minimum that I call medium format and S2 has a lens factor of 1.31 to 645 (1.52 to 6x6 120 format).

the difference between S2 and 35mm format is 0.64 stops.

Comment edited 4 times, last edit 10 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

3sys:

Okay Leica went for a DLSR body, not a swappable back.

Too bad about the Fuji lenses for modern Hasselblads.

You clearly realize that Leica makes good lenses, but seem to think the sensor in the M9 is good and the one in the S2 isn't. Both sensors are plenty good, but only at lower ISOs. And it's not like there are too many MF backs that can easily shoot at ISO 640, like the Leica S2.

That Zeiss 135mm F2.0 lens is considered the best in the world, and is manual focus--easy enough I know.

Drop the "resolve" thing being the only important attribute of a lens. No one is saying that Zeiss lenses can't be sharp, or that a good Zeiss on the D800e is a bad combination.

1 upvote
ogl
By ogl (6 months ago)

All formats bigger than 24*36 mm and till 70*56 mm are medium formats. It's digital era and the manufacturers are free to produce and use any size for sensors.

2 upvotes
Scorpius1
By Scorpius1 (6 months ago)

Hasselblad 60 sensor is same size as Phase ones biggest sensor.. You clearly know nothing about medium format cameras.. as for Lloyd's test.. it was not the 135mm but the 100mm macro and it was a very simple test at a close distance.. lets try the test under various condition's and distances..and try autofocusing your Zeiss or flash syncing at 1/1000th sec or even compare the huge viewfinder of the S against the Nikon's..

Color from the leica S is also very very good..

0 upvotes
Samuel Dilworth
By Samuel Dilworth (6 months ago)

Interesting lens. It’s just a shame that every Leica press-release prompts:

• shock real or faux that there exist lenses over $1000
• indignation that Leica has the gall to charge that for rubbish
• ripostes that Leica is not rubbish, but instead comparable to [tasteless supercar]
• slurs on all and sundry.

If the comments were worth reading they’d encourage others to post things worth reading. As it is, they attract more nonsense. Look: here I am talking about the comments instead of the lens!

If you know where I can see the MTF chart for this new lens, let me know below.

5 upvotes
Vingolfer
By Vingolfer (6 months ago)

The MTF chart is here (English version apparently not available yet):

http://www.s.leica-camera.com/DOWNLOADS

Close range performance wide open seems rather mediocre for an S lens, but otherwise what one could expect. It would be interesting to know more about color correction, but as usual that will have to wait until someone actually uses the lens.

What I really find shocking is that Leica issues a press release with a photo so blurry that it might well have been taken with a pocketcam. Same on their own product page.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 1 minute after posting
1 upvote
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Sam:

The thing about the Veyron, you can call it "tasteless", and I sort of agree, but it has extraordinary performance--like the Leica.

Ferrari F50

Zonda

Koenigsegg, this last has a manual gear box.

There are plenty of Nikon, Olympus and Canon lenses that retail for more than 1000usd.

0 upvotes
white shadow
By white shadow (6 months ago)

If DPR is touching on the Digital Medium Format Camera territory, they should at least do some reviews on these medium format cameras and the lenses.

I think there are just too many "less informed" audience out there.

Imagine comparing this lens with a Sigma 35mm f/1.4 or even worse, Micro 4/3 lenses.

Comment edited 10 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
white shadow
By white shadow (6 months ago)

Yes, DPR did a quick review on the S2 on 27/02/2012.

They are just too few of these reviews around.

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

there is nothing wrong with the 4/3" format and Cosina 17.5mm f/0.95 should at least have a larger aperture than this Leica (18.4 > 16.1 mm).

what current m4/3" cameras cannot do is their wells are not deep enough to match ISO80 on S2 (ISO100 on 4/3" is comparable to ISO600 on S2).

0 upvotes
pfzt
By pfzt (6 months ago)

"I think there are just too many "less informed" audience out there."

Well put! And every time there is news about Leica, they quickly call in their meeting on Dpreview, which is already their favorite spot. Some comments here are really embarrassing.

0 upvotes
thx1138
By thx1138 (6 months ago)

These seem rather cheap for a Leica. Did dpreview perhaps omit a zero :)

2 upvotes
DenWil
By DenWil (6 months ago)

This is not student oriented equipment. For folks who bill 50 Gs a day a 5 G lens is simply not an issue if the length or other characteristics will pay off.

For comparison the Pentax 25mm for Pentax 645D is 5Gs. The 90mm 4250$. Considering the legendary quality of Leica optics their prices are very comparable.

A Canon 200mm f2 is 6Gs. What people will pay for an f2 when they can't frame efficiently with an f4 is what's amazing. Logo notwithstanding.

7 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

well, if it's "photographic lens" that we are talking about, we better compare lenses at similar angle of views (perspective) which is one of the most important element in photograph.

also anyone who take photos should know that f-number is not a photographic element (it's for a technical detail, unit area exposure calculation, not photographic effect).

Comment edited 56 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
Paul Guba
By Paul Guba (6 months ago)

I have a pretty large circle of pros I grew up with in the business. I don't know of any that has ever shot with a Leica S2 on a job.

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

Leica may sell up to 100 sets of S2 each month, probably to those who seldomly shoot photos.

1 upvote
Iskender
By Iskender (6 months ago)

"Leica may sell up to 100 sets of S2 each month, probably to those who seldomly shoot photos."

So, when are you getting yours?

7 upvotes
Sam Carriere
By Sam Carriere (6 months ago)

Amazing what some people will pay for a logo.

3 upvotes
Tom_A
By Tom_A (6 months ago)

Amazing how quickly you make assumptions. This is definitely a price inline with other professional lenses, even rather competitive in the medium format world. And the quality will more than likely be up to scratch.

5 upvotes
mumintroll
By mumintroll (6 months ago)

Tom_A

Really? So tell me which non zoom lens FF cost more or is even comparable in price?

Comment edited 32 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
gefrorenezeit
By gefrorenezeit (6 months ago)

Find one with compareable output and we can begin to compare the prices. ;)

0 upvotes
brendon1000
By brendon1000 (6 months ago)

@mimintroll - Why are you comparing a smaller format like FF to medium frame ? Compare it to other medium format lenses !

Its like saying a replacement steering wheel of a Ferrari costs so much more than a steering wheel of a Ford Mustang.

0 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

hey, Leica is not even good , if you really need a real optical marvel, get any of Rodenstock's HR series lenses or Leica 50mm f2 APO

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?Ntt=Rodenstock+HR&N=0&InitialSearch=yes&sts=ma&Top+Nav-Search=

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
Tom_A
By Tom_A (6 months ago)

Mumintrol's question proves that he doesn t even know what MF is. Keep on shooting pictures of ducks in the local park.

0 upvotes
Scorpius1
By Scorpius1 (6 months ago)

Have you used an S?? I doubt you have,it a fantastic piece of equipment and half the price of a phase IQ180

0 upvotes
Richard Murdey
By Richard Murdey (6 months ago)

Now I'm curious. Has anyone every seen a Leica S2 in the wild? Outside of a store.

I have not, but then that's really not surprising. I imagine these are used by fashion journalists or something like that, where cheaper medium format camera like the 645D/Leaf would be considered too bulky. Though even there I can't help but wonder if a Canon 5DmkIII would serve just as well.

In short, who actually uses these cameras?

Comment edited 32 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
Tom_A
By Tom_A (6 months ago)

I read that they sell reasonably well, they are an interesting alternative to Hasselblads, which you don't see often in the wild either. These are not really walkaround cameras.

4 upvotes
gefrorenezeit
By gefrorenezeit (6 months ago)

IIf the conditions are ok for it (enough light, not too fast action) it will smoke those canons and nikons. As any medium camera does. Its hard to grasp, but those canon and nikons are not the top of image quality - they are often only just good enough (or just plain cheap).

1 upvote
AndreaV
By AndreaV (6 months ago)

I just noticed a few days ago the winner of one of the challeges used a Leica S2: http://www.dpreview.com/challenges/Entry.aspx?ID=775240&View=Results&Rows=4
The photos looks actually amazing to me! :)

0 upvotes
white shadow
By white shadow (6 months ago)

The Leica S2 is not made for people who are just rich. It is for professional photographers who require higher resolution, more dynamic range and detail than 35mm full frame cameras like the Canon 5D Mk3 could offer. It is not for sport or wildlife photographers either.

Most medium format cameras are used in the studio or for specific landscape photography where detail and high dynamic range are mandatory.

For a medium format camera, the S2 is actually quite portable and easy to handle. If you are really a professional landscape photographer, having one may make your life easier.

Just like in the movie industry, they use Arri Cine cameras and Zeiss lenses you won't see the average tourist would use for home videos.

Comment edited 3 minutes after posting
1 upvote
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

well, the reality is no one use Leica S for professional work, maybe some but not many I mean.
if they really need real MF cameras , they go directly to Phase or Leaf backs with Rodenstocks optics.
if Leica S lenses are really as good as Rodenstock HR series lenses ,especially the 40mm , then many might take it a bit more seriously but you know?
and this Leica is not modular camera , at this price , it should be modular and allow you to swap backs.

0 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

well , white shadow, you must be wrong, since we see Phase and Hassy quite often in any large city in the world but most of us never see any Leica S camera in real life.
I love my M film and digital cameras but I do not really understand why Leica made this huge mistake with this fake MF camera.

0 upvotes
peevee1
By peevee1 (6 months ago)

"IIf the conditions are ok for it (enough light, not too fast action) it will smoke those canons and nikons. As any medium camera does."

Any proof of that? Because on DxOMark, medium format sensors rate quite low, not only in high ISO but also in landscape/DR, and not on top even in color depth (which is already plenty on any camera).

0 upvotes
Leica User
By Leica User (6 months ago)

I changed from Hasselblad H4D to Leica S2 three years ago because of the complete unreliability of the H4D for landscape work, especially involving the mountains of north western Europe - in short it broke down on too many occasions, most of which were at completely the wrong moment and I would suspect that most modular construction cameras would be prone to doing the same because of the real lack of proofing against the elements. The Leica (I have now moved to the S type 006 which is a meaningful improvement over the S2) has never failed me in driving rain and freezing conditions from Iceland and Arctic Norway to the mountain summits of Scotland and the quality of the lenses and sensor combination is nothing short of superb. I cannot comment on Nikon, but I can on Canon, Hasselblad and Olympus M43, and can confidently say that, although the Leica S has drawbacks (which camera system is perfect?) it beats anything from other systems I have experienced into the proverbial cocked hat.

1 upvote
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

peevee1:

DXO scores for sensors are more useless than their scores for lenses. Because the sensors scores ignore the lenses and the computer processing the data.

0 upvotes
white shadow
By white shadow (6 months ago)

@ Leica User

You are right. A lot of people do not appreciate or understand the benefit of using the Leica S2. It is made for a special purpose and for certain photographers like you.

It is a great travel photographer camera for those who want quality above that of the 35mm format.

It is similar to those very portable medium format film cameras that Fuji made years ago. Unfortunately, Fuji is not making a digital version of them. Perhaps, they may do in the future. I believe there is a market for them.

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
Iskender
By Iskender (6 months ago)

3systermuser:
Things can exist without you seeing them, you know. Especially when the entire market is something like 6000 new cameras a year. Since these cameras are kept for a long time, Leica can coneivably sell them for years before they start visibly displacing the other brands.

1 upvote
Greg in London
By Greg in London (4 months ago)

3systermuser has a rather uniformed reply there are plenty of pro's using the "S' series leica as its a great alternative to the "H" series.
Speaking as a pro in London I am really pleasantly surprised how many people are using them and the great support here including rental for extra bits.

0 upvotes
reedjecd
By reedjecd (6 months ago)

we had enough of 3x2 sensors with the 135 film format, Leica iteration with a 3x2 sensor on the S2 is in my view a burden, 4x3 is the go or 1x1

0 upvotes
Apewithacamera
By Apewithacamera (6 months ago)

What Brand of UV protector filter wood be good for this lense?

9 upvotes
zevobh
By zevobh (6 months ago)

ha!

1 upvote
Apewithacamera
By Apewithacamera (6 months ago)

:-P

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Leica or B+W.

1 upvote
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

is there any Leica that's made of wood?

0 upvotes
jon404
By jon404 (6 months ago)

Yes, didn't they make one? Or maybe that was for one of those Sigma Foveon cameras. Somebody, anyway, got carried away and made a wood body recently.

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

jon404--

No Leica did not make a wood S2 or M9. (Bet you can find an M6 covered exotic leather though.)

Yes there was a wooden Sigma body--though that may have been just a joke.

And there was the "Hasselblad" version of the Sony RX100 with the wooden handgrip.

1 upvote
Sam Carriere
By Sam Carriere (6 months ago)

Hasselblad made a wood-bodied Sony NEX 7.

0 upvotes
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (6 months ago)

I'd go with a Spiratone or an Aetna Rokunar Skylight. One of the coated ones. Otherwise, Heliopan. They have the coolest name and they cost the most so they must be superior to everything else.

1 upvote
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Sam--

That too, I knew I was forgetting some dumb Sonyblad.

0 upvotes
Zerg2905
By Zerg2905 (6 months ago)

It's like buying (and driving it yourself) the Mercedes S (or even a bigger "chariot"): an out of this world car, but not for me. I like kevlar, ceramics and "4 motion" V12 or W16... Cheers! :):):)

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Leica lenses a significantly better lenses than all Mercedes autos, save maybe the cars that cost $400,000.

Right the VW Veyron has what a W12?

0 upvotes
jon404
By jon404 (6 months ago)

Zerg, you could do worse than a used VW Phaeton sedan... absolutely great quality, inexpensive now. Or, if you could bring yourself to stoop to lesser V-8s, a used Cadillac XLR roadster. Great cars!
*and a whole lot less than the Leica package!

0 upvotes
RichRMA
By RichRMA (6 months ago)

Diff, between the Leica lens and the Mercedes. The Leica won't be worth 50% of its original cost, 3 years from now.

2 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

RichRMA,

And then of course in 9 years that Merc will have faults that cost more to fix than the car is worth--which will be an 8th of the original cost.

Comment edited 36 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

Leica S lenses are nothing special , Rodenstocks are and Leica M lenses are.

0 upvotes
Iskender
By Iskender (6 months ago)

3systermuser: Do you have to post your Rodenstock endorsement in *every* subthread here? I think we got it after one or two times.

Also, you run risk of sounding like a shill if you keep parroting a brand like that.

2 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@ 3systermuser

Eh?! Are you serious??!!!

I have posted numerous comments criticizing Leica, but even I wouldn't make the claim that Leica S lenses are nothing special because .............. they are awesome.

Go to Ming Thein's site for example to see a comparison of the Leica S2 -v- Nikon D800 to see how good those Leica S lenses are.

1 upvote
Scorpius1
By Scorpius1 (6 months ago)

@3systermuser..."Leica S lenses are nothing special" really..have you used them..??I have. they are simply excellent..

0 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

Why are people complaining about the price of lenses on a camera they will never even OWN?

If you want to complain about the price of a Leica lens you should at least own the camera otherwise your complaints are irrelevant.

When you buy into a camera system you do so willingly, knowing that lenses are part of the price equation.

I love my Sigma 35mm f/1.4, but I wouldn't buy a Sigma lens to slap on my $22,000 camera body.

17 upvotes
white shadow
By white shadow (6 months ago)

You are absolutely correct. At DPR forums, there are just too many people just enjoy complaining about things.

Like any medium format digital cameras, they are not made for the average hobbyist who want to take some snapshots. These are made for professional photographers who shoot cars, models for fashion or cosmetic companies and landscape. Top quality and detail are a must.

The price is actually quite reasonable.

Try Phase One or Hasselblad instead if you think they are cheaper.

1 upvote
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

and people complain about sarin that they never breathe.

Comment edited 7 minutes after posting
2 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

Pentax 645D sounds a more reasonable option but it's still not as good as Nikon (the only issue may be the low resolution of D800).

Comment edited 23 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
jon404
By jon404 (6 months ago)

Gee, you mean I can't get a Sigma 1.4 adapter for my Leica S? How the mighty have fallen, indeed.

0 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

I'll be interested to see if 45/2.8 can have better bokeh than Sigma 35/1.4 (aspherical usually means "dirty trick" these days).

1 upvote
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@JDThomas

I think your attitude is totally wrong for if one followed your line then it would stifle ambition; some folks might be complaining because they would one day like to own a medium format system and these high prices just keep them from ever owning such a kit.

Further, generally, Leica prices are a rip off; their lenses are not leagues better than Zeiss glass but look at the price differences (admittedly Zeiss make a lot more money so perhaps have better scalability in pricing) and how on earth do Leica justify selling a £300 Metz flash for over £500 just because they put their logo on it (oops! that's the justification!!)

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

plevy--

Zeiss lenses are excellent, but Zeiss didn't nearly bankrupt itself. Zeiss is a much bigger company. And clearly uses Japanese and Hungarian plants and subcontractors. Plus licenses its name more than Leica.

Right the price of Leica (Metz) flash is stupid. But just buy the Metz and use it.

0 upvotes
gefrorenezeit
By gefrorenezeit (6 months ago)

And another well informed post from yabokkie... If you had the Sigma you would know that it does not always has a nice bokeh. I do shot it.

1 upvote
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

White Shadow , the Phase are real camera system , not toy like this extremely over priced half frame junk.

Comment edited 25 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
3systermuser
By 3systermuser (6 months ago)

anyone has the money and knows about photography go Phase but not Leica S or HB since Leica uses a couple of gens behind sensor tech from Kodak, and S system cannot go FF MF because of mount diameter.

0 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

@plevyadophy : Your argument doesn't make any sense. MF digital cameras have always been expensive. My MF FILM camera cost more than my top of the line SLR at the time too.

How is it "stifling ambition"? If someone aspires to own a Leica MF camera in the future then the reality is they are going to have to have the ambition to build a business that can afford it or just save up. Or they can wait 20 years and buy old technology.

As Zeiss lenses go, the prices of Zeiss lenses are reflected in their manufacturing. They are made in Japan at the SAME plant as the Voigtländer lenses. The Voigts are much less expensive than the Zeiss lenses with similar quality. Right there you are paying for the Zeiss name.

Leica lenses are made in Germany in smaller numbers, higher paid craftsmen, under stricter quality control.

In any case the real point of my argument still stands. I don't go to car websites and complain about the cost of a Lamborghini. It doesn't matter. I can't afford one.

0 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

And as far as Yobkkie goes...

I don't read his comments. They never make sense.

1 upvote
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@JDThomas,

Your main point is taken (Lamborghini).

But I think you have bought into the myth of Leica a little too much. Zeiss stuff is every bit as well made as Leica stuff (see Roger Cicala's teardown of the new Zeiss Touit lenses) but admittedly Zeiss labour costs are probably lower and they are a bigger company with a wider portfolio so can afford to make cheaper gear (but still, having said that, Leica still take outrageous liberties with their price markup e.g. their SF58 flash at circa £550 which is nothing more than a Metz flash with a Leica red dot, and the Metz equivalent costs around £300; so approximately 66% markup for nothing more than the red dot!).

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

plevyadophy:

Nobody is claiming that Leica S lenses are much better than Zeiss medium format lenses, though Leica did reengineer the S system lenses so the light is perpendicular to the sensor plane across the entirety of the sensor.

And Zeiss isn't really making MF lenses--the ones for the Contax system were, I believe, the last new ones. Yes I know that some can still be used on cameras like ironically the Leica S2.

Stop with the overpriced Leica version of the Metz flash. Few buy a flash because it says Leica on it, whereas many seek out systems that use Leica lenses.

0 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@HowaboutRAW

I simply use the flash thing to illustrate a point, namely that a great deal of what one pays for in a Leica lens or camera is just excessive markup due to snob value.

Their pocket digicams, which are just Panasonic cams with a red dot on, are another example of Leica rip-off.

A Leica Noctilux should NOT cost what it does (as excellent as it is) especially given that nearly every reviewer who has tested it against the Voigtlander f1.1 equivalent say that for one-tenth the price you get about 85% the performance (and I have used both and own one).

The Leica S lenses are awesome but ................ so too is the price of the S system (awesome in the wrong way).

0 upvotes
Hauer
By Hauer (6 months ago)

Lens pricing seems to be going through the roof!

0 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Not particularly.

Try buying one of the really good Olympus 4/3s zooms for less than $3000.

3 upvotes
HomoSapiensWannaBe
By HomoSapiensWannaBe (6 months ago)

I would like to have the ability to sync full flash output at 1/1000th with my Nikon DSLR. Maybe one day in the near future we'll have fully electronic focal plane shutters that can sync at this and higher speeds.

1 upvote
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

search "auto FP high speed sync" in your manual, though it will result less light (1/4 guide number at 1/1000s shutter).

Comment edited 20 seconds after posting
0 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

They had electronic shutters back in the D70/D100 days. They were doable with CCD sensors but not with CMOS because of the way the data is transferred.

To have a high speed sync you need a global electronic shutter which isn't feasible with CMOS technology. Hence the rolling shutter which causes the "jello effect" in video. If a global shutter could easily be implemented in a CMOS it would have been done already to cure the video problem that everyone hates so much.

Even when using a global shutter with CCD's there were drawbacks such as blooming when very bright objects such as the sun were in the frame.

1 upvote
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

@JDThomas,

it works on entry level DSLRs (that support CLS) and it works on F6 (film camera).

Canon call it "high-speed sync (FP flash)" and it's also from film age. a random search hit:
http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Home/Product_Finder/Cameras/SLR/EOS_30/

btw, FP means focal plane shutter.

Comment edited 5 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@yabokkie

You are completely missing the point. With today's Canon and Nikon cameras you CAN NOT sync flash at anywhere near 1/1000 sec and at FULL POWER but with the Leica you can and you can do even better with a Phase One medium format system (which can sync at fuller power down to a shutter speed as fast as 1/1600s).

FP/HSS Mode and such like is just trickery and you lose a good three quarters of your flash output when your camera is set to these trick modes; it's better than nothing, but a Leica or Phase One flash sync is WAY better.

2 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

I did remember to mention 1/4 guide number, which makes SB-900 a small built-in flash at 1/1000s that we have to set it much closer to the subject (why 50mm lens is good for beach).

I'm not saying lens shutter is useless, only there is not much real difference (rare requirements can be done with extra effort).

Comment edited 5 minutes after posting
0 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@yabokkie

eh?!!

Try shooting outside on a sunny day when you have a big set i.e. you need a wide angle lens to fit in your entire composition or have to step back a great distance. You will be at a good distance from your subject and so too will your lights; you will either need big powerful lights or small lights assisted by a fast flash sync speed (personally, I prefer the latter).

I know for me there is night and day difference between working with a slow sync speed cam and a fast one; the fast one just gives you so much more freedom and flexibility.

I think both Leica and Phase One are to be applauded for giving photographers such good sync speeds (of course, they will likely lose that loveiliness when they move over to CMOS sensors)

0 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

@Yabokkie:
You obviously have a tenuous grasp on how actual flash sync works. The High Speed Sync and FP Sync on Canon and Nikon flashes are a "trick" mode. They work by firing pulses of strobes as the focal plane shutter travels the height of the sensor.

This is good for some things, but it ONLY works with certain camera bodies and and dedicated flashes.

In the studio I use monolight strobes. There's no syncing above 1/250 with them because they don't have the HSS "trick" mode.

Camera that use central shutters, which are a type of leaf shutter that are built into the lens, can sync much faster because of the way a leaf shutter operates at high speeds is completely different than how a focal plane shutter operates.

Honestly, you should study up on your technology before you go running your mouth because you have pretty much NO IDEA about photography when it comes to practical knowledge.

2 upvotes
attomole
By attomole (6 months ago)

Wonder how it compares to SIgma 1.4 DG on a D800, anyone done the math!
;-)

6 upvotes
Suave
By Suave (6 months ago)

The math suggests that it is about 5 times better.

4 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

does anyone know who makes it? Sigma?

3 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

Leica makes it in their German factory. This isn't in dispute.

Years ago Leica made some M lenses in Canada.

Sigma has nothing to do with making this lens, or M lenses.

6 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

sorry about that.

it may be of better quality if designed and made by Sigma.

2 upvotes
HowaboutRAW
By HowaboutRAW (6 months ago)

y-

I realize you bounce in and out of these comments just being contrary for fun. But Sigma lenses are no match for Leicas lens’ optical quality, nor are Canon or Nikon lenses. Not even close.

It’s sort of like saying the Subaru Imprezza is a better sports car than the Veyron. Except here the Veyron also has the endurance of the Impressa.

And yes I know that Sigma is rumored to be the Japanese maker of Japanese Leica lenses–which are plenty good, but the specs come from Leica, and very clearly Leica understands something about optics that all but one of the Japanese lens makers don’t know. No, I’m not thinking of Fuji.

1 upvote
Scorpius1
By Scorpius1 (6 months ago)

I own both.. Leica S is better..

0 upvotes
vroger1
By vroger1 (6 months ago)

...and meanwhile, they still won't repair the M8.

2 upvotes
Waterengineer
By Waterengineer (6 months ago)

We need to read more of your story. I doubt that is correct. Sorry.

0 upvotes
tinzi1
By tinzi1 (6 months ago)

Rich people, pay up!

0 upvotes
Ralf Ronander
By Ralf Ronander (6 months ago)

Price aside, it´s a beautiful lens.
Looks almost like a Sigma :)

8 upvotes
cruz031
By cruz031 (6 months ago)

45mm f/2.8 for more than 5000 pounds? Nice try Leica, but at Olympus, one can get 45mm f/1.8 lens for a lot less money! 350$ to be precise.... That's almost 20 times cheaper! I don't see why would anyone be interested in this (overpriced) 36mm f/2.2 (in the terms of DOF, not the Speed!) full frame equivalent lens......

2 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

in the terms of everything photographic,
including DOF and speed and whatever anyone can name.

0 upvotes
Revenant
By Revenant (6 months ago)

Why would an owner of an S system camera be interested in a m4/3 lens? Completely pointless comparison.

21 upvotes
Jude McDowell
By Jude McDowell (6 months ago)

@Revenant

+1

(and I'm a 4/3 & m4/3 user!)

2 upvotes
Richard Murdey
By Richard Murdey (6 months ago)

@Revenant

Well, you could get a m43 camera to go with that Olympus lens for about the same price as a replacement lens cap for this Leica lens.

But who am I kidding? No one needs more than an iphone these days. Right? Right?

0 upvotes
Tom_A
By Tom_A (6 months ago)

This is a medium format lens, you cannot even begin to compare the amount of glass in it and the associated manufacturing complexity with that of a tiny 4x3 lens.
Go check the prices of other medium format lenses.
This lens and camera is for people who make their income with it, not for taking pictures of ducks floating in the pond.

2 upvotes
AndreaV
By AndreaV (6 months ago)

@cruz031
Did you noticed that this is a medium format lens? That it needs to cover a sensor that is 45x30mm and not the m4/3 sensor of 17x13mm?
By the way, to keep on with your comparison, why should you pay 350$ for your 45mm/1.8 when you can get a 50mm/1.8 for FF at about 100$ (from Canon)? Your lens sounds now awfully overpriced! Maybe comparing just focal length and maximum aperture is a bit too simplistic?

0 upvotes
Scorpius1
By Scorpius1 (6 months ago)

Ridiculous comparison...

0 upvotes
AbrasiveReducer
By AbrasiveReducer (6 months ago)

Because they can get it. For everyone else, there's Lens Rentals.

0 upvotes
phonetech
By phonetech (6 months ago)

Gentlemen. Once upon a time there was this phase : Envy/Jealous/Hate. Today world got that word ENVY disappear.I started from b/w film to date trying almost all digital. Finally settle with only All Leica.Regardless of the price, I owned it because I like it and that's all.Self satisfaction and appreciation is more than the money it's take.Even it's cost a 100k, then do a simple maths.With the shutter bearing 100,000 shots- it's cost a dollar a click.
Make life simple, everyone got their own choice.Like cars, if you own a Toyota (that's what u can afford) then u tell everyone it's the best car and u will defend all comments. If u own a Ferrari then the story goes again. Most of the time I find ppl making big issue and eventually find out that they owned nothing.Even when choosing your lifetime partner, we make our own choice. Some like it fat, some like its skinny.

0 upvotes
RStyga
By RStyga (6 months ago)

If Leica is slowly degrading in quality it surely is not in pricing.

3 upvotes
gefrorenezeit
By gefrorenezeit (6 months ago)

Aha. Where do you see this within the S system? Have you ever used one? Or do you just dislike the price...

12 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

there should be better places for charity donation than Leica.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 9 minutes after posting
6 upvotes
Loreno Heer
By Loreno Heer (6 months ago)

quality is certainly not degrading in the S system. it may not be increasing as fast as the prices though...

1 upvote
Photomonkey
By Photomonkey (6 months ago)

Where is it written that high quality, low volume items have to be cheap?
Leica prices have always been expensive. When I owned an M-4 in the seventies a new lens was a month's pay. No different today.

The big difference was the absence of the internet where one could hear all the wailing of people who make it their mission to direct their manufactured outrage at a company they are not forced to buy from.

Comment edited 6 minutes after posting
7 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

> quality is certainly not degrading in the S system

is there any test on the net to show it can match that of Nikon? (Canon may not be able to qualify for resolution challenged sensors, nor Nokia 1020 for none interchangeable lens).

0 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@Photomonkey

"When [you] owned an M-4 in the seventies a new lens was a month's pay."

So it was expensive but obtainable; now the situation is very different because a Leica lens, a good one, costs WAAAY more than a month's pay and for very many people the system is unobtainable.

0 upvotes
kodachromeguy
By kodachromeguy (6 months ago)

@Plevy, £5000 for a lens is approximately the monthly salary for a mid-career professional in the United States. So the cost of a Leica lens is about the same as it was decades ago if you account for inflation.

0 upvotes
RStyga
By RStyga (6 months ago)

I had no doubt, the moment I posted this, that I would get attacked. If you, Leica owner, spent a provocative amount of money to obtain a Leica lens/body it does not automatically mean it is justifiable. The S system is -no doubt- a high image quality system but this is not surprising; any camera manufacturer can produce an excellent product if priced as much. The question is: what about the target group? Who is it, how wide is it, is it worth expanding it, what are the implications to the brand name, and whether there is a valid photographic legacy for Leica to be proud of?

If you ask me, I'd say that Leica has produced excellent photographic tools in the past, and continues more-or-less in the present, but the company's brand management and technological philosophy, which has made owners proud, is worrying. Remember Sigma SD1's initial price? Have you ever heard of Pentax 645D system? How many professionals would prefer Leica S to Pentax 645D unless they are sponsored or well-off?

Comment edited 1 minute after posting
2 upvotes
plevyadophy
By plevyadophy (6 months ago)

@kodachromeguy

Well, "mid-career professional" means very well off and/or earning a salary in the higher percentile of the population; meaning it's in real terms unobtainable, like I said, by a great many people (even people who would be willing to save hard to buy such gear).

Leica has become an elitist brand rather than merely an expensive high quality brand.

0 upvotes
RStyga
By RStyga (6 months ago)

And solely great lenses do not suffice. The S2 reaches up to ISO 1250 but in order to maintain very high IQ reviewers suggest using ISO 640 at most. Excuse me? A (full weather-sealed) 645D will take you up to ISO 1600 with no real IQ degradation. Alternative, if one needs superb base ISO IQ and can live with a choice of only three FLs and APS-C DoF then one can obtain all three Sigma DP Merrills in the price of less than one Leica lens! I mean, this is ludicrous...

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 4 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Jogger
By Jogger (6 months ago)

Manual focus only, right???

0 upvotes
Andy Westlake
By Andy Westlake (6 months ago)

No, the S system is autofocus

10 upvotes
RobertSigmund
By RobertSigmund (6 months ago)

Only 5500 pounds for a 45mm F 2,8 lens, how cheap!

0 upvotes
AndreaV
By AndreaV (6 months ago)

Well... if you look the cost of the Leica M lenses and you consider that this is a medium format lens, it doesn't look that expensive! :)

2 upvotes
Hobbit13
By Hobbit13 (6 months ago)

There's absolutely no point in producing mediocre medium-format lenses. This lens will probably be quite spectacular, and aimed at a very small target group.

Comment edited 20 seconds after posting
14 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

the factor is 0.8, so 36mm f/2.24 equiv.
a slower lens than 35mm f/2 Summicron.
will it be better than 35/1.4 stopped down to f/2.2 on D800?

Comment edited 8 minutes after posting
1 upvote
Photomonkey
By Photomonkey (6 months ago)

Dear Yabokkie, The world is not reducible to your specious comparisons. If MF was so comparable to other formats it would not exist. In fact it seems it would be worth your time to rent a MF kit and find out what the excitement is about. You may also learn a few things that cannot be inferred by numbers.

11 upvotes
yabokkie
By yabokkie (6 months ago)

> what the excitement is about

excitement for those who don't have a clue of photography.

4 upvotes
JDThomas
By JDThomas (6 months ago)

Someone here definitely "don't have a clue of photography".

10 upvotes
Tom_A
By Tom_A (6 months ago)

Indeed it is very obvious that yabokkie wouldn't recognise a medium format camera if it fell on him.

3 upvotes
DanielFjall
By DanielFjall (6 months ago)

Dang. That's pricey alright!

0 upvotes
Total comments: 152