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Kenko Tokina enters cine lens market with 16-28mm T3.0 wide zoom

Sep 23, 2013 at 10:13:44 GMT

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The ever-increasing video capability of digital SLRs has seen manufacturers such as Canon, Samyang and Zeiss make video-optimised versions of their conventional lenses, and now Kenko Tokina is getting in on the act. The Tokina 16-28mm T3.0 is a manual focus version of the AT-X 16-28mm f/2.8 Pro FX wideangle zoom, with a redesigned barrel that features the usual refinements for video work, including geared focus, zoom and aperture rings, and scales designed to be read from the side of the camera. It'll be made in Canon EF and Arri PL mounts, with a suggested retail price of ¥580,000 - almost 5 times that of the lens it's based on.

The Tokina 16-28mm T3.0 cine lens is based on the company's AT-X 16-28mm f2.8 Pro FX for full frame SLRs

Click here for more details, including full specs, on Kenko Tokina's website

LENS NEWS TOKINA VIDEO-LENS

Tokina AT-X 16-28mm f/2.8 Pro FX

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Tokina AT-X Pro FX 16-28mm f/2.8 For Canon	$699.00
Tokina AT-X 16-28mm f/2.8 Pro FX Lens for Nikon	$699.00
Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 AT-X116 Pro DX II Digital Zoom Lens (for Canon EOS Cameras)	$570.95
Tokina AF 12-24mm f/4 AT-X 124 Pro DX II Lens - Canon Mount	$399.99

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Comments

Total comments: 48

The obvious question is: Why?

Is this going to be optically better than the other cine lenses already on sale? Very unlikely.

Much better built? No.

Is it much cheaper than the other cine lenses? Clearly not.

Will it have a bigger ecosystem of lenses with matched "feel"? Again, that's almost undoubtedly a "no".

What advantages does this bring to the market? Is there even one thing that's significantly better than the competition? If they do have something, they need to inform marketing about it - because I'm not seeing it!

This looks very much like a hopelessly late, desperate leap to jump onto a really shiny bandwagon that was last seen rolling past a few months ago...

I'd wait for these in the sales bin. Along with the battered remnants of Kenko/Tokina in due course...

4 upvotes

How much is this going to be in real money?

0 upvotes

I was wondering exactly this, especially when I saw the probable retail price.

0 upvotes

@ Francis, current rates suggest roughly: £3671 or $5874USD at launch. How much that'll drop once they've stopped trolling for the early adopters I don't know. Quite a long way I hope!

@ Jahled: I'm hoping we find out that the price is a misprint...

0 upvotes

For the price, I really hope they coated every single glass of the lens. Coating is expensive so that would make the price worth it.

0 upvotes

This lens has a super limited, i.e. less than 2:1 zooming range, and is basically a manual photi lens. Nobody is (or should be) paying close to 6 grands for it. That price would be nothing short of perverse.

0 upvotes

T and not F stop. Typo, or have I missed something?

0 upvotes

T stop or transmission stops are the relative real world amount of light coming through the lens accounting for absorption by the lens elements. The lens itself is the 16-28mm f/2.8 but in reality only the equivalent of f/3 light comes through. This is important for cinematography as maintaining a consistent exposure is crucial.

3 upvotes

Ah, thanks. Was just going to reply to myself after I found this in wiki:

"T-stops are often used in cinematography, where many images are seen in rapid succession and even small changes in exposure will be noticeable."

So in T stops the transmission has been measured accurately and not just aperture size so lenses can be swapped with confidence without inadvertently affecting exposure.

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 5 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

Correct - The issue really comes forward when matching two different lenses together with the same exposure within the same lighting situation. Using T-stops you can calculate equivalent exposures and trust that you are getting what is expected. Using f-stops can lead to inconsistencies between angles that are jarring.

Something else to consider is the color rendition of a lens. Most cinematographers stick to the same brand of lenses for an entire film to ensure consistent color rendition to further ensure consistency between shots.

This is why the Zeiss CP.2 and the Schneider Cine-Xenar sets are popular. You get a full set of cinema lenses with consistent color renditions, already geared for interfacing with follow focus, and pre-calculated T-stops.

Of course these lenses are huge and expensive as hell...

Comment edited 2 times, last edit 58 seconds after posting

0 upvotes

It's an F/2.8 with 87% light transmittance, which translates to a T3.0.

Comment edited 12 seconds after posting

1 upvote

My Samyang cine lens works great and it's only $50 more than the photo version.

0 upvotes

I just visited Tokina's website to see what other lenses they have in the lineup ... quite surprised to see that they only produce a few wide angle zooms and one macro lens nowadays.

0 upvotes

Now that everyone with DSLR thinks they're a cinematographer I just wish more of them would learn how to shoot. A couple of days ago I watched a full-length documentary on Sky Arts predominantly featuring interviews and almost every single shot was focused on the background - well behind the subject. I wish that I could say that this is unusual. We used to call this stuff "wobblyvision". Still, given the atrocious ergonomics and the Heath Robinson rigs (for those of a certain age) I guess we shouldn't expect too much.
5X the price! Wunnerful!
"Never give a sucker an even break"
W.C. Fields

1 upvote

no tokina for pentax??

0 upvotes

The Pentax 12-24 mm f/4 lens is a Tokina OEM design. But Tokina itself has no K mount in the current line out. The newer and outstanding 11-16 mm however has not been adopted by Pentax. I am waiting for that one since years.

0 upvotes

you don't seriously want to film with a Pentax. It's cool that you can but implementation is crappy.

0 upvotes

i forget who makes it. but, there is a company in the US that buys Nikon 14-24/2.8 lenses and completely rehouses them in a cine body.

1 upvote

I'll bet those are cheap.

1 upvote

maybe that's the one?

http://www.abelcine.com/store/Focus-Optics-Ruby-14-24mm-T2.8-Zoom/#tabs

0 upvotes

I'm guessing Tokina's extra-high CA's are included free of charge here?

1 upvote

They could become irrelevant. A 2 pixel CA at 16 MP APS-C should be something like 0.3 pixel on HD resolution full screen :-)

0 upvotes

Even on 24 mpix sensor it will be more than 0.5 pix when downscaled to 1080p.

0 upvotes

It's the same lens so you can expect it to operate the same way. Of course with modern processing CA is not really much of an issue unless you enjoy staring at the corners of an image closely.

Comment edited 2 minutes after posting

0 upvotes

Removing CA in video will be a chore.

0 upvotes

¥580,000

(slow intake of breath, backs away carefully)

0 upvotes

It's paying for the small production run, extra mechanics for the stopless aperture, and the added external teeth for interfacing with follow focus.

0 upvotes

I'm not making a value judgement, and I know cine gear is expensive.

Sticker shock, pure and simple.

1 upvote

They may have reworked some of the mechanisms to provide for parfocal zooming. That would certainly account for an increased price.

0 upvotes

based on the optical diagram, they are the same.

0 upvotes

According that lens rentals blog post that Andy W linked to the cine version of lenses are more expensive because they're built to considerably better tolerances than regular consumer lenses

0 upvotes

C'mon. They are more expensive because they can charge more.
And, ALL lenses can resolve 4K ...

3 upvotes

Tighter tolerances for cine lenses should be irrelevant due to the significantly lower resolution.

More relevant is the complete different mechanical design. For once to offer the cine form factor of larger housing plus gears. Plus a different focal mechanism to avoid breathing when focusing and breathing when zooming. This is lots of design engineering, production engineering and development of test equipment to do manufacturing testing which need to be paid for by a relatively small sales qty. Thus the steep price increase.

1 upvote

I would be curious if they have done anything to help the lens be a true parfocal lens. As you zoom the point of focus will invariably shift - it seems like since it uses the same optical design that they assume this just isn't an issue for wide angle.

0 upvotes

For 5 times the price one would hope that they improve on their dire multi-coatings. Cine means atmosphere and atmosphere requires plenty of backlighting.

0 upvotes

Where the heck is Tokina's 70-200 f4??

It was announced over a year ago.

1 upvote

Good question!

0 upvotes

Exactly! I have wondered this for a while. Come on Tokina - stop making cine lenses and produce lenses you have shown for 2 years at photo shows! Maybe now that Nikon has it's own 70-200 f/4 they decided there isn't a large enough market for it. But if the Nikon version is overpriced, and I know Tokina could do better.

0 upvotes

Tokina is owned by Hoya and Hoya sucks. (that was an explanation).

0 upvotes

Seriously? The 16-28mm is a great lens, but 5 TIMES the price?! Samyang's cine versions are something like $50 more, if that. I suppose this will still be cheaper than the competition though.

2 upvotes

Samyang is very much the exception rather than the rule here. Roger Cicala's recent blog post There is No Perfect Lens makes an interesting case for why movie lenses tend to be substantially more expensive than the stills version of the same optical design.

7 upvotes

Actually this somewhat older blog post makes a better one: http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2011/06/photo-lenses-for-video-there-is-no-free-lunch

1 upvote

I don't think they will make substantial better quality control on this lens - certainly not the way Roger suggests that cinema lenses need to be highly calibrated in his blog. The optical specs are the same as the normal lens, it's really just the barrel which is different. I think they look at it as a niche product, selling few copies to pros that can afford it.

1 upvote

@photonius

Just because the optical layout is the same doesn't mean the cine version isn't built to better tolerances.

3 upvotes

The differences are almost entirely mechanical, considering the largest cost in optical designs are the optics themselves the Samyang scenario 'should' be the rule. That said, the far more limited production runs will increase costs per unit substantially.

0 upvotes

@ abortabort: The mechanical design of cine lenses is unfortunately complex and so is their manufacturing, assembling and testing. Combine with with small production qty to amortize the high development cost and then it makes sense.

0 upvotes

The biggest cost in optical designs is the labor--to design and make the components, assemble, test, adjust and if necessary, discard. I had four of the Samyang 14mm lenses. Each was different and three were ok but I doubt that's the sort of consistency Tokina is aiming for in this market.

0 upvotes

Small production run, extra mechanics for a stopless aperture, extra teeth for interfacing with follow focus.

Also keep in mind that Samyang lenses already have production runs without focus motors. All they have to do is remove the stepping teeth from their apertures and external mechanics updates.

Putting it another way for Samyang it's just a slight shift in their existing production line. For Tokina this is a major retooling.

0 upvotes

Total comments: 48

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Lens reviews update: DxOMark data for Nikon-fit full frame wideangles Jun 18, 2013	Tokina announces 16-28mm F2.8 lens for Canon & Nikon Jul 5, 2010	Tokina offers US pricing for AT-X 12-28mm F4 Pro DX lens Jun 6, 2013	Tokina to ship AT-X 12-28 F4 PRO DX lens for Nikon from April 2013 Mar 15, 2013

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